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Pronunciation differences - scone, castle etc

95 replies

BearSoFair · 09/10/2020 09:53

Are there any more that are common?

Talking to a friend in another country last night and got onto words like 'bath' and 'castle' and how she's never sure whether it should be a long or short A. She wasn't aware of the great scon/scone debate! Are there any other words with well known/debated pronunciation variations? I feel like there must be but none are coming to mind!

OP posts:
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Sapiophile · 09/10/2020 13:28

@TheSeedsOfADream

Hardly anybody pronounces "sixth" "correctly" because of the consonant cluster. Technically speaking, it should be /siksth/ but it's usual either to lose the /k/ or the /s/ sound (together corresponding to the letter "X")
Make it plural and you've got real mouth gymnastics going on!

I've certainly noticed people saying 'Sickth' in England -- I can't remember what news story it was from a few years ago, but it featured a lot of news presenters 'sickth'ing all over the place.

Yet Irish people say 'sicksth' without finding it unduly difficult.
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SleepingStandingUp · 09/10/2020 13:51

Mom
Mum
Mam
Ma
Mommy
Mummy
Mammy
Mama
Mother

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Nomnomarrgh · 09/10/2020 13:54

For myself there is garridge and gar-ah-dge. I know its garridge but I always find myself going between the two in my head. I don’t know why

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MrsMoastyToasty · 09/10/2020 14:04

Bath = "barth".

I live just outside the city of Bath and that's how us locals say it. Never "Baath" like "calf".

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CormoranStrike · 09/10/2020 14:06

I would always say Often worth a t - cannot imagine NOT using it.

The one that throws me is people putting Rs at the end of words. Yes, I am looking at you DH and your Teslar car.

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BashfulClam · 09/10/2020 15:18

Loch seems hard for non Scots and pronounce it as ‘lock’ which grates on me. done of the non Scottish pronunciation of Sauchiehall Street are hilarious! ‘Sow-Chee-hal’ was probably my favourite.

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ScaramoucheFandango · 09/10/2020 15:24

Well they are pronouncing it in their accent which is hardly their fault.

I smile when Scots say Portsmouth with the same intonation as Grangemouth and a rolled r to boot.

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UnaCorda · 09/10/2020 22:18

"None" seems to be pronounced as "non" in some accents (and then spelt wrongly).

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SleepingStandingUp · 10/10/2020 07:25

None is a stupid word.

If you were teaching it to a child, surely the e on the end males o an O (oh) so
n ohw n
Like bone.

Why doesn't none rhyme with bone and tone and lone and cone.
Instead it's none and gone
Lonely done

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SweetAlmondOil · 10/10/2020 07:51

And what about the letter H? Aitch? Or Haitch?

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TheSeedsOfADream · 10/10/2020 08:39

Don't bring that into it, or there will be deletions.
Both are fine. The bit in the article about the sectarian divide in Northern Ireland is what tends to cause the deletions for hate speech on aitch/haitch threads.
www.theguardian.com/science/shortcuts/2013/nov/04/letter-h-contentious-alphabet-history-alphabetical-rosen

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permanentlyfedup · 10/10/2020 09:07

NE Scotland here, as is said ‘fa’s like us?’ . Basically a whole other language up here - even phrases like ‘I’m sorry’ become ‘am affa soor-eye’ .

‘Ken at wee Quine fa bides ay-er er? Yon muckle hoose aside i burn?’

‘You know that girl who lives over there? That big house beside the river?’

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daisypond · 10/10/2020 09:17

I definitely say six-th. Sikth is very odd.
Nougat is noo-gah. I can’t believe anyone would say nugget.
Almond is ah-mond. Why would you pronounce the L? Do you pronounce it in words like calm or palm?

One word that I use that someone had never heard of recently is wend, as in wend your way.

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Mellan · 10/10/2020 09:24

Americans say olmund.

We should expect more and more spelling-influenced pronunciation changes as the vast majority of English speakers in the world learn English as a second language (so, many from books) rather than early childhood language acquisition.

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TheSultanofPingu · 10/10/2020 09:42

I'm very surprised that you can't believe some people pronounce certain words differently to you Daisy. Come on, this is the English language with all its variations we're talking about.

It has brought to mind a thread on here a while ago, talking about a book 'The Giraffe in a scarf'. Someone was absolutely gobsmacked and couldn't imagine that for some people giraffe and scarf didn't rhyme so the title didn't have the same 'feel' to it.

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SleepingStandingUp · 10/10/2020 10:09

@daisypond Nougat is noo-gah. I can’t believe anyone would say nugget.
Don't get out much eh Daisy?

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chomalungma · 10/10/2020 10:13

I heard gasping being pronounced as g'ar' sping on the News Quiz yesterday.

All to do with Trump and gasping for breath.

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chomalungma · 10/10/2020 10:19

Almond is ah-mond. Why would you pronounce the L? Do you pronounce it in words like calm or palm

Because pronounciation is weird

Film - has an 'l' in it so does 'salmon'

But I think I say the 'alm' in salmon differently to the 'alm' in almond.

Thinking more - I say the 'a' in salmon with a short 'a'

These threads always make me question how I do pronounce words.

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QueenOllie · 10/10/2020 10:34

I'm sat here saying words out loud now Grin
Recently I've noticed (via work) about 1/4 of people don't understand me when I say "house"
I'm googling how to pronounce it

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Plussizejumpsuit · 10/10/2020 10:34

It's just accent there's no right or wrong about it op.

