What would you think if you saw this at your baby's nursery?

[jorange5]

Following on from the incident at DD's last nursery www.mumsnet.com/Talk/2320/408153 I am looking for an alternative one.

Now, I realise that I am a bit hypersensitive after what has happened but DD went for a trial morning at her new nursery and I was not too impressed.

Last time we visited all the babies looked happy and content and there were 5 babies and 2 carers. This time though there were 6 babies and one more to come in so i asked if more staff were coming and they said yes. Three of the babies were crying non-stop but they said it was because they are tired and grumpy. I returned 2 hours later to find 8 babies including DD and the same 2 carers. One was doing nappies, the other was spoon-feeding a little boy. The 5 other babies were crying their eyes out (DD was happily playing).

I have a few concerns about this:
1 - The staff to baby ratio
2 - The crying babies, which i realise is because of the lack of staff
3 - The baby being spoon-fed was sitting in a car seat and was therefore semi-reclined.

Is this sort of thing to be expected and am I just expecting too much? DD is very easy going and will just run around pleasing herself generally (which i think was the reason she got a bit neglected at her last nursery) so I don't think she would get upset but does it all seem a bit indicative of a general lack of care?

Any thoughts? Sorry for the ramble!

[JodieG1]

I wouldn't be happy with that. I have no idea what a nursery is usually like as I've never used one but I would not be happy with that at all. I would hate the thought of my baby crying and noone picking him up.

[shreddies]

I'm no expert at all but it doesn't sound great to me. If your instincts are telling you it's not right then I would go with them.

[FlightAttendant]

Sounds horrifying. Please I know you probably won't, but please don't leave your child where nobody takes any notice if she cries

[Tamdin]

hate to be mrs doom and gloom as i know there are lots of very good nurseries around but ime the problems you listed can be common place. the nursery i worked in based ratios on staff in the building but throughout the day someone can be doing nappies, someone else has gone to the loo (and skives for 20 mins) etc etc and at times i was left alone with 6 babies all of whom weer crying. the best thing to do with any nursery is turn up at random times of the day if at all possible when they are not expecting you.

[FlightAttendant]

I've never used a nursery, are they all like this???

[Lazarou]

If you aren't happy then keep looking until you find one you are happy with. Feeding a baby in a car seat sounds a bit strange.

[FlightAttendant]

And I thought my children had a hard time getting under my feet all day at home...

I can't believe this is commonplace! What is the government thinking, trying to get all of us to put our babies in nurseries like this so we can go to work?

No wonder there is a youth violence problem.

[FlightAttendant]

Sorry, rant rant

[pinkrangernowwobbles]

Have you thought about a childminder, I know some nurseries are really good but never considered one when DS was little, Looked at childminders instead ?

[StrawberryMartini]

Get a childminder! (slightly biased view). We are only allowed three under 5s, and only one of which can be under 1.

[brandnewpumpkin]

No, they're not all like that, but maybe sometimes some of them get like that if lots of things happen at once. 1:3 I think is the ratio of carers to babies - but you might get that with a childminder too, presumably? I think an unannounced visit - but maybe more than one to get a balanced view - is a good idea, and go with your gut instinct. Both my children went to nursery from under 1 year old and, as far as I know, are not looking like turning into violent youths.
FA - huge, unhelpful generalisation there.

[brandnewpumpkin]

Cross-post, there's your answer on childminder ratios.

[clairejo]

I don't think you are expecting too much. ds1 has been in nursery since 6months 9 he is now 3) and loves it. I used to turn up at random times and I have never seen children being left to cry. I have observed the carer ratio not being observed to the letter if one is getting a bottle ready, washing up etc but is just outside the room to be called. Maybe it is was just an off day. turn up at random times to see if this is the norm.

[FlightAttendant]

Sorry. It was most unhelpful. I shall shut up and go away.

[dirtmonkey]

Please keep looking at other nurseries. You will find a good one. I would ask about staff turnover as this can be quite a good indication of how 'good/bad' a nursery is. If the nursery is a happy place to be then generally speaking staff turnover is low. Do trust your instincts, if you aren't 100% happy with what you see while you are there for trial mornings then cross the nursery off your list.

