Help with clingy daughter

[wiggleshasmylife]

I have posted before about the insane hours me and my husband work. He works nights. I work mornings. Both long days.
Our daughter is 10 months. She is either with her dad or with me. She has a playpen. It's huge. It has all her toys in and she can see us. I have to put her in there sometimes so I can cook tea, sort washing out etc. She screams like she is being murdered. And it's not even crying. It's just pure screaming..no reason for it. I cant not put her in it when I have to leave her alone. She can pull herself up now and the living room is too full of dangers to leave her unoccupied. The screaming is pushing me to the edge. I've struggled with postnatal depression and it's getting worse with this screaming. Im not eating properly or sleeping.

Another problem is she won't sleep. She doesn't nap..I've tried. Weve tried prams, buses, rocking. I dont particularly want to leave her to cry it out.

She throws tantrums. I didnt know a ten month old could. She throws herself back and screams if I won't let her get her own way..and its little things like nappy changes and not having what she shouldn't have in her hand

Has anyone got any suggestions? I know it's probably a phase and it will end but right now it doesn't seem that way and I'm spending most nights after work with her in tears
Feel like a shit mum if I go to her and feel shit if I leave her to cry

[NerrSnerr]

She is probably exhausted from not napping. Mine were both rubbish sleepers and they'd get into a cycle of getting exhausted from not sleeping which made getting them to sleep even harder. How does she get to sleep at night?

I would also look at baby proofing your living room- soon she'll be a fully grown toddler and be able to climb out of the play pen and roam free.

[wiggleshasmylife]

@NerrSnerr the house itself is pretty baby proofed. It'd more that she pulls herself up on the sofas and things and then falls backwards which I want to avoid. So I put her in the playpen. I'm sure given time she will be climbing out.

Honestly her sleep is crap. She falls asleep on me every night and I transfer her to the cot. Some times she goes in easy as pie. Other nights she ends up in my arms asleep until my husband finishes and then we swap. Which means we both end up with about 4 hours sleep if we are lucky.

I'm so so tired right now. Shes half asleep in my arms and I'm crying my eyes out

[30degreesandmeltinghere]

Ime tough love. A few nights of sleep for you all will transform your lives..
My ds 9 mo cried day and bf all night.
Send dh in with formula. Had an oz then slept through. Next night water. Slept through the 3rd night not waking at all.
Resettle without lifting her out of the cot.

[wiggleshasmylife]

Might be a stupid question but how do you resettle without picking them up?

[RedLemon]

I’m sorry for defaulting to the MN standard answer but have you tried a sling?

My DD2 wouldn’t nap anywhere else. I used to bop around with her in it (sometimes under the extractor fan!) till she nodded off and then get on with my jobs. It saved my sanity. It’s not ideal but I figured worst case scenario 18 months of sling naps I could cope with. I have a strong back though!

I feel for you! She just wants to be close to you. I think separation anxiety is a often big factor at this age.

though!!

[GiantToadstool]

Lots of babies dont like being put in a pen.

You say you work insane hours. Who cares for your baby then? Can they have them a bit longer? How are they with them?

[GiantToadstool]

I remember the exhaustion well 😞.

[Eachpeachpears]

Yeah you need to sort her sleep out. Sleeping in arms over night at 10months is ludicrous. Start putting her down slightly more awake each night. The same for naps. Use a sleep signal such as a grobag. Once they are used to it, they learn bag means sleep.
Once your sleep is sorted, you'll all be happier.
Also, ime, play pens are a massive frustration for everyone involved. Get rid of it. Being able to see you but not get to you is an awful feeling for her. I understand why you do it but this will be making the separation anxiety worse. I would get rid of it/stop using it and see how she goes. At the moment, she associates it with being away from you and therefore upset.
Good luck, it's such a difficult age

[wiggleshasmylife]

@Gianttoadstool she doesn't go anywhere else. I work from 3 am till 1 pm. Husband works from 3 ish till midnight ish. And we swap. Covid wiped out our savings so we can't afford childcare. We've been on furlough and maternity..no family nearby. Nothing we can do unfortunately

[Eachpeachpears]

@wiggleshasmylife

Might be a stupid question but how do you resettle without picking them up?

