to ask if you agree with the teacher's strike upcoming

[AuntiePickleBottom]

i am on the fence about it, due to not understanding pensions.

[twinklypearls]

If I just compare people with my particular degree I suspect I would end up worse off. Most went into the city.

[BoattoBolivia]

goblinchild I would like to thank all of you who worked to rule in the 80s. It shocks me how many young teachers don't realise how hard you fought for the right to a lunch break and will happily give it up when management ask. It did affect my a levels, but I remember understanding it at the time and being sympathetic.

[trixymalixy]

I agree, I don't want anyone to lose out, I want fair pensions for all, but the fact is we can't afford it. There are plenty of things the government pay out for that I would prefer not to, but if they didn't I'd prefer the money to go to improve schools or hospitals not into the pockets of private individuals.

[sausagesandmarmelade]

Thanks Goblin for that insight...

Whatever it takes I think.

Apathy unfortunately does not effect change....
If nothing else, striking and working to rule show the Government the strength of feeling.

I support the teachers...I think they do an admirable (often thankless) job...

[goinnowhere]

I think any teacher who says childcare is not easier in the holidays would be a liar! What Mila Mae said earlier was that teachers never pay for childcare. PLainly that is silly. I've always paid, but not used. The hoilday is a huge bonus!

[trixymalixy]

As do the rest of the working population. But we get 5 weeks holiday a year, school holidays are 14 weeks ( I think), it's very stressful for parents trying to cover that holiday. I know teachers don't get all that holiday, I know my SIL works a lot in her holidays, but she admits it can be a lot more flexible, she can do a lot a home or in the evenings so doesn't need childcare during the day or takes the kids into school with her. I know she does arrange at least a full weeks holiday club, but it is definitely easier for teachers with school age kids.

[sausagesandmarmelade]

On course goinnowhere....these things do have an impact on businesses.
It's inevitable...

Was just reading yesterday how company's like Mobens (kitchen designers) are going to the wall.

There's less consumer confidence, less spending....and things are set to get worse (much worse) with these changes. So we will all be affected in the long run.

[Goblinchild]

'goblin What would working to rule involve...and why would it have a greater impact on parents?'

We did it in the 80s instead of striking. Teachers did exactly what they were contracted to do and nothing more. We planned, taught, marked and assessed. We were arguing for the right to have a lunchbreak. Children were sent home for lunch because there was lack of supervision.
No extra curricular, no clubs, lost property became a sentient lifeform in a corner of the playground. No laces, ties, buttons, informal parent meetings, productions, assemblies, training courses other than in school time, lots of stuff that we did unrecognised as part of the job.
Left school on the dot. Arrived on the dot.
Huge number of tiny impacts every day for weeks.
I have a lunchbreak, we have MDS.

[goinnowhere]

It's not fair Trixy. There are lots of things that are sadly not fair. I don't think it is fair that care workers receive such awful wages, while some others in offices get perks and high pay. Surely the least we can expect is for people who work for 45 years in any job to have few years of retirement. I am not convinced that it would take an increase in your taxes to fund public worker pensions though. I am sure there are other things we are paying for that I would like not to.
My DH has also had his pension slashed (public). With the increases for both of us, the below inflation rises we have had for years, and now freeze, as well as wanting to save more for DC future, we will probably look to cut back on about £250 per month from our current spending. We will manage, just. Local businesses may feel the effect too though.

[Feenie]

Indeed, rainbow, it was a stupid thing to say - I pay a sodding fortune in childcare, and it was treble that before ds went into Reception. Stems from the idiotic myth that teachers work 9 - 3.30p.m., buit even would require childcare costs!

[trixymalixy]

And when it comes to hysterics, I do feel slightly hysterical with worry about how we will survive in retirement. I can't afford the extra 24% of my salary needed to give me any hope of a reasonable retirement, so forgive me if I'm not keen to pay more in taxes to maintain the standard of living gap in retirement between public and private sector workers.

[goinnowhere]

Of course it depends on your degree. That is what I am saying, the people doing the same degree as myself, and other similar (fairly traditional) degrees generally earn more than I do. So comparing like with like...As I said I am not complaining. I'd rather do my job. But to say I am paid more than the average similar graduate is not true in my experience. I am the only one who has never had a bonus either. Maybe I know too many well off people?

[sausagesandmarmelade]

goblin What would working to rule involve...and why would it have a greater impact on parents?

[rainbowinthesky]

Hurray, MilaeMae said I dont need to pay for childcare!!!

Does that mean I can get rid of my childminder and breakfast club?
You know, the ones where dd starts between 7.30 and 8 and then goes to childminder till 6 each night. Oh, and I dont have to pay my childminder during the holidays either anymore even though I dont need to use her as I still have to pay her???


Oh, wait....

[trixymalixy]

Absolutely, if I was a teacher I would be striking, everyone has the right to strike.

It won't achieve anything as the government has the support of the majority of the population who are not public sector workers.

The problem with the unions using the threat of striking too lightly in the past has led to the misperception.

[mrsbiscuits]

I don't think this particular strike is justified but that is not my issue. The right to strike in past decades has meant something. Marching and protesting achieved great things, but I don't think it actually works anymore. Whether or not teachers get a better deal on their pensions or not will not be swayed by whether they work next Thursday or not, if I thought it would I might be behind them. Most of the teachers I know aren't striking, therefore they are not presenting a united front and cannot hope to be successful in winning their argument this way. If every single teacher and support worker walked out then they would have a good negotiating position but as it stands all they will end up doing is pissing off parents who have to take one child to school and keep the other one at home. I think the union bosses are dinosaurs and have had there day and are leading there members into a no win nightmare.

[Goblinchild]

I'd rather work to rule. That has a much greater impact on parents.

[sausagesandmarmelade]

I wholeheartedly support the teachers...

No-one strikes lightly. They lose a day's pay after all...so must feel strongly enough about their cause.

[Goblinchild]

It is not illegal to protest or strike in this country for the majority of workers. Therefore I am entitled to object to changes in my working conditions, or my pension or the expectations of my job if I choose to.
I choose to.
Despite the hysterics, teachers have not been on strike for decades, I am happy with my pay but it is not exceptionally high.
So the accusations on those grounds are built on misconceptions, why are they still being thrown?

[trixymalixy]

But surely that depends on the degree you did? e.g. If you did a law degree but chose to follow a different path to your degree, it's hardly reasonable to compare yourself to people who then followed careers in corporate law.

[trixymalixy]

Alright threatening to strike over pay deals that private sector workers would jump at.

[goinnowhere]

I can compare myself to the people who left my university with a similar degree and I earn less than every single one of them , bar the librarian.

I agree, right down to the librarian. Not just my university, but all my friends and relatives at all universities. We all have similar A levels and degrees. Just made different choices. I am not complaining, as I have never been motivated by high wages, and think my wage is just fine. Just stating the fact, that hen comparing those of same age and educational levels, I am at the low end of wages. Higher than national average certainly, but peers, no.

[goinnowhere]

I have to argue with "constant striking". Really? When? I have taught for nearly 20 years and never once been on strike, nor has school ever been closed for a strike. Transport workers "constantly strike"

[AwesomePan]

Quattro quotes the Torygraph, including quotes from the Ch.oComm bloke alleging public sector pay has "exploded out of all control" along with a bunch of the usual right-wing suspect organisations. Not the best convincing post.

[Quattrocento]

Doris - surprised you haven't heard about it to be honest - this is the first headline from a quick google - but I can find and post the original research if you like

not that I usually read the Telegraph, you understand