My DD has been in nursery since 11 months (she is 2) and I am now very happy with her care. She has recently moved nursery because we were concerned about the care she was receiving. She is like your DD and will just get on with things & I sometimes think in a bad nursery LOs like this will get overlooked.

I hope you are lucky, like me, and find a nursery which will help your DD to thrive and not just be a place to leave her while you work. Good luck.

[FlightAttendant]

I only meant if the nursery left kids to cry most of the day - and I'm sure not all of them do...

[yama]

I chose the first nursery I visited for my dd. When I first visited (unannounced) the atmosphere was lovely. Happy children in the various rooms, happy staff, lots of laughter and no crying.

I enquired about staff turnover, if staff in my dd's room worked every day, food, routine, types of indoor/outdoor play etc.

One year on and I am very happy with my dd's care. I speak with the staff every day - they know my expectations and preferences and most importantly they know my dd very well. She speaks excitedly about the other toddlers and staff when at home.

So, no in answer to your op you are definitely not expecting too much.

[peskipixie]

no they are not all like this, the one i used always had enough staff on and i never saw a crying baby left unattended. i turned up at all times of the day as i didnt stick to session times so i thinki had a realistic view of what was going on. however the waiting list was as long as your arm, to get a 3 month old baby in you had to get them on the waiting list well before they were born.

if you dont love a place dont leave your child there, you will only spend the whole time worrying about them. i wouldnt use that nursery

[TrinityRhino]

dd2 has been going to a nursery since she was 11 months old and as now 2 and a half.
I have seen the 'baby room' and the next room (2 to 3yrs) and never have aI seen what you have experienced.
It is definietly an issue when there are babies just left to cry. I would say that there is not enough staff at all and would not be happy sending my child there. |I hope you soon find somewhere you feel comfortable with

[jorange5]

I haven't signed up for this nursery yet, we have another trial morning on monday when I will see the manager and voice my concerns. The ratio is meant to be 1:3 so i don't know what was going on there.

The thing is, most of the nurseries in our area (north west wales) are full for under 2s until next year and I have to get DD some care ASAP. There is another one with a space but i don't like the huge impersonal room that the babies are in there, however, I think I will reconsider it if Monday goes as badly as today did.

I would LOVE to get DD to a childmider. There is a lovely woman nearby but we can't afford her. She is the same price as nursery but she doesn't take childcare vouchers and they save us 40% of the cost. Also, she wont cook lunch so i would have to make a lunch for DD the night before and take it with her (I study in the evenings so this would be a right pain).

I don't know if it is different in Wales but for a childminder they are allowed 5 kids - 2 under 18 months apparently but this childmider only has 3.

[yama]

I'd also like to add that I pick up my dd anytime between 3.35 and 6 as I'm a teacher so I suppose I arrive unannounced every day.

[MrsBoo]

No that sounds terrible. All nurseries have to comply with very strict regulations, which include the staff:child ratios. It is normally a different ratio for the under 2's and then another for 2-5's and then over 5's or afterschool type care.
Nurseries have to be inspected regulary, and as a parent I have been asked to complete a survey on our nursery.
It might be different in some parts of UK, but you can usually ask for a report from whoever does the inspection. For instance a local authority or OFSTED etc.

Registration - England
The office for Standards in Education (OFSTED) is responsible for the regulation and inspection against National Standards for under eights day care and childminding. OFSTED has nine regional centres in England. Tel: 0845 601 4771

Copies of the National Standards can be obtained from the Department of Education and Skills.
Tel: 0845 602 2260
www.surestart.gov.uk

I have used a day nursery for both my DC, for 7 years now, and have never experienced anything like that in the baby room or anywhere else. And we can call in at any time to check!

[jorange5]

There are no OFSTED inspections in Wales. Does anyone else know what goes on instead?

[lemonaid]

DS's nursery always had more staff than required -- they had one adult for every two babies in the baby room. I would not be happy with that level of staffing.

The body in Wales is Estyn.

[jorange5]

The report is all about eduction - doesn't say anything about under 2s at all!