Struggling at the moment

[YouAreMyRain]

This will be long so I apologise. (I have name changed for this, if anyone recognises me, I would prefer not to be "outed" or linked to my usual nn.)

I have 2 Adopted DDs, they are half siblings. DD1 came home at 2.4 and DD1 came home 14 months later at 1.7

DD1 was placed 5yrs ago and is now 7yo. Her behaviour has always been challenging, she is very anxious and aggressive. Very insecure emotionally, very low self esteem.

I separated from my H 16 months ago, he was not coping well with fatherhood, his behaviours were abusive and SS were involved after one incident.

Since then I have been a single parent. A couple of months after STBXH moved out, I was suddenly hospitalised with a critical illness for 10 days. This separation was traumatic for DDs, esp DD1 who thought that I had died, despite being reassured to the contrary. STBXH refused to bring them to visit me in hospital, which didn't help.

Seven months ago DD1's behaviour escalated, I got her referred to CAMHS, before we were seen, it got to the point where I found her trying to jump out of an upstairs window to kill herself because she had people in her head telling her that she was stupid.

We got seen urgently and they are currently still involved. They decided that because her issues are connected to attachment and loss, that establishing a therapeutic relationship with her that then came to an end, would be upsetting and counter productive. So I have regular meetings with a CAMHS psychotherapist who has met her once, so that her issues can be worked with through her primary attachment with me.

The problem is that there seems very little improvement in her behaviour. She is very defiant, rude, violent, dishonest, angry etc. She still hates herself and wants to kill herself. She "knows" that I don't love her and she says that she wants to kill me, her sister etc

According to experts/professionals, I am doing everything right and handling her really well and they are very impressed with the therapeutic parenting that I am doing and how I am using "PACE" etc.

But it's so hard.

She is also soiling herself repeatedly, including at the dinner table.

Basically it feels like parenting her is a five person job but there is only me doing it. I just give and give and give and give and she constantly kicks me in the teeth. I don't blame her, I know she can't help it but I am exhausted with it all.

The status quo is shit and just maintaining that everyday is totally draining. I feel completely burnt out. Last night, for the first time, I felt like its all too much for me and that the placement may breakdown.

Post-adoption support have been useless. They offered me a handful of visits with a random SW. I asked for the SW who worked with us for 3yrs and who knows us inside out but that's not an option. I can't see how a strange SW visiting a few times will help at all, whenever I ring for advice they tell me to ask CAMHS what to do, CAMHS tell me to ask post adoption support.

I am currently pregnant with my new partner (we don't live together) after 12 yrs of infertility with my STBXH. I know that this has unsettled her but it feels like it is only going to get worse when the baby is born.

She say that she knows I will love the baby more than her and she wants to kill the baby etc, I don't react or take any of this at face value because I know that she is traumatised and hurting.

I don't want this placement to break down but I have nothing left to give

[Lilka]

I'm so sorry

I am thinking of you. SS had better get their arses in gear and actually do something helpful. You don't deserve this

[ByTheSea]

I really hope you get some solid support soon. It just sounds unsustainable. Sometimes decisions have to be made to safeguard the whole family. This is not your fault. One of the things we were told at Family Futures (we managed to get funding for assessments but not therapy) was the 'Traumatised people traumatise others.' You need to try to protect your family (and yourself). Thinking of you...

[Italiangreyhound]

Rain so very sorry. Please keep yourself safe. I am so sorry for you and your family. Hope social services will act. I hope you are keeping a record of every person who fobs you off, make sure they know you know who they are and if the worst comes to the worst (whatever that may be) you will be holding people responsible. Don't mean to sound alarmist. I really hope it wil not come to the worst but start telling them what you will do if it does. (Just my humble opinion.) Thinking of you.

[YouAreMyRain]

I just don't know what to do. I haven't talked to her about the attack yet. I am too upset and I don't know where to start or what to say. How do I make it clear that its totally unacceptable? What sort of consequence would be appropriate? My mind is a mess.

CAMHS have said I'm suffering from secondary trauma. I'm on ADs. What do I do?

If I don't address it with her she will do it again or do worse but I can't think what to say or do

[Piffyonarock]

I'm so sorry this has happened, none of you deserve this. Are you definiately OK physically, just bruising? My kids both physically attack me fairly regularly (they are smaller than yours still) and it really does make you feel awful emotionally.

