"I'm not my feelings"

[ahumanfemale]

Came across this page in the book "Me and My Feelings" by Vanessa Green Allen.

It occurred to me that a clear way to undermine the trans and gender ideology heaped in kids is this. The example of reframing "I'm angry" to "I'm feeling angry" applied to gender is fabulous.

"I'm non-binary" to "I feel non-binary" is quite a marked change. Same with gender descriptors for sex, whether "matching" or different.

If kids are taught that their is a difference between feelings and who they actually are, then naturally there will be some critical thought re gender identities...

[midegbabe]

This is a a review of research and suggests that innate is much more likely than socially induced for homosexuality

https://www.researchgate.net/profile/PaulVasey/publication/3016390755SexualOrientationnControversyandd_Science/links/577c303a08ae355e74f16c18/Sexual-Orientation-Controversy-and-Science.pdf?origin=publication_detail

[Goosefoot]

I don't really see it as an either or question. From my own knowledge of myself, along with my experience talking to other people, my sense is that there are any number of things that play a role.

That research is interesting in terms of how they define sexuality, they suggest there are four factors, and the ones they list seem fairly common sense. In practice I think people use all of these at times to talk about sexuality, so it tends to be broadly defined in practice.

But anyway, the point is it's bad form to prefer a particular explanation because a different one might lead people to conclusions you don't like. The question is whether an explanation is true, not whether it means people will accept your policy conclusions.

[Qcng]

12SapphosRock

My point is few gay people would be able to live a fulfilling and happy lives if they were unable to respond to their homosexual feelings. And they want these feelings validated by having gay equality - ie same sex marriage recognised.

Similarly people with strong feelings of gender dysphoria find peace and comfort in transitioning to the gender they identify with and seek validation via the GRA.

I'll just pick up on this, and say, in a healthy functioning society, we all want everyone to be able to make choices, live as their true self, love who they want, wear whatever they want, but there are also boundaries and social norms, and a system of agreement.

You can't walk around naked, for example.
People will laugh and point if you go around wearing a dog mask, or if you wear pyjamas at work. Etc... Etc.
Even if the person claims "I feel much more comfortable in my pyjamas. Pyjamas help me think more clearly and I am more productive" you just don't do it.

Likewise, with people suffering gender dysphoria. They may get comfort from getting other people to use counter-intuitive pronouns for them. They may get comfort from changing their name, and so on. But it crosses a line when others around them are expected to actually believe that the person is the opposite sex, in every situation.
There needs to be a function of agreement.

Being gay is a fact. Someone wants to marry someone of the same sex. It's cool. No one else is affected in the slightest.

With gender dysphoria, everyone around that person is expected to make believe and pretend things to accommodate the person's identity, which directly has an impact on everyone else, it's completely different to being gay.

[Qcng]

12SapphosRock

My point is few gay people would be able to live a fulfilling and happy lives if they were unable to respond to their homosