Anyone else scared of what the future holds for this country?

[AdamRyan]

Trigger warning I guess for news avoiders.

I've been feeling very uneasy since the Brexit vote but it's now tipped into outright terror that a huge catastrophe is coming and I can't see how we can avoid it! Hopefully people can make me feel better....

So:
*energy bills going up and government borrowing obscene amounts of money to cap it

• also paying for the proxy war on Russia
  
• also still paying off covid costs
  
• companies struggling as not enough staff, lots appear to be on the bare bones and I suspect we'll see bankruptcies soon as they can't meet contractual obligations and have to pay out
  
• No plans for fixing staff shortages
  
• medicine shortages
  
• empty shelves in shops
  
• pound is tanking
  
• everyone striking as staff can't afford cost of living
  
• basic public services (transport, NHS, rubbish, roads etc) unreliable
  
• power insufficient - risk of black and brown outs
  
• inflation going up so interest rates rising too - increasing pressures on households
  
• more people using food banks and more homeless
  
• No trade deal with USA, out of EU so not benefitting from preferential energy deals they are negotiating with e.g. Norway
  
• Then to top it all off, climate change, droughts, storms, flooding getting increasingly more severe
  
  At the same time, despite spending as if there is a magic money tree, the government is cutting taxes primarily on rich people and refusing to publish the maths so we don't know how much their actions are costing!
  
  I'm genuinely fearful for the future of the country as well as the world! Cheer me up please....

[onthefencesitter]

@PipinwasAuntieMabelsdog

@onthefencesitter as someone who lives outside of London and who has lived in Birmingham and now Manchester, fuck the fuck off. There are shitty parts in all cities. London has some truly awful areas.

This was the area around the bullring... I am sorry, I am sure there are nice parts but it is

[PipinwasAuntieMabelsdog]

@onthefencesitter

I live in a nice part of north london and so am insulated from a lot of it. But I was shocked when I went to birmingham, i thought to myself that this looks worse than malaysia (an actual third world country albeit one striving for first world status). And Birmingham is one of our big cities...

The average UK family isn't one that lives in London or the SE though! I suspect many people in the SE or London would be richer than people in Poland; as FT says, as long as you are in top 3% (£84,000 after tax income for two people doesn't actually sound that unattainable), you are on the same level as rich people in Germany or even Norway aka will achieve a first world standard of leaving. I think even top 10% wouldn't be that bad.

Its the bottom 50% who will be living in third world style conditions.

@onthefencesitter as someone who lives outside of London and who has lived in Birmingham and now Manchester, fuck the fuck off. There are shitty parts in all cities. London has some truly awful areas.

[Stainon]

@Amboseli

We'll be retiring so going somewhere in Asia. We love the food, cost of living is a fraction of the UK and it's hot and tropical. The kids probably Australia or New Zealand.

How much money do you need to retire in Asia? If you don't mind me asking. Do you get a residency permit if you have an annual income over a certain amount?

[mathanxiety]

@eucalyptustea

I see you've bought into the idea that the government is serious about chasing down offshore accounts and the tax dodging rich will one day end up paying their fair share, and also the idea that immigrants are a drain on the economy.

[Amboseli]

@Andante57

Amboseli where are you emigrating to?

We'll be retiring so going somewhere in Asia. We love the food, cost of living is a fraction of the UK and it's hot and tropical. The kids probably Australia or New Zealand.

[Andante57]

Amboseli where are you emigrating to?

[Amboseli]

@Trez1510

Other than ThickLizzie and Kwartang, I have yet to see anyone, anywhere, say they are following a sensible course. Everyone - economists, pundits, market men, the woman in the street - are all singing from the same hymn sheet: it's off the scale lunacy.

I think differently, and have stated so upthread. This is all very deliberate. They intend a scorched earth policy (literally via fracking, and financially) so that when Labour win by default at the next election they will take the political flak for the nightmare scenario just about everyone will be in by then and the reality there are no possible routes out of that nightmare.

Part of this is that those who 'Got Brexit Done' have no fucking clue how to actually get Brexit done in respect of the NI Protocol, ensuring food/energy supplies for the population or maintaining any sort of meaningful presence on the world stage.

Five years later, when the current bunch of psychopaths make a triumphant 🙄return, they will spend the next five years, once again, syphoning off as much as they can for their family, friends and flunkies all the while blaming Labour for their actions during the preceding five years.

The UK is fucked and is hurtling towards third world country status with every passing day.

PS I'm usually a cautious optimist but what is playing out in front of our very eyes is, for me, terrifying.

Totally. It is so worrying and I can't see any way through the quagmire any time soon. The Tories are deliberately trashing the country and enriching their friends as they know they've only got 2 years left to fill their boots at our expense. Then labour will have to pick up the mess and will get blamed for not sorting it when it's so dire it will be impossible to sort in one term in government. Brexit alone will drag us down for decades and decades to come.

We're emigrating once the kids have finished their education.