As her behaviour is caused by her issues I don't suppose consequence is going to make her stop just like that, so it is probably not too important what the consequence is, as long as there is one for the purpose of reasserting who the parent is. What would you usually do for a consequence?

If you can catch her in a calm enough state where you think she'll be receptive to talking maybe start with telling how you are upset and hurting, show her the bruise. Explain how her attacking you has made you feel and ask her how she felt when it happened. You said she keeps it together at school, could you talk to her about how she does that and that she needs to develop those skills at home too? I don't know if it would make a difference as you all obviously need professional help and fast, but it keeps the lines of communication open.

Thinking of you, I hope SS come through for you.

[Italiangreyhound]

Hi Rain as usual nothing concrete to offer but just words of sympathy, but I guess you are sick as a pig of those kinds of sympathy. I know it sounds extreme but could you get your local MP involved? Were you offered help before you adopted and it has not come forward?

Can your ex help?

Could you sue social services if anyone were to get injured when they had done nothing? I don?t mean you are interesting in suing them, I mean I would be threatening them with I will sue you if I or one of the children is injured as a result of your negligence. I expect this type of thing does not go down well so maybe not the best advice but if I were at the end of my tether I am not sure where I would be looking for help! (Please ignore me if I am talking crap!)

I read a bit about the problem from the position in the USA, it's interesting and might just reasure you others are going through this too. Not sure how helpful it is but here is a link.

www.illinoistimes.com/Springfield/article-8964-when-adoption-goes-wrong.html



I hope you are safe now and DD1 is calmer. I have not had the kind of experiences you have had so can't really say but can tell you what happened with my DD. From about 5 to 7 she was very difficult. Not in your DD1 league at all but difficult by 'normal' standards. Getting emotional, crying, trying to scratch me, and being quite aggressive and rude at times. After quite a long time we had some minor help, we met the schools link worker, and I also did a Family SEAL (Social and emotional aspects of learning) parenting course. I could not find the official site but seemed to find this.

webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20081117141643/standards.dfes.gov.uk/primary/publications/banda/seal/


Later I did the Family Links Nurturing Course, which was very helpful.

familylinks.org.uk/

I have also found the book 'How to talk so children will listen and listen so children will talk' very helpful.

www.amazon.co.uk/How-Talk-Kids-Will-Listen/dp/1848123094/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1375024287&sr=8-1&keywords=how%20to%20talk%20so%20kids%20listen&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21

I may have told you all this before. I know your child has special extra needs and none of this may help at all. I think I agree with all the advice from others. Piffyonarock said she keeps it together at school, ask her how she does it. My dd is the same, very well behaved when others are around and difficult when she was at home with me, DH or very close family or friends.

She really has gotten better since she hit 8, and seems much calmer now. I wonder if your dd ?s problems will get better with time or whether they will not. If you think they will not then please do say that because social workers might be thinking it will get better but if you are seeing a trend it is getting worse you need to flag that up. You need to be tenacious, which must be exhausting. Can anyone else call and register concerns on your part, with your permission? Your partner, ex, parents etc? If another voice were saying the exact same thing to the exact same people in an official letter or email or call (or all three) would they be forced to act? Have you decided that would help and told them what would help? I think telling them what you want would make it easier for them to provide it.

[Italiangreyhound]

I don't know what you and your DD have talked about with regard to the baby? Obviously she feels threatened by this new baby. You really need a skilled therapist to work with her about these issues, has one been assigned to you yet? If yes, when will they start seeing her, if no, can you kick up a stink about it? Maybe the arrival of her sister signalled the start of problems at home or an escalation of them, maybe she was taken into care when her sister was born or tiny and she fears the same will happen again. I am sure someone much wiser than I knows all about this. Sometimes the arrival of a pregnancy or baby is met with domestic violence or marital breakdown and maybe these are things she fears.

You asked about what to say. I will tell you what I told my daughter when we had really big problems with her behaviour. We had started thinking and talking about adoption and at times I wondered if I could cope with two because DD was being so difficult. I felt bad telling her it but it was true and I feel it is best to share the truth in a child-age-appropriate way. I said if she kept the behaviour up we would not be able to adopt. I also said "Do you think you will wear out my love for you? You will never wear out my love for you but you may wear out my energy."

