Approaching this correctly?

[Vretz]

First time post on here.

Recently split from my long time fiancée after she experienced a recent bereavement. We have 2 kids and split twice before.

She's become very close to a female friend, and i got a little jealous over time as i felt ignored and neglected. It ultimately resulted in me not so nicely asking her to leave 1 night as it was 11pm and the kids kept getting woken up. Sadly she lost the family member the following day so i got the blame for being insensitive as this family member was on his last days and i basically lost it after working, doing school run, dealing with a 2yr old, mice in the loft and a demanding dog. It was a mistake on my end.

Since then, she's blanked me, and moved out 2 months back taking the kids. I live in the family home, jointly owned, but im the breadwinner and she's always been good primary caregiver. I'm the enemy of her family and friends now.

She and her family now insist i should move out so she can move back in with the kids, however the solicitor says dont as my ex is also denying me visitation with the children.

I've offered mediation but she's refused, spoken to our GP as she was having treatment for depression. I think it'd be horrendous to put her and the kids through a court battle.

What's the best thing to do?

[Modestandatinybitsexy]

The best thing to do is what's right for the children. You're not married so how are you going to split your assets? Who is likely to stay in the house or is it most likely to be sold? Are you paying child support? Does she have a job to fall back on or did she give it up to provide you with children and childcare? Make sure she gets what's fair and try and keep emotions out of it, you need a working relationship for the kids.

[Vretz]

Declaration of trust on the house, basically 50/50 but i get a lump sum first with the remainder split.

We have a joint account, so ive always topped that up and still do so, but she's not using the funds. I pay her share of the mortgage/rent etc which I've always done.

She was furloughed but has a lower paying job, but she has in some ways given up her dreams for the kids/us as my job earned a higher income. I can't fault her for that, and it says a lot about her!

On the children, this is where im so confused as I feel I'm offering something fair, but am I? My suggestion was the kids moving home 7 days a week, and she lives there half the time, me the remainder. We both have family nearby to stay with.

She's saying she's thinking of the children, yet she refuses to let them see me?

At the same time, we both want them back in their family home, but 1 minute she wants her name off the house, the next she wants to be in it with me out?!

[roarfeckingroar]

Let your children move back into their home. You're being incredibly selfish to stop this and not support her

[CandyLeBonBon]

So you asked her to leave 'not so nicely' because you were jealous?

I'm guessing that's a very tidied up version of events. Perhaps the kids don't want to see you?

And yes. She should live in the house. Sell it when children have grown up.

It feels like there's a lot more to this than you're saying and I'm guessing it wouldn't paint you in a very good light.

[Vretz]

They aren't being stopped. She is refusing them moving back unless she can come back with them and i move out?

So her view is I should indefinitely pay for the house, maintenance, never see the kids and somehow find a new place?

[RandomMess]

Her demands are unreasonable particularly the not letting you see the DC based on the facts as given.

I would start court proceedings to establish contact seeing as though she is refusing all contact.

[RedRed9]

If she’s refusing to give you contact then how else do you expect to be able to see your children except going through the courts?

[Vretz]

@CandyLeBonBon
We've had a rough 18 months (both changing jobs twice, bereavement, buying the house, toddler etc). I've been doing therapy for depression/anxiety since August 2019 as I just burnt out. It was her friend i asked to go who refused to leave and was constantly round until late/texting constantly. Basically had a toddler tantrum as I wasn't getting enough attention. Not my proudest moment and I apologised the next day!

The children have said they want to see me as we have a great relationship.

[roarfeckingroar]

I bet her side of the story is very different

[Vretz]

On what basis?

[CandyLeBonBon]

Ok op thanks for clarifying. Sounds like a slow burning problem though and one that you have both contributed to?

[Vretz]

Yeah @CandyLeBonBon definitely. The point of the post was basically an AIBU.

In my eyes, I'd want to be able to give her the house with the kids and pay for it, but I can't do it for long financially. On the other side, I miss my kids. It's the fact she's rejected mediation entirely that's thrown me.

Would anyone reject mediation to at least have a chance to lay down the outcome they want to an impartial person?

[CandyLeBonBon]

When emotions are high usually at the beginning of a split, and both parties are coming at the situation from opposing corners each with their own grievances it's very hard to avoid point scoring.