Bum pat! I roll DD on her side, supporting her with my one hand and bum pat with the other. White noise and/or shushing

[wiggleshasmylife]

@Eachpeachpears this is so hard. I thought a playpen was the best thing for her. We literally scraped our money together to get her the biggest one and turns out it's a shit idea. I'm so bad at this parenting stuff.

The sleep. I dont know what to do. My anxiety is so bad when I leave her to cry. I've been diagnosed with postnatal depression and anxiety. Under the mental health team. But the screaming. It makes me so so on edge. Is it literally a case of tough love. We tried a grow bag. She hates it. We tried for ages and she freaked out. I literally feel like throwing my hands up and saying I quit

[GiantToadstool]

I don't think this os going to be sustainable. And you will get ill somehow. Something is going to need to change. You cant work 50hour weeks with no childcare and hardly any sleep - and then worry the baby is clingy.

[GiantToadstool]

Just seen your update. I don't think your mental health will manage this long term. Can one of you work less and use UC? Can you see somone for advice?

[wiggleshasmylife]

@Gianttoadstool trust me I know. But if we don't work we don't pay the bills. Lockdown and furlough and covid has had us living with next to nothing for over a year. We would have been fine if it wasn't for our baby.
I dont regret her..I regret the time I had her. We both work in the restaurant industry. So we've been making bare minimum. Not entitled to anything. When I fell pregnant we planned to have her in 2 days a.week childcare and I would go down to 4 days a.week. that isn't feasible now. I just want to cry

[GiantToadstool]

She may just be wanting more contact time. Some babies do want lots of contact.
It sounds like you just have too much on at once . It sounds so hard.

[GiantToadstool]

Would CAB be able to help advise you wrt entitlements?

We really struggled financially and sleepwise (but precovid) and I really feel for you.

[Eachpeachpears]

You must be entitled to something.
Use entitleto website to have a look. Put in various options for childcare amounts as you can get up to 85% back.

I have been exactly where you are. It's really really hard.
But you are going to burn yourself to the ground if you carry on like this.
One of you needs a job with more sustainable hours. They are out there, it's just a case of find the time to apply for loads of them!
You need to sort the sleep situation. Stop using the playpen. Sorry, but there will be many times when what you thought would be a miracle cure is actually a dud! Removing the play pen should remove the constant screaming to start with at least.

Sleep is so important. Both taken few days off so you have the nights to do this together.
Put down drowsy but awake. She crys then sooth her however you feel right to. Pick up and sooth then out back down of needs be. It will be hard but what you are doing right now is a recipe for disaster.

I say all this while in lying next to dc2 to get them to sleep. I've been here for 45minutes. It's not a breeze, but in the long run it will help.
You are not a bad parent. You are doing your best.
Brighter days will come, I promise you

[ManicPixie]

Sleep train. If she’s falling asleep on you then being transferred into the cot she’s never learned to self-soothe and is basically like a newborn. You’ll see results after a few days if you commit to a routine and stick to it.

[Kayo12345]

Sleep is really really important and I think is the issue here. If you can see what you are entitled to if you decide not to work or reduce your hours. As another poster suggested, try to take a few days off to reset. Maybe try a toddler carrier to help to go to the toilet etc if she is asleep on you.

Also don’t worry about doing the chores laundry etc.

[Kayo12345]

If she does want to decide to sleep train she can use the gentle approach.

OP you don’t need to let your baby cry it out as the crying is stressing you out.

[Gingerspice100]

[quote wiggleshasmylife]@Eachpeachpears this is so hard. I thought a playpen was the best thing for her. We literally scraped our money together to get her the biggest one and turns out it's a shit idea. I'm so bad at this parenting stuff.

The sleep. I dont know what to do. My anxiety is so bad when I leave her to cry. I've been diagnosed with postnatal depression and anxiety. Under the mental health team. But the screaming. It makes me so so on edge. Is it literally a case of tough love. We tried a grow bag. She hates it. We tried for ages and she freaked out. I literally feel like throwing my hands up and saying I quit [/quote]
Awe mate! You are not bad at this parenting stuff. It really is just.this.hard! It sounds like you are doing your absolute best with what is a completely overwhelming situation. It will get better. I can identify with so much of your situation, mine was not quite as extreme with the work hours but similar. I live outside the Uk, away from family and didn't have any friends with kids when I had my daughter 4 years ago. My husband is in the service industry too... and let's just say chef life is not ideal for dad life. I worked days, we traded. It is fucking hard!

My advice is a little different from previous posters, but this is what worked for me, so I'm sharing -

PPD: Hopfully you can get help? From the GP if the mental health team is taking too long? I took meds for 6 months and it was a game changer. But therapy is good too.

Sleep: I wouldn't try and sleep train right now, you said it spikes your anxiety and you are already exhausted. To do it effectively it involves a plan and dedication and it may or may not work, it really depends on the child. Have a go at co- sleeping. I know lots of people will disagree with that, but in my experience it is the best way for everyone to get some sleep NOW. If it doesn't work for you long term you can address that once you are a little more rested and are feeling more on top of things. You might find you like it though. I spent the first year of my daughter's life trying desperately to 'teach her how to sleep'- sleep consultants, various forms of sleep training, 'self soothing'... nothing worked and I ended up with nasty postpartum depression and a tired, clingy baby. Finally gave up and brought her in to bed with me at age 1 and we all slept. And it felt great.

The play pen: I actually don't think this is a shit idea. I think it's really smart- it's good to have a totally safe space in your home, where you can put the baby and step away if you need to. When you are frazzled and running on empty sometimes the safest thing to do is to step away from the baby (like step outside for a moment), breath and regroup. They might not like it and will show you that by crying. But they will be safe. Check out Janet Lansbury's podcast unruffled. She has really good advice about this. I'm not going to lie...she is very smug and American... and a lot of her stuff makes me roll my eyes, but she has a really good approach about learning to get comfortable with your child 'expressing their feelings' ie crying when you put them down.

It's ok for your baby to cry in her play pen sometimes. You have to make her dinner and get some stuff done and to do that safely you need two hands. It's just soooooo hard to hear right? Well JL has some great advice on how to manage this, respectfully. Baby wearing is great too but sometimes we just get so touched out and need a contact free moment.

Long term it sounds like changing your work set up would be better, but it's easier said then done. Good luck. It will get easier.

[MinnieJackson]

[quote wiggleshasmylife]@Gianttoadstool she doesn't go anywhere else. I work from 3 am till 1 pm. Husband works from 3 ish till midnight ish. And we swap. Covid wiped out our savings so we can't afford childcare. We've been on furlough and maternity..no family nearby. Nothing we can do unfortunately [/quote]
When do you sleep? Do you get a couple of hours a day together?
I really feel for you. Our eldest never, ever slept. It's so distessing. You are definitely not a bad parent! Have you tried co-sleepling? Can you get a little walker if she's ready for it, so she doesn't have to be in the play pen? She could watch you cook maybe? Is She just as happy with your DH as with you?

[ZooKeeper19]

@wiggleshasmylife sling sling sling - get her in a sling so she gets sleep. You are NOT a bad parent. Parenting and working full time is working two jobs AND MORE so please please be very kind to yourself.

I feel you. No sleep. No money. No energy. Nothing to look forward to. I have been there too. It does get better.

One more thing. Get rid of the playpen and let the child climb and fall. She will not do herself any injury trying to stand up and falling over. They all do that and they all learn that way. They climb, they fall, they get scrapes and bruises and the older she gets the more she will be bumped so please do not worry about this at all, it is completely normal.

Once she gets to sleep on her own, you re-settle by patting their back, bum, but not sleeping on you at 10m, that's brutal. You need YOUR sleep. But start by having her to nap, which will massively improve her night sleep which will help you in the long run.

[GiantToadstool]

Absolutely you are not a bad mum. You are trying to parent in an impossible situation.

Bum pats didn't work for us for either child really (one turned out to have sleep apnea, the other slept fine when older) all children are different. We gave in and coslept after trying the whole nocry(misnamed) sleep solution book! However working on a childs sleep needs you both to have time and enery and routine which you cant do if literally handing over in the middle of the night.

[wiggleshasmylife]

So.i had a long long chat with my husband. We have got rid of the Play pen and we are going to start a proper bedtime routine..my anxiety tells me to never leave her to self soothe or let her cry in case she hates me which I know.is just the anxiety talking. Its so so hard. I've got a sling suitable so I'm gonna give it a try. Thanks for the help.