I couldn't cope with the behaviour and felt I was walking on egg shells with my own child when at any moment she could kick off.

We had big rows if I had accidently recorded over her TV programme or lost a special toy etc. Eventually I decided not to walk on eggs shells any more and any time a problem arose I decided to treat it as a learning opportunity for us both. How would we deal with this problem together?

For you it is much harder as you are probably feeling physically exhausted and also physically vulnerable as well. I would suggest a few things but must add that I am not yet an adopter and anyone else is welcome to come and correct me if I have got anything wrong.....

1. Kick up as much fuss with the authorities as you can now, don't let it get worse, say now if it is getting worse. What is the worst that can happen? Could they take DD1 away if you made a fuss, could they take DD2 away if you made a fuss? How would you cope with that? How would you cope if you did not kick up a fuss and then something else happened?
   
   
2. Get anyone who can to help? You are the most physically vulnerable at the moment and possibly (correct me if wrong) the object of her anger. So being looked after by anyone else who can look after her might give you a break and might help her to see she can survive when looked after by others, especially if they can make it fun and show they appreciate being around her. Who can help? Your ex, your family etc.
   
   
3. Protect yourself physically, make sure someone else is around if you need to confront her about anything, for example if you are going to take about what happened make sure you ex or your partner or someone else is the home with you. Personally I would have something to hand such as a light plastic tray which you can hold in front of your tummy if she tried to hit you in the tummy etc. I am not saying carry a tray with you all day but if something happens and you know she is getting mad and you need to get close to her to remove something from her or to move DD2 out of the way you may wish to have something you can hold in front of your vulnerable tummy. I am sorry if that sounds extreme. We had years of fertility treatment and after treatment I was very protective of my tummy and naturally put my hand in front of it. I even warned DD to be careful of it but as your DD1 has threatened your stomach specifically you cannot really appeal to her to respect it at the same time!
   
   
4. Document everything that is happening both in terms of incidents at home and in terms of requests for help, and present this information to social services with phrases like ?this is escalating? ?this is getting worse? ?I am fearful someone will be hurt? etc.
   
   If anything I have said if unhelpful please, please ignore it.
   
   Thinking of you.

[YouAreMyRain]

Thanks everyone. Because PAS have been useless I have been trying to access support through the school/GP etc DD has been referred to the community paediatrician. By referring myself to general SS I am also trying to access more help/support/therapy.

I contacted my ex and told him about the situation. He has called my parenting into question because she is a lot calmer for him (every other weekend). I pointed out that throughout the adoption training we have been repeatedly told that adopted DC direct their anger and worst behaviour towards the mother because they feel rejected by their BM.

He has suggested that between him (workaholic, previously unacceptable patenting towards both DD, hence "ex") and his emotionally illiterate mother (who lives a three hr drive away) they could do a better job. So he has contacted SS with concerns about the DDs welfare!!? He couldn't give me specific examples of his "concerns" btw.

What a mess

[Lilka]

What a *** thing to do

SS are not going to be remotely interested in vague non-specific concerns. They are concerned with people reporting abuse and neglect, not time-wasters whining that 'I think my ex is a bad parent because our child behaves worse around her than me' Of course you're right, you being the mum and primary caregiver who is there for her 24/7, her behaviours and anxieties are going to be mostly directed at you. If he became the primary caregiver he'd slowly find her behaviours around him getting worse and worse.

I hope the community paed and school provide some helpful support for you

[Italiangreyhound]

Rain what an arse your ex is! Glad you have a new partner, how is he coping with all this? How is your other DD coping? How is DD1 a moment? Don't reply if you don't want to.

Thinking of you.

[YouAreMyRain]

Thanks everyone. I rang Camhs and PAS earlier. After the handwringing the other day, the SW from PAS did actually speak to her line manager and DD1 is going to get some play/filial therapy, plus they are going to fund some childminding as a form of respite for me .

Apparently this was agreed on Friday but they wanted to tell Camhs before telling me. If I had known this on sat, I may not have felt the need to ring the EDT just yet.

Camhs are going to meet with myself and the play therapist because it makes more sense for the play therapist to do all the direct work with DD. That's good because I don't want too many different adults involved with her.

