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School want to punish ds (PDA) next week for behaviour this week

(30 Posts)
Lambskin Fri 15-Jul-11 17:11:57

Ds2 is 6, in Y1 and has, we believe, Pathological Demand Avoidance Syndrome. This means that he can be a Jekyll and Hyde character; lovely, funny, charming and loving one minute, then the next will refuse to do anything asked of him no matter how simple, shout, run around, be violent, act erratically and basically be a whirling dervish. He also lives in a fantasy world of his own and has sensory issues and extreme anxiety.

All of this is known by the school, we have fortnightly meetings (Head, class teacher and myself) and I thought they understood.

I have been informed by his teacher that ds will not be allowed to go on the planned Teddy Bears' Picnic next week because his behaviour has been bad this week - arguing with staff, refusing to do what he is told, being excitable etc. None of which is new or surprising.

I am fuming! All of the 'professionals' involved with ds - EP, CAMHS, Specialist Teacher have all said again and again that punishments have to be immediate and the school just seem intent on disregarding everything they're told by them and by me.

They can't do this can they? I already go on school trips so I would go on this too if it was a case of Health and Safety, but his teacher has very firmly said that no it is a sanction but that she will mention my displeasure(!) to the Head.

I know that this isn't a big deal in the grand scheme and I've certainly fought worse with them, I thought that they were finally understanding but now I think they just want him to go away. sad

EllenJaneisnotmyname Fri 15-Jul-11 17:28:35

This is not an appropriate sanction for your DS. Will he associate it with the behaviour? I doubt it. I'd write to the head asking whether they really want to discriminate against your DS due to his disability by refusing to let him attend a school trip when they have already said it's not a H & S issue. I would be absolutely fuming! angry This is directly in contravention of the Disability Discrimination Act, but I'm not so clued up on the new Equality Act. Someone will know.

EllenJaneisnotmyname Fri 15-Jul-11 17:29:49

Due to his disability, because his behaviour is due to his PDA.

Claw3 Fri 15-Jul-11 17:37:12

Ds is missing playtime on Monday, for something he did today. The reason for this is that he had already missed a playtime today, for something he did today.

Having to miss a trip, is different though. Have they run out of days to punish him? Like ds, he is being punished a day in arrears now.

EllenJaneisnotmyname Fri 15-Jul-11 17:43:59

Claw, unless the punishment is understood, it's completely pointless. It's just revenge, how inappropriate is that?

Claw3 Fri 15-Jul-11 18:53:01

I couldnt agree more Ellen, ds has real difficulties making the connection between the behaviour and the consequence, even when the consequence is immediate. He thinks he is being punished for things which are totally unrelated, like chasing a bee at playtime. He is totally confused by it and is getting really stressed.

Furthermore if he was to receive the help experts recommended, he probably wouldnt be in trouble in the first place.

I have written to school today.

Triggles Fri 15-Jul-11 19:34:34

It's inappropriate punishment. As with DS2, it sounds like it is important for him to have immediate consequences. Punishment next week will not make any sense to him, and won't be of any use.

rebl Fri 15-Jul-11 20:05:17

Quite frankly its not an appropriate sanction for any 6 yo. At that age sanctions must be that day.

Lambskin Fri 15-Jul-11 20:14:00

Thank you for replying everyone.

Ellen It's not even a proper trip, just into the park that is right next door to the school. The thing is he doesn't have a dx yet (seeing Paed next Tues and CAMHS have only dx the anxiety) or a statement so they would argue that he is not actually classed as disabled, although he is on SA+.

Claw ds is always missing playtime at random times because they keep carrying it over. They know that they shouldn't and yet they keep doing it - now that's bad behaviour.

Triggles I couldn't agree more. I just feel like I'm banging my head up against a brick wall.

I'm seriously considering home educating next year.

Agnesdipesto Fri 15-Jul-11 21:17:56

Agree with all the above but also have to say that I could never imagine our school doing this to any child SEN or not. Missing an outing would be a massive deal for any 6 year old (perhaps its actually less of a big deal for yours, but my NT 7 year old would be distraught)
I think that is a really inappropriate punishment and just sounds like they do not want him on the trip
Is the school behaviour policy on the website / do you have a copy (usually sign it when you join). If it does not say a sanction is missing a trip then they are in effect creating a special worse sanction for your child.
You should have signed a home/school agreement
I think missing a school trip is probably only something that would happen at secondary school and then only for pulling a knife or something
Also is it possible the structure is slipping towards the end of term eg more free play etc and perhaps your DS is going off track because the lessons are less structured whilst the teachers get ready for the holidays?
Def complain formally and to the governors not only is it too late to relate to the events but its exceptionally cruel and just serves to single your child out even more.
Is your child going to be in school? If not then its an unlawful exclusion as well
Equality Act is what you need to look at.
Also some guidance here look at para 14 and 15

Triggles Fri 15-Jul-11 23:02:50

I agree that some of the reason could be the way things are so unstructured as the end of the school year approaches. TA actually mentioned that to us the other day, saying that she expected him to have some extra difficulties, so was trying to make sure that certain parts of his routine were solid, even though everything during the school day will be a bit up in the air, so that he doesn't have difficulty coping with all the change. So it's not like they shouldn't be expecting it.

utah Fri 15-Jul-11 23:14:09

I would ask for an email for your records confirming their action as it is amazin how schools attitudes change when they have to write on paper their action and reasons

nadia77 Fri 15-Jul-11 23:17:16

lol you should sue for disibility discrimination!
i'm just kidding it's absloutely appauling i just cant understand why it's so hard for them to understand why your ds will not understand the punisment!