[AdamRyan]

@Crikeyalmighty

@Trez1510 @AdamRyan All I can say is in the midst of all this shit it's heartening to know there are still plenty of reasoned, intelligent people out there who can see through these opportunistic muppets in gvt -

I would be very interested in knowing who the Tory cheerleaders on this site are. I suspect we are talking very well off, houses paid for, lots of use of 'private' and a load of 'I'm all right jacks' who think anyone struggling a bit hasn't worked hard enough, not that they may not have inherited or had illnesses or an accident, or a business that went down the pisser because of Brexit or covid or bankruptcy or a divorce or the various curve balls of life.

I kind of hope they are paid PR as itsjust too depressing otherwise. But unfortunately irl a lot of older conservative voters I know have entrenched views and seem to think this is all fine and how the world should be. Its pretty scary.

[Crikeyalmighty]

@Trez1510 @AdamRyan All I can say is in the midst of all this shit it's heartening to know there are still plenty of reasoned, intelligent people out there who can see through these opportunistic muppets in gvt -

I would be very interested in knowing who the Tory cheerleaders on this site are. I suspect we are talking very well off, houses paid for, lots of use of 'private' and a load of 'I'm all right jacks' who think anyone struggling a bit hasn't worked hard enough, not that they may not have inherited or had illnesses or an accident, or a business that went down the pisser because of Brexit or covid or bankruptcy or a divorce or the various curve balls of life.

[eucalyptustea]

@mathanxiety but until those tax payers are paying their taxes how can it possibly make sense to keep borders so open to people who cost more money than we currently have?

[eucalyptustea]

@rockyg perhaps you'd like to explain how I upskill when I'm on near the minimum wage. Also where do you buy citizenship in another country and how much is this? Got a good idea those schemes aren't ones at people like me.

You acted rather smug about being a dual citizen and yet the vast majority are not dual citizens and therefore cannot leave the country. Just because there are lots in London does not mean this is representative of the U.K. as you implied with your post that it's all so easy to just get up and go to another country. It really isn't.

[MarshaBradyo]

There probably won’t be any money tbf. It’s going to be a tough gig if they get in.

Anyway I recommend listening to the Labour Party conference on Times radio

They have a clear message for their direction and it might cheer people up

[AdamRyan]

@Trez1510

Other than ThickLizzie and Kwartang, I have yet to see anyone, anywhere, say they are following a sensible course. Everyone - economists, pundits, market men, the woman in the street - are all singing from the same hymn sheet: it's off the scale lunacy.

I think differently, and have stated so upthread. This is all very deliberate. They intend a scorched earth policy (literally via fracking, and financially) so that when Labour win by default at the next election they will take the political flak for the nightmare scenario just about everyone will be in by then and the reality there are no possible routes out of that nightmare.

Part of this is that those who 'Got Brexit Done' have no fucking clue how to actually get Brexit done in respect of the NI Protocol, ensuring food/energy supplies for the population or maintaining any sort of meaningful presence on the world stage.

Five years later, when the current bunch of psychopaths make a triumphant 🙄return, they will spend the next five years, once again, syphoning off as much as they can for their family, friends and flunkies all the while blaming Labour for their actions during the preceding five years.

The UK is fucked and is hurtling towards third world country status with every passing day.

PS I'm usually a cautious optimist but what is playing out in front of our very eyes is, for me, terrifying.

This is what I think too
The Conservatives appear motivated by revenge for the "There is no money" letter. (www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/may/09/liam-byrne-apology-letter-there-is-no-money-labour-general-election). When they should be helping the people of the country they run.

It is so depressing

[Trez1510]

Other than ThickLizzie and Kwartang, I have yet to see anyone, anywhere, say they are following a sensible course. Everyone - economists, pundits, market men, the woman in the street - are all singing from the same hymn sheet: it's off the scale lunacy.

I think differently, and have stated so upthread. This is all very deliberate. They intend a scorched earth policy (literally via fracking, and financially) so that when Labour win by default at the next election they will take the political flak for the nightmare scenario just about everyone will be in by then and the reality there are no possible routes out of that nightmare.

Part of this is that those who 'Got Brexit Done' have no fucking clue how to actually get Brexit done in respect of the NI Protocol, ensuring food/energy supplies for the population or maintaining any sort of meaningful presence on the world stage.

Five years later, when the current bunch of psychopaths make a triumphant 🙄return, they will spend the next five years, once again, syphoning off as much as they can for their family, friends and flunkies all the while blaming Labour for their actions during the preceding five years.

The UK is fucked and is hurtling towards third world country status with every passing day.

PS I'm usually a cautious optimist but what is playing out in front of our very eyes is, for me, terrifying.

[Littlemauvebox]

Mixed bag for me - from a running my own business perspective.
Not bothered about the banking bonus limit - thought it was a daft political stunt to limit it in the first place - bankers were paid higher salaries and lower bonuses to compensate
Didn’t agree with the NI increase - I strongly feel the tax rise should have been income based - wealthy pensioners should have paid too. But we need to pay for social care.