I was planning on contacting my MP but I will hold off for a bit.

Thanks for all your input, I can't reply in too much detail because I'm on my phone, you are all keeping me going at the moment and I am reading all responses.

[aladdinsane]

We got play and filial therapy for our DD who is very challenging. It relies on the child being able to play out their issues and is not great
I think a much more specialist service is needed- depending on where you live Family Futures, Chrysalis, Renee Marks, Post Adoption Center or GOSH specialist service. I have been trying to put pressure on my LA to fund and have been using MP for extra clout
I have pm'd you

[Italiangreyhound]

Rain good news that some things are going a tiny bit better. Thinking of you. Praying for help for you. Hope things will make a turn for better but even if they do keep the pressure up (in my humble opinion) for the results you want, the care or respite or whatever.

[Piffyonarock]

Glad to hear that some support is coming through for you .

Your ex is a great help isn't he?! Just what you need!

Keep your chin up, you're doing a great job.

[YouAreMyRain]

Thanks everyone, can't access my PMs at the moment as I'm on my phone.

DP is so lovely. The other day I said to him that if DD1s behaviour ever gets too much for him I would understand if he was unable to continue the relationship with me. He was shocked and told me not to be so silly and that she is just a child.

Every day this holiday he has got up, made breakfast for three children, brought me tea/toast in bed. Shooed the kids away so I can have a lie in, then taken the kids to the park/beach so I can have a rest. He has cooked dinner and done the washing up too.

I am soooo lucky

[morethanpotatoprints]

I think you are a wonderful person who has had to deal with so much in such a short space of time.
I have no words of wisdom for you but had to reply as I know I will be thinking about your story for some time.
Please look after yourself, I know its easier said than done.
You need to seek more support for this child, it must be so hard to cope with all this. You are amazing, strong and inspirational.

[Italiangreyhound]

Rain he sounds lovely your DP. Maybe there is just a touch of jeaoulsy in your ex's response. Your marriage breaks down and you end up with a lovely new DP and pregnant. Maybe he feels hurt etc. It is not an excuse for a cruel and thoughtless act but it may have contributed. Maybe getting him on side would help in the future. He may well end up meeting someone else and may end up with new kids too, through whatever means, and so maybe as time goes on he will soften a little. I don;t know all the details of your break up etc, rightly so! So please do excuse me if I am speaking out of turn. Although you must be angry by his actions i think you can turn them to your DD's advantage by, as Maryz says 'Use the fact that he has contacted SS to make them support you.'

Thinking of you.

[Italiangreyhound]

Sorry by new I mean additional not new as in instead of, apologies, that sounded crass! I mean it is in your Ex's interests as well as yours, and most vitally the children's interests, to have harmony where you can!

[anna891]

Wanted to say you are doing a great job.
Attachment problems are hard to deal with which in IMO means babies should be adopted A.S.A.P. In reality it can take years to finalize an adoption.
Your daughter is suffering l remember feeling suicidal as a young child (narcissistic parents)
You need more help with this.
You are pregnant now, and need to look after yourself. If the placement breaks down it will be very sad, but you can only do your best.

[Piffyonarock]

Good on your DP! Get him moved in (just joking).

Hope your DDs are enjoying their hols and settling down a bit. Been world war three here since school broke up if it's any consolation.

Enjoy those lie ins while you can xx

[Lilka]

Your DP sounds brilliant :)

Breakfast in bed sounds brilliant as well

Really hope this week is better for you all than last week x

[lots33]

Hi rain,

It sounds really tough, I am so sorry.

It sounds like you are doing an amazing job and I so hope you receive the specialist support you and your daughter need.

I work in the field and firstly, I would agree that you are experiencing secondary trauma. Secondly, I would really push....via writing/complaints etc your LA to take on responsibility for specialist support.....it will be far cheaper for them then the real possibility of a long tem foster placement for a child who has had an adoption breakdown......even if it's not a possibility because I know how committed you are......it is an argument your social worker should use.

I would recommend Kate cairns....google her. She's an adoptive parent/sw/ attachment expert. She's written books, delivers training and works with families and LA's. I know you can't afford it.....but your LA can.

And keep posting too.

Will be thinking of you.

[Italiangreyhound]

Rain you are a great mum. We are thinking of you.