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JaJaDingDong · 10/10/2020 10:38

Americans say olmund

Americans say erb when they mean herb

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TheSeedsOfADream · 10/10/2020 10:42

@chomalungma

Almond is ah-mond. Why would you pronounce the L? Do you pronounce it in words like calm or palm

Because pronounciation is weird

Film - has an 'l' in it so does 'salmon'

But I think I say the 'alm' in salmon differently to the 'alm' in almond.

Thinking more - I say the 'a' in salmon with a short 'a'

These threads always make me question how I do pronounce words.

Exactly.
And the "L" in film is pronounced differently to the "L" in like.
What do you reckon to that one Daisy? Believable?
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Fridgeandkitchen · 10/10/2020 10:44

Primark

Pre Mark. Wrong. If it’s was Premark, it would say that above the door.

It’s PrImark.

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JaJaDingDong · 10/10/2020 10:45

I give you:
Tough
Bough
Cough
Dough
Hough
Rough
Through
Enough
Borough
Hiccough
Plough
Slough
Trough
etc

English is a funny old language.

Have you ever read this poem?

Dearest creature in creation,
Study English pronunciation.
I will teach you in my verse
Sounds like corpse, corps, horse, and worse.
I will keep you, Suzy, busy,
Make your head with heat grow dizzy.
Tear in eye, your dress will tear.
So shall I! Oh hear my prayer.
Just compare heart, beard, and heard,
Dies and diet, lord and word,
Sword and sward, retain and Britain.
(Mind the latter, how it’s written.)
Now I surely will not plague you
With such words as plaque and ague.
But be careful how you speak:
Say break and steak, but bleak and streak;
Cloven, oven, how and low,
Script, receipt, show, poem, and toe.
Hear me say, devoid of trickery,
Daughter, laughter, and Terpsichore,
Typhoid, measles, topsails, aisles,
Exiles, similes, and reviles;
Scholar, vicar, and cigar,
Solar, mica, war and far;
One, anemone, Balmoral,
Kitchen, lichen, laundry, laurel;
Gertrude, German, wind and mind,
Scene, Melpomene, mankind.
Billet does not rhyme with ballet,
Bouquet, wallet, mallet, chalet.
Blood and flood are not like food,
Nor is mould like should and would.
Viscous, viscount, load and broad,
Toward, to forward, to reward.
And your pronunciation’s OK
When you correctly say croquet,
Rounded, wounded, grieve and sieve,
Friend and fiend, alive and live.
Ivy, privy, famous; clamour
And enamour rhyme with hammer.
River, rival, tomb, bomb, comb,
Doll and roll and some and home.
Stranger does not rhyme with anger,
Neither does devour with clangour.
Souls but foul, haunt but aunt,
Font, front, wont, want, grand, and grant,
Shoes, goes, does. Now first say finger,
And then singer, ginger, linger,
Real, zeal, mauve, gauze, gouge and gauge,
Marriage, foliage, mirage, and age.
Query does not rhyme with very,
Nor does fury sound like bury.
Dost, lost, post and doth, cloth, loth.
Job, nob, bosom, transom, oath.
Though the differences seem little,
We say actual but victual.
Refer does not rhyme with deafer.
Fe0ffer does, and zephyr, heifer.
Mint, pint, senate and sedate;
Dull, bull, and George ate late.
Scenic, Arabic, Pacific,
Science, conscience, scientific.
Liberty, library, heave and heaven,
Rachel, ache, moustache, eleven.
We say hallowed, but allowed,
People, leopard, towed, but vowed.
Mark the differences, moreover,
Between mover, cover, clover;
Leeches, breeches, wise, precise,
Chalice, but police and lice;
Camel, constable, unstable,
Principle, disciple, label.
Petal, panel, and canal,
Wait, surprise, plait, promise, pal.
Worm and storm, chaise, chaos, chair,
Senator, spectator, mayor.
Tour, but our and succour, four.
Gas, alas, and Arkansas.
Sea, idea, Korea, area,
Psalm, Maria, but malaria.
Youth, south, southern, cleanse and clean.
Doctrine, turpentine, marine.
Compare alien with Italian,
Dandelion and battalion.
Sally with ally, yea, ye,
Eye, I, ay, aye, whey, and key.
Say aver, but ever, fever,
Neither, leisure, skein, deceiver.
Heron, granary, canary.
Crevice and device and aerie.
Face, but preface, not efface.
Phlegm, phlegmatic, ass, glass, bass.
Large, but target, gin, give, verging,
Ought, out, joust and scour, scourging.
Ear, but earn and wear and tear
Do not rhyme with here but ere.
Seven is right, but so is even,
Hyphen, roughen, nephew Stephen,
Monkey, donkey, Turk and jerk,
Ask, grasp, wasp, and cork and work.
Pronunciation (think of Psyche!)
Is a paling stout and spikey?
Won’t it make you lose your wits,
Writing groats and saying grits?
It’s a dark abyss or tunnel:
Strewn with stones, stowed, solace, gunwale,
Islington and Isle of Wight,
Housewife, verdict and indict.
Finally, which rhymes with enough,
Though, through, plough, or dough, or cough?
Hiccough has the sound of cup.
My advice is to give up!!!

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Mellan · 10/10/2020 10:48

@JaJaDingDong

Americans say olmund

Americans say erb when they mean herb

That's how we said it too until c19th. It's a hypercorrection against Cockney h-dropping "''enry 'iggins".

So anxious to not sound common, people began adding in h to words that had previously always been silent, like herb and hotel.
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