Call me Mary Whitehouse but this makes me sick

[Caligyulea]

number of men willing to pay for sex has doubled

In view of the fact that women from Eastern Europe are being enslaved so that dirty men can pay money to have sex with them, I think men who have sex with Eastern European prostitutes should bloody well be prosecuted for rape. That'd make 'em a bit less willing to take a liberal view of abusing women.

Here's another link

plight of the cellar girls

[NotQuiteCockney]

I thought Mary Whitehouse was all about stopping evil media? This is a bit more concrete.

I'm generally a bit puzzled by prostitution in general: why sleep with someone who doesn't want to sleep with you? But even more puzzled by this sort: why sleep with someone who has to be imprisoned to sleep with you?

[NotQuiteCockney]

To be fair, I think it's that the number of men actually paying for sex has doubled. These men probably always were willing to pay for it?

And one bit of progress, I gather they're not treating the women as illegal immigrants, so much?

[northerner]

Women choosing to do it is very different to women being forced to do it.

I'm all for legalising prostitution and making it much safer for the working girls.

[edam]

Agree with you Caligulyea - it is slavery and any man who plays a part in it is as guilty as a plantation-owner in the southern states of the US in the days before abolition.

[Caligyulea]

Women choosing to do it. I'm always very sceptical about that. How many prostitutes actually make a genuinely free choice to be a prostitute, rather than get a better job? Not many, I bet.

Men who visit prostitutes who tell themselves the woman is a prostitute because she's freely chosen to do it and she wants to are so kidding themselves.

Most prostitutes are prostitutes because there aren't any better options available to them. Most women given better options, don't freely choose to become prostitutes.

[northerner]

Some women choose to do it because they can earn more money than cleaning toilets or stacking shelves. It might seem crazy to you or I that some women do choose this 'career', but they do.

Oldest profession in the book and will always be around. Unfortunaltley.

[cod]

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[Caligyulea]

But they're generally not controlled by pimps northerner.

And the ones who are, are just not doing it out of choice.

I hope that legalising prostitutions doesn't mean legalising pimps.

[edam]

But the point is many, many prostitutes are trafficked here from Eastern Europe - all of them in Soho, according to the vice squad. They didn't choose, they are slaves. It's just as shocking and evil as slavery on the sugar plantations.

[thecattleareALOHing]

It has always involved slavery, rape, horrific levels of violence (there is barely a prostitute alive that hasn't been beaten up in the course of her 'work') and exploitation.
IMO, it's not a 'job' anymore than being part of a shoplifting gang is a 'job', except the latter is less hard on the 'worker'.

[NotQuiteCockney]

I mostly agree with you, Caligula. But of course, if prostitution is illegal and stigmatised, then women who are prostitutes are stuck.

I really don't understand why it's legal for me to sell my cooking skills or typing skills, but not sexual skills?

[thecattleareALOHing]

They aren't selling their skills though. They are just selling their anuses, mouths and vaginas.

[northerner]

Surely is it worse though because it is run underground? The sex industry is massive as there are always men willing to pay for sex wether we like it or not. Surely legalising prostitution will make it safer for the working girls. And I mean legal, safe brothels, not legalising soliciting.

[NotQuiteCockney]

Well, the sex slavery thing is just horrible, I'm not arguing that.

But from what I know, the more expensive sort of prostitutes are often selling their conversational and sexual skills, rather than just renting out orifices.

If women had better options, but prostitution was entirely legal and destigmatised, would there still be prostitutes? No idea. (Maybe, if women having sex when they felt like it was safe and not stigmatised, men would be able to have casual sex with women more easily, and wouldn't want prostitutes?)

[NotQuiteCockney]

Certainly if the sex industry were legal, these girls would find getting help easier. They wouldn't be trying to get help, while doing something illegal (against their will, but that's another thing). Would they know prostitution was legal here, though?

[Caligyulea]

The more expensive kind of prostitute, who control their income and what clients they accept, are in the minority though.

The majority of prostitution is done because a man orders it. Prostitution is all about women's powerlessness and men's power.

[Normsnockers]

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[walkinginawinterBundleland]

the women i see on the streets are all drug addicts. they are there to make money to support their habit. no one would want to do the "job" of prostitution, it's often dangerous and reduces what should be a loving act to a transaction involving fear and power.

[NotQuiteCockney]

Absolutely.

But if prostitution were legal, then it would be easier to go after those men.

I'm not entirely comfortable with prostitution being legal ... waitressing is legal, and most waitresses are bossed about by men. And of course, having "licensed" prostitution has historically been an excuse for great victimisation of prostitutes ...

[walkinginawinterBundleland]

Bit of double standards here, in story re: legal brothel in Australia

[Normsnockers]

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[Normsnockers]

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[Caligyulea]

That story from Oz is typical. It's disgusting to be a prostitute, but not to visit one? Eh?

[MyXmasPuddingSixpenceworth]

Normsnockers - would they have BOGOF offers, like Tesco?

[MyXmasPuddingSixpenceworth]

Shame on me for joke in bad taste on serious discussion. I'm sorry.

Getting my coat.....