Parent teacher meeting hell

[Kerm1]

I hadn't my yr1 parent teacher meeting for dd3 2 weeks ago. Dd is still almost completely illiterate. We raided concerns last year with her reception teacher who told us that she could read, that she was likely just being stubborn with the homework and that she was pulling the wool over our eyes. Knew this wasn't the case but we let it go as she was sure there was no problem. Dd is summer born and the youngest in the class. We spoke to this years number of times and she agreed from the off that she was behind and struggling with her reading. We asked for support for her and were told that she wasn't a priority. She was eventually withdrawn for some small group support which the school never informed us about in January but we have been told that there has been no progress.
At the parent teacher meeting the teacher told me that dd has no interest in anything, constantly talks and disrupts the child next to her, is making no progress, must understand that it is bad manner to contstantly talk through class. There was nothing positive except that "she's well able to stand up for herself". Told that even with the group support attainment gap is widening between dd and everyone else in class. Again I was pushing for some support and possibly and assessment of some sort. Teacher said that she saw no need for an assessment as she didn't think that dd had any learning disability. I said that there is clearly a problem and was told that "she's of low iq". And that was that.... no extra support, no discussion about any possible explanations, nothing. We have booked dd in for a private assessment to see what's what but at are at a loss to know how to deal with dd's teacher. I went to the principal to ask for extra support and reported what had been said re iq and I suspect the teacher may have gotten into trouble because she is now essentially refusing to engage with myself an dh. There is still a lot of the school year left.....

[fairypuff]

How old is your dd? Some children just take longer to be ready for school. You say she is the youngest in her class. Perhaps she isn't ready yet. There is a lot of research to suggest that holding back on formal education until they are 7 is better in the long run.
Having said that it does sound like the teacher has washed her hands of this and she shouldn't have that attitude.
Perhaps ask the school, "what can I do to support dd?" Rather than "what are you doing to support dd?"

[user789653241]

Have you actually done something about your dd talking constantly in class and distracting other children? Mine was similar, he was chatter box in yr1, and we came down hard on him to change in the first place.

[SavoyCabbage]

She said she was of low IQ?? I’m almost speechless at that.

On the one hand they say she can do things, like reading, and doesn’t need extra support and on the other hand they say she is making no progress. It’s nonsensical.

You do need to help her concentrate so she can learn at school. Play board games and listening , do jigsaws etc. And give her tasks where she has to follow instructions. ‘Go and get your goggles out on the bottom drawer in your bedroom and put them in your orange swimming bag’.

Anyone who has worked in a school will tell you that we’ve all come across a child who never seems to know what is going on because they aren’t listening to the adults. From lining up for lunch to learning time on the carpet. They don’t seem to think it’s anything to do with them at all. I was doing quick fire number bonds to ten in Friday with year ones and a girl put her hand up in the middle and said ‘shall I clean the whiteboard?’ No! Tell me how many more to make ten!

[Norestformrz]

If your hasn't been assessed how is the teacher able to make statements about IQ? Clearly there is a problem and it's the teacher's responsibility to ensure every child learns.

[MMmomDD]

OP - I am sorry you are going through this.

I wanted to ask. Your post doesn’t mention anything about your daughter. How she is at home, with you, with her siblings.

Some of her behaviours at school can be related to something else going on in her life - with siblings, friends, life in general.
And interest in learning - is related to her happiness too.
And - as much as parents want to think that it’s a school job to get her interested in learning - it isn’t only.
It needs to come and be supported at home.

Kids being slow to read happens. Especially given that we are talking about 4-5yos and in most countries kids of that age aren’t taught to read.
But - there is still a lot you can do to help her development at home - reading to her, especially.

IQ is a touchy subject, and is rather imprecise, especially in that young age. It’s rather hard to measure.
IQ, by definition, has a distribution - but nothing prevents kids from learning if a right approach is found.

But - for a 5yo - it’s unlikely to be IQ related - and tying to get to the bottom of what’s going on with her is important

[Tomorrowillbeachicken]

Tbh with reading most part of the reading practice tends to be at home with lots of children and schools. Try something like teach your monster to read or use oxford owl as they have some free books on there to read on the computer.
The talking needs to be targeted though as it probably is impacting her learning as well as those of others.

[Leeds2]

Does your DD do any out of school activities, thinking swimming, Rainbows, ballet etc? If she does, does she pay attention to the teacher, listen and follow instructions etc? I'm wondering if she behaves as her teacher describes all the time, or just at school.

[Habanero]

Have you got the time to tackle this at home? You can take control of the literacy side: sign up to Reading Chest - you’ll need the gold scheme - and take her through phonics books, one or two every day, paying attention to the “notes for the parent/teacher” at the back of each book so you know what you should be working on.

The website Reading Eggs is also good for practising, practising, practising, and half an hour every day will move your daughter on.

These things both require a subscription, but if finances are tight you will find phonics-based books at your local library, and you can spend time with your dd every night working on her reading, together.

