Year 1/2 words confusion

[slp123]

I know there are many experts here...I thought all the year words lists were now null and void. Apparently my FS2 child had an assessment today and knows all the reception key words and nearly all her Y1 and Y2 words. We then have a list of some she doesn't yet know. I thought schools were no longer using these lists?
Any experiences?

[mrz]

Does the school teach the words as whole words by sight or how to decode them?

[slp123]

These are whole words. They teach phonics daily, letters and sounds just at end of phase 3.

[HoratiaDrelincourt]

The hundred "high frequency words"?

Things like "said", "Mrs", "though" and other words that come up a lot but don't fit with the early phonics rules.

HTH

[slp123]

Just googled the 100 high frequency words but I don't think it is those. Some of the words still to learn are should, would, could, laugh, people, because, these, many, water, school and a few others.
Do you think the school are making their own lists?

[Neverhere]

Most of the ones you have listed are HFW so it is probably that

[slp123]

Oh I see. Must have looked at an incorrect link on Google or something as I didn't see any of them. Will have another look.
Thanks

So schools are still teaching these as whole words then?

[tiredbutnotweary]

They used these at my DDs previous school. You have to look for the uk list as there are different lists out there. After the first 100 there is the next 200 which takes you to the end of KS1.

I taught my DD the code she needed to know to be able to sound out & blend these words. There are some rarer spelling / sound correspondences but knowing the code meant she could read many more words than the 300 listed!

[columngollum]

If you're not sure the best thing to do is ask the teacher. You can't decode Mr and Mrs. It depends on what the words in the list are.

[mrz]

If the school follows Letters & Sounds (many do because it's free) then there is a list of 100 HFW for reception and a further 200 HFW for KS1. Most are easily decodeable from the start others contain alternative spellings for sounds and a few like Mr & Mrs are abreviation. Obviously abreviations need to be taught as a whole but schools are meant to teach how to decode the others. The problem is that HFW is thought incorrectly to mean sight word and children are given long lists to memorise as wholes unnecessarily.

[columngollum]

I'm sure you know about tricky words. It's worth checking with her whether or not that's what they are (as opposed to high frequency, but not necessarily tricky) words.

(Personally I wouldn't worry about strangeness such as whether or not tricky today could be untricky tomorrow when the child has learned more. I'd just call a spade a spade and a tricky word a tricky word.)

[maizieD]

Mr and Mrs are abbreviations of words so of course they can't be sounded out. I think that children should be told that when they are given any abbrieviations to 'learn'. Show them the complete words,master and mistress,sound them out and blend the complete words and then show how they have been shortened for ease of writing.
TBH I don't know if any phonics programmes explicitly teach abbreviation or if it is left to the teacher to realise that abbreviations are not words and to teach children the difference.

Does the word list being discussed come from Letters and Sounds? The concept of 'word learning' is daft really. Words are automatically taken into long term memory after they have been sounded out and blended a number of times (number varies with different children),no need for desperate 'learning'. It would be much better if word lists were presented as being 'useful words to know' rather than as words that have 'got to be learned'.

(I wish there was an abbreviation for abbreviation, it's a real pain to keep writing out in full on a little tablet!)

[columngollum]

Because something is an abbreviation that doesn't mean that it's not a word. Because things are Gouda, Cheddar or Parmesan that doesn't mean they're not cheeses. A word is an utterance which means something, according to my dictionary. There are lots of words that phonicsy people disapprove of. But they're still words.

[HoratiaDrelincourt]

Ah yes, "what is a word". In fairness the definition for 5yos is less philosophical though

[columngollum]

If you tell a 5yo that's a word they're fine with it. It's when you start redefining the word word to fit your pet theory of teaching reading that you run into trouble.

[maizieD]

There's certainly a word for what you write, cg.In fact, there are several words..

OK. Let's try again. Mistress is the eritten form of the spoken word, mistress. Mrs. is an abbreviation of the written word 'mistress'. I am perfectly prepared to defend bizarre spellings in words such as 'one'& 'two' as all the phonemes are represented by letters. Items such as mr.,mrs., no.,ltd., co., etc.,are contractions of the written word which, because we understand their purpose, by having been taught it,we 'read' as though the missing letters are there. It is wrong to f*ck up children's understanding of how the alphabetic code works by telling them that these abbreviations are complete written words.

[slp123]

sorry to have caused so much heated debate. I think I will send school an email to clarify the list.

[columngollum]

Of course it's an abbreviation. An abbreviation is a type of word, so are contractions and compound words. For instance, eg. (for instance) is a word, in either sense. OK, take ok, (okay)? OK is a word, OK?

[mrz]

[columngollum]

[mrz]

you do know that OK isn't an abbreviation for okay don't you columngollum?

[tiredbutnotweary]

Nor could e.g. be described as 'a' word given that it is short for 2 latin words exempli gratia.

Indeed only the two first letters are pronounced when we say e.g., so unless you are now saying the letters e and g are words .....

[HarveySchlumpfenburger]

I think what you are describing sounds like the old word list from the appendix of the original literacy strategy rather than the HFW list in Letter and Sounds. It was replaced in 2006. Were there 45 Reception 'key' words?

[slp123]

not sure if there were 45 reception keywords. She has had 3 a week since September but most of them are easily decodeable so not really sure definitely going to ask her teacher after half term.

[columngollum]

Can't is a word. But it expands to more than one. The expansion length bears no relevance. USA expands quite a bit, so they tell me.

[mrz]

There are 100 reception HFWs slp <a class="break-all" href="http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20130401151715/www.education.gov.uk/publications/eOrderingDownload/Letters%20and%20Sounds-7.pdf" rel="nofollow noindex" target="_blank">webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20130401151715/www.education.gov.uk/publications/eOrderingDownload/Letters%20and%20Sounds-7.pdf