As the owner of a company that used to employ contractors the insistence that these employees forced to work under payroll was an absolute nightmare -zero hours contracts were an awful substitute not designed to cope with these types of workers especially when the Employment Tribunal decided they were entitled to a complicated holiday allocation that could not be resolved till the end of the contract. We have no issue with everyone paying the same tax but this system was incredibly painful for everyone to work with - so much so that we had to ignore it to give our contractor surety of payment for the job done.
No idea why they though the 45% tax rate needed to be abolished at that level we have people who work to do a great job and advance their skills they do not work harder for s few extra ££
And if we wanted to improve productivity in this country without putting pressure on inflation we should have tried improving the transport network and investing in training people rather than giving those who need it least a boost.
In our business the amazing thing is the talented employees are European (why I have no idea! and they were working in their droves in the civil service - quite a few have gone home now - we can draw from the civil service and offer them more money but where does that leave the country - Brexit is an own goal - I don’t know how long it will take to gain an equilibrium the market but we can’t grow at the moment because we can’t recruit enough senior staff - no one can and believe me they don’t need to be paid anymore - so our frustration and limitation is the labour market.
And clearly happy about the corporation tax removal because we have had to carry the inflationary cost of living crisis and the NI costs.
I like to think we pay and treat our team well but at some point it feels like there is no point running a business- dh enjoys it so we keep going - we have enough money to stop and I can see why people are retiring.
We have never voted Tory, I applaud new thinking I’m just not convinced it was implemented with consideration for the current situation it’s so old school and lacking in imagination - I hope I’m wrong and it all works out - it just seems so very unlikely.

[Dave20]

I despair about what’s happening. No access to GPS. You literally have to be on the phone for ages and beg just to get a telephone appointment. If you can spare 45 minutes and then have to go through a receptionist.

No NHS dentists.
A NHS that’s falling apart.
High energy bills
Shortage of public sector staff
High inflation
High house prices
Massive government borrowing

Even older people that have mortgages paid off might find it harder to sell to down size due to people not being able to afford to buy.

When will things get better? Can anyone cheer me up ?

[Softplayhooray]

@TooBigForMyBoots

The news about the Herpes Simplex virus being used to combat cancer is heartening.🙂

Oh yea, this is amazing news!

[mathanxiety]

Are you talking about the Government or the inhabitants ?

I'm talking about the government,@BirmaBrite .

[mathanxiety]

What I don't really understand is if we keep having people come in from very poor countries how can we stand a chance of sorting things out. It must be very expensive to keep constantly propping up people that aren't working and are already quite poor and untrained. I wish we could help everyone but I do think everyone in the U.K. has to suffer in order to achieve that? Also if we have the poor arriving on our doorstep everyday poverty levels will of course increase surely?

It's actually the very rich who don't pay their share of taxes and have moved their money out of the UK who are sucking the NHS, the education system, and the welfare system dry.

Out of sight, out of mind.

www.ft.com/content/00e7a52d-d85e-467c-b287-5d592b37035c

[Crikeyalmighty]

@Florenz that simply isn't true and it's far more complicated than that . There is a whole bunch of jobs that you could pay £20 an hour and people still don't want- there are a whole bunch of people who are quite happy 'getting by' on benefits or part time work and benefit too ups- I know as I've employed them in the past-. There are a whole ton of decent businesses who would also simply go out of business if they can't attract people at£10 to £15 an hour and could only attract if they paid £25 an hour - and in all honesty why should a warehouse worker or HGV driver as an example earn considerably more than a nurse etc!!

[Trez1510]

@rockyg

I get that you were parroting the DM crew, but I've always been at a loss to understand why people don't grasp that their contributions paid for their parents' pensions. Seriously worrying that people can't wrap their heads round that.

Secondly, another thing I've never 'got' is people desperately avoiding the best possible care for an elderly relative because it will eat into 'their' inheritance. I call people like that unsavoury (at best) or abusive (at worst).

Finally, I'm loving all these adverts encouraging elderly people to release equity to enjoy themselves rather than hoard it for grasping offspring. I can hear heads exploding in the Shires every time those adverts air!!

[Kendodd]

@AdamRyan

Anyway. Immigration is not what's causing this country to go to the dogs. In my opinion it's government corruption and incompetence over the past 3 years.

Only 3 years? I'd say much longer.

[AdamRyan]

Anyway. Immigration is not what's causing this country to go to the dogs. In my opinion it's government corruption and incompetence over the past 3 years.

[AdamRyan]

@Florenz

Lack of immigration has nothing to do with jobs not being done. Employers not being prepared to pay the going rate has everything to do with jobs not being done. There are no "jobs British people don't want to do" and there never was, it was all propaganda. Pay enough money and you will find a British person willing to do it. For ANY job.

Have you got evidence for that? Because in my industry anyway, there just aren't candidates applying, regardless of whether employers can afford to pay high rates.

There is record employment and a high number of unfilled vacancies. Which suggests to me not enough workers.

Plus a lot of people are choosing not to continue in high stress jobs (NHS,teaching etc) and increasing salary won't help - it needs a change of working conditions.

Itsvery simplistic to think you can solve every problem by throwing money at it.

[Florenz]

Lack of immigration has nothing to do with jobs not being done. Employers not being prepared to pay the going rate has everything to do with jobs not being done. There are no "jobs British people don't want to do" and there never was, it was all propaganda. Pay enough money and you will find a British person willing to do it. For ANY job.