[Alljamissweet]

I suspect our school did CATS type assessments in reception class and the writing was on the wall for our DS.
He's summer born and was very rarely listened to read in that first year. Frankly, he got nowhere and I believe they decided he had a low IQ.
In Yr 1, I insisted that DS was heard read every day in school and I read a book a night at home. TBH, if you get school to change the reading book every day, you don't need to subscribe to online resources.
By the end of yr 1, DS had gone up 6 levels!
We still read 4 books a week and he's flying!
Now in yr 2, I've hit the maths! Again, I believe he was identified as bottom of the class material, and he is now from being "working towards" in every level of maths, he is working at the expected level.
Just little and often at home has made a huge difference.
Keep chipping away and if your DD needs an assessment, we were told to get a private one done because unless they are trying to burn the school down, you could be waiting forever.

[Kerm1]

Dd will be 6 in august. When we began approaching the school last year with concerns it was initially about what can we do at home to help improve things. She was impossible to get on task for her homework. Avoidance and meltdowns were the norm. We decided last year not to to pile the pressure on her because her older siblings love to read as I do and I didn't want to turn it into such a battle that it would turn her off for life. As has been pointed out she's very young.
When we approached her new teacher at the start of this year it was initially in the context of asking for help to guide us at home. We kept being sent home the same homework as all the other kids when as we pointed out it was causing her such distress because it was predicated on a child who can read to some level.
The teacher gave us some photocopies off twinklewhich we did religiously with her. When dd brought them in the teacher didn't look at them and told her she didn't need to bother bringing them in.
We are fairly engaged parents. We do jigsaws and games with her. What w have noticed this year is that she gets really upset and agitated when the games are too verbally fast paced. She loses her place and then gets very upset when she feels she doesn't know what's going on. Even in games when she is playing it appropriately she gets upset that everything is going wrong. Her confidence is shot.
We have been going over the sounds again and she does get them. She just can't blend them. It how she engages with the page. It's just "off".
Myself and dh are beginning to think that her language is not where it should be. Both her older siblings have good language skills and dd speaks fine but sometimes I think she finds it hard to follow what's going on.
I have spoken to her about the disruption in class and why she doesn't listen. She says that sometimes she can't hear (hearing is fine) and other times she will look around the room and seem something that interests her and she just "gets distracted".
I'm nervous about doing oxford owl or the link at the moment. She is already doing two streams of work. The remedial work with us at home and the class level work. Until she sees the ed psy and receive some professional advice I don't really want to throw another stream at her.
We have an assessment booked in 3 weeks. I just am so horrified with the school. It's not that I expect them to "fix" things. It's the feeling that they just don't care. We asked her teacher to fill out an adaptive behaviours questionairre for the ed psych and the first time she gave it back to us she hadn't bothered to fill out half of it. We gave it back and the second time it was returned she had still filled it in incorrectly and some of the answers she gave were a joke. She answered "don't know" to things like "Can the child turn three pages on a book?". Or "can she name ten objects?. She may be having fairly severe academic difficulties but she is also a child that neither her childminder or her nursery school ever raised any developmental concerns about. I'm torn between being furious with her teacher and terrified that she's right and we didn't notice.....surely we'd have noticed before she went to school if she was of low iq. Would there not have been more signs?

[Misleadorlie]

Has anyone checked her for auditory processing issues?

[Naty1]

Ok so she cant blend?
So what band do they have her on?
Any ear infections/glue ear? As that can affect behaviour.
Is she reading every night?

I agree with tomorrow in that the progress with reading is made more at home. Dd1 school only read with the teacher 1-2 times a term and maybe fortnightly with a TA.
I found the jolly phonics app good. It does the sounds but also blends example words.

[BubblesBuddy]

You talk about a school principal - is this a private school? You talk about work sheets - this doesn’t sound like a state school. The teacher cannot be bothered to differentiate the work. Your DD should have work closely tailored to what she needs to improve upon and the teacher should be working with you. She cannot be the only child struggling one would have thought.

The ed psychs report should be illuminating but will the school take any notice of it? Assuming you are paying for it. The teacher won’t have measured her iq but you need to know if she has all-round delay.

Sometimes the “baby” in the family can cover up lack of progress at home. My summer born could read pretty well by 5 and had held a pencil well from 2 and was writing at nursery. She understood stories and used long sentences. She was curious and interested in lots of things. I think the youngest can get overlooked and is expected to get along with siblings and fit in with family schedules. What could she do before school? Did she learn anything at nursery? Or has she just played? What interest has she taken in books and words with you?

Not all children make the same progress, but you do need expert help for her. With the iq comment, I would be seeing the Head teacher!

[underneaththeash]

Has she had her eyes tested recently? You don't need to go to anyone fancy a local optometrist will screen her.

Is it a private school? My DD goes to one where the teaching is just dire and not engaging at all. We're moving her next year.