Lambskin Sat 16-Jul-11 08:05:30

Agnesdipesto this is how I feel - that they just don't want him there; at the school, never mind the trip, and they're making life as difficult and unpleasant as they can for us. I've already had Parent Partnership involved so I might contact them again on Monday to see if they'll come with me to meet the Head, that shook them up last time.

I've just concluded a massive battle with the school regarding their policy of punishing at home misbehaviour at school, and I really thought we were getting somewhere.

The school behaviour policy isn't on the website so I'll ask to see a copy.

Thank you utah I will do that. I'm keeping a file on all of this (and I've told the school that) since they used to 'informally' exclude him at the beginning of the year. I've wised up since then and grown some balls.

I would love to do that nadia but I'm not sure if he's classed as disabled because the only dx he has is one of anxiety.

He has a Paed appointment next Tuesday and I'm hoping to get the ball rolling on a dx of PDA with him.

nadia77 Sat 16-Jul-11 10:18:52

The Disability Discrimination Act says a disabled person is someone with a physical or mental impairment which has a substantial and long-term adverse effect on his ability to carry out normal day-to-day activities.

Examples include cancer, diabetes, multiple sclerosis and heart conditions; hearing or sight impairments, or a significant mobility difficulty; and mental health conditions or learning difficulties. People in these circumstances and some others (such as people with a facial disfigurement) are likely to have rights under the Disability Discrimination Act (DDA) to protect them from discrimination. However, only the courts can say if a particular individual is defined as disabled under the legislation.

see he can not carry out normal day to day activity!
does he have learning dificulties?
i'm not saying sue them just threats would be fine know?

EllenJaneisnotmyname Sat 16-Jul-11 10:28:48

I agree with Nadia. Just remind them that 'they are surely not discriminating against him by not allowing him to go on a trip?' type of thing without getting too heavy. They should know their obligations.

Lambskin Sat 16-Jul-11 13:15:53

That's what I'll do.

They are well aware of his problems, none of this is new. He has been at that school since Nursery when all of this became apparent. I feel like he has been betrayed.

He has a Paed appointment later on the same day if all else fails I'll take him out for the day, but I will write to the Head and the governors because I'm finding the constant threats and pressure incredibly stressful.

Ineedalife Sat 16-Jul-11 16:05:28

This kind of thing really annoys me, Did your Ds know/understand that he was likely to loose his trip if he behaved inappropriatley[sp]??

Was he warned that he might lose the trip, were you told that he could lose the trip? I bet you weren't. Why do schools suddenly use things as sanctions when the children don't even know or understand that they might be about to lose something lovely. It makes me sad.

A girl at Dd2's school lost out on a camping trip with school because she giggled in a theatre FGS, she had no idea that the camping trip could or would be used as a sanction.

It makes my blood boilangry

Sorry rant over, I hope your Ds gets to go on his picnic lambskin, if he doesn't I would take him somewhere really special for the day.

LeninGrad Sat 16-Jul-11 16:33:30

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Lambskin Sat 16-Jul-11 18:30:40

That's what makes me so mad about this Ineedalife he has no idea, absolutely no idea. I don't think he really understands he's not allowed to go, he'd chosen his bear for the picnic and everything sad

I gave them the strategies from the links you gave me LeninGrad and gave his class teacher, the Head, his class teacher for next year, and the SENCo all the info from the websites. They agreed with me that it sounded exactly like him! The whole sorry affair is shock angry

Ineedalife Sat 16-Jul-11 18:47:32

Bless himsad.

smugtandemfeeder Sat 16-Jul-11 18:51:36


Lambskin Sun 17-Jul-11 17:26:36

Ok, an update.

We have decided to Home Educate. He is overjoyed and I am monumentally relieved. I've been in touch with the wonderful co-ordinator for our area, she has 3 SN kids all HE and now in their early twenties and all in Higher Ed. I'm handing in the de-registration letter to the Head tomorrow.

Thank you all for your words of kindness and support smile

LeninGrad Sun 17-Jul-11 17:29:45

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

EllenJaneisnotmyname Sun 17-Jul-11 17:32:15

Gosh, Lambskin! Well done on putting your DS's needs first. There's a good Home Ed board on here. I'm not sure I could be so committed, but the school did sound pretty crap.

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