As anonymous randomers on the internet, we don't know the ins and outs of the things that have led to the demise of your relationship. Only you know that.

My now ex told me his exW was withholding access. He played a very good game of showing me how sad he was. Turns out his kids didn't want to because they were scared of him and he ended up having to see them in a contact centre.

My point is that two people often have differing accounts of events. The truth is usually somewhere in the middle.

The fact remains that she is the primary carer of your children and if you want to see your children you also have to recognise that she, for whatever reason, doesn't trust you or feels that you owe her something.

So you need to work out what that something is.
People are rarely 100% monsters. Usually there is an erosion of trust on both sides that causes people to decamp to the default of it don't trust you'

It comes from a place of fear.

You have to be honest with yourself about how you contributed to this mess.

You also have to acknowledge that you have no control over her reaction.

So what would be a good compromise? Unless she's genuinely psychotic or struggling with mental health issues, you probably both know what is at the root of the problem. So start thinking about how you can alleviate that rather than go on the attack. Take some time to think, suggest you both put your egos aside and suggest you look at it from a child centric perspective.

[CandyLeBonBon]

And in my experience mediation is often rejected because things have gone too far to feel safe or too hurt to be in a room with the other party.

[Vretz]

@CandyLeBonBon you know what, that was just the kind of input i was after. Thank you.

[Vretz]

So by logic, safety & pain are the reasons.
Offering mediation separately would acknowledge she may feel hurt?
In terms of safety, offering supervised visitation is an olive branch saying 'I will earn your trust'?

I am a bit of a typical fella... Not always so great with this side of things

[Selfsettling3]

What is best for your children at the moment, consider their parents have split up and they are in lock down? Is it better for them to be stay where they are or in there familiar family home?

[Vretz]

Probably where they are as they are settling into her parents home. I would say the best thing is them seeing us both, as they are used to it. I guess I am forcing the issue with courts etc (maybe even mediation) when really asking for phone calls and a video call is sufficient to build that trust.

[Selfsettling3]

Really? How long have they been there for? I would always assume their own home would be better for them. Obviously seeing your kids and the finances also need sorting out.

[Vretz]

2 months. She wasn't speaking to me at all for the first 3 weeks. Lockdown happened and there was suddenly this demand to move back. It's worth mentioning it was her dad we lost, so part of this feels grief led/needing space, which is why I am so undecided over court orders.

I feel I'd inflict more pain on her, and the kids would see that which isn't good for them. At the same time, is it good for them to be out their normal home when their mum has stopped treatment for depression (yet seems ok - not convinced). I don't want the kids to feel abandoned if I do nothing and wait it out, relying on phone calls to keep in touch.

[Keepthebloodynoisedown]

My suggestion was the kids moving home 7 days a week, and she lives there half the time, me the remainder. We both have family nearby to stay with.

This sounds like a terrible idea, it’s important to have your own space, and it would be really confusing for the kids that it’s sometimes mums house and sometimes dads house.

[FrippEnos]

Vretz

The reason why the solicitor is saying don't move out is because of what candy has posted and she will be in the house till the children leave education. (not grown up)

This could be university and it would tie in your trust 50% for that long.

This could stop you buying a property or even renting a decent sized flat/house.

So talk and listen to your solicitor.

[Oliversmumsarmy]

There are 2 issues

Firstly with regard to the house I wouldn’t be moving atm

Your solicitor is right you shouldn’t move out.
You can’t do anything until this is over

Then you can either buy her out of her share or sell up and split what is left.

On a separate issue you need to get to see your children.

I would be pursuing that now.

[z0fl0ra]

You’ve asked this on the wrong site as you’re going to get the man haters out in full force telling you to move out your house and stay with family let your ex and kids move back in and keep giving her money, don’t do this, you have a right to see your kids and you have a right to the 50% of your house even if this means selling it, she’s acting appallingly using the kids as a weapon against you, court is the only option if she won’t let you se them, what you suggested made complete sense but until she agrees do not leave your house!

[Friendsofmine]

I can't imagine my partner doing that to me whilst my loved one was dying. I would feel so hurt and then going through the bereavement process and trying to get out of bed every day and care for the children would be enough to cope with. It is presumably early days and if the children heard you say horrible things on the night in question maybe it's too raw for them too.

Can you move out and return to the legal process in a few months once she has had some breathing space? That would be the kind thing to do.