[expatmigrant]

Being young in year group does not always mean that the child will not be as able in learning as the older ones.
You are absolutely doing the right thing by getting her privately assessed as soon as possible. i suspect that she might has some kind of sensory processing issue. If she is in a state school and in quite a large busy class this might be causing her to get easily distracted and thereby be left behind a bit. There are lots of support that the teacher can put in place to make it easier for you DD to cope in a busy classroom. She should be sitting close to the teacher and also with most of the class behind her so that she does not see what's going on at the other tables.
Also ask her to have DD sitting close to her during carpet time so that she can hear instructions better. My DS has sensory processing issue and dysgraphia which was not assessed until Y3 and he has had LS ever since and is now doing his A levels. I know this might not be possible, but you might want to consider private school for her. She would probably benefit from smaller class sizes.

[Kerm1]

She's not in private school. I think it might be the use of the term principal which gave that impression. That's just because I'm Irish. The rest of the class don't get work sheets. We were only given those when we asked for differentiated homework because the homework being given was so completely beyond her that it was counterproductive.
We read to her and with her every night and have done always. She loves being read to. Her comprehension of whatever we are reading is good, even if the book is relatively complex and has no pictures. However she does not engage with the physical words themselves and never did.
She has no hearing issues - been tested.
She has a lazy eye which is being treated with glasses and patching (she doesn't wear the patch at school).
Bubblesbuddy, you are so right about the baby being overlooked. I can remember what week ds1 began to walk, talk, etc. Ds2, I could name the month. Dd3, I might guess her milestones within a couple of months if she's lucky. I suppose that's my fear now that we have been so caught up with the family as a whole that we have missed stuff.

[Kerm1]

Most importantly, I should have said that outside school she is generally happy. She has friends both inside and outside school. She's lively and confident if a little shy with new people. She's a bit mouthy, no she's a lot mouthy. A bit of a madam really.

[catkind]

I realise this may be difficult with older kids, but is there any possibility of moving school? This school sounds shocking. I would say this teacher, but the reception teacher sounds shocking too, so I would have my doubts about the whole setup. They're really letting your DD down, and no wonder she's tuning out and becoming disruptive if the class work is pitched as inappropriately as the homework. I'm afraid I wouldn't have any faith that even with an Ed Psych report saying what the issue is the teacher will be able to cater appropriately.

In terms of what you do at home, maybe a phonics game/app might be more fun instead of doing extra homework worksheets? Not much point reading books at all if she can't blend yet. If teacher is just printing random stuff off twinkl it probably won't be a coherent programme, whereas following an app through would at least be systematic. My two found Teach Your Monster to Read very engaging.

[Pratchet]

The teacher has failed to engage the child. I'm sure your daughter could do jolly well but this teacher is failing her and will give her a bad name for next year. Shame you've got her for Y1.

[Kerm1]

We are looking to move. Been to see head of another primary that has a very good reputation with Sen pupils. She was lovely and horrified about what's been going on so far. Her view was that no child CANNOT learn irrespective of iq unless it is so low that the child was very clearly intellectually disabled, something that would have shown up by way of a significant level of developmental delay. Dd was not ðevelopmentally delayed in any way. Outside of school our concerns were previously confined to her inability to remember people's names. Now that I'm obsessively watching her every move we are now concerned about her receptive language but it's not particularly obvious and she speaks at a fairly appropriate level.
We are hoping to get her in to this other primary but she is only 4th on the list. However although she could make no promises she was quite encouraging about giving her a place for September.
It was this head who also discouraged me from trying to teach dd to read in any new fashion until we had the report. Her view was that dd is obviously so overwhelmed and under confident that it may be that under the guidance of a professional we may need to unpick what's gone wrong and start again from scratch in a matter appropriate to whatever her specific needs are. Something which right now we are clueless about. Whatever is going on it is clearly serious enough though. I would assess her at about the same level today that my elder two were at In about December of reception at best.

[catkind]

That's good news. Fingers crossed for September.

[bastardkitty]

You sound like a brilliant parent. The teacher's comments have been completely unacceptable. It sounds like the best plan i to move to a decent school and then raise a formal complaint to the governors (or is ut a different structure?) detailing the comments made and the failure to respond appropriately to your child and to the teacher.

[mais]

Hi Kerm1 sorry to hear your dd has been so let down. I think you said you are based in Ireland? If so please ask your gp to refer you to the PCCC scheme for under 6’s - it is a scheme that will provide a psychological assessment, speech & language & o.t and I think assessments are varied out within 6months. Worth looking into while your dd is still eligible because after she turns 6 the service as you probably know is non existent & waiting lists horrendous. By going this route you can rule in/out anything, other than the teacher, that is holding your dd back.

[BubblesBuddy]

I am glad you have had a more positive response at another school. I was confused about your use of the word "principal"! Often independent schools can be behind the curve with SEN and differentiation as they often screen out these children upon enrolment, so I would not recommend this route at all.

As others have said, it is not normal for individual teachers to have any idea of IQ. Schools must differentiate work appropriately in class and not just hand out a work sheets based on guesswork rather than a professional assessment of the child's progress. The new Head sounds far more positive and I woud take the advice given.

I would also have a serious chat with your DD about her being "mouthy". It will not be endearing her to adults. Being sensible, use of self-control with regard to language and keeping calm will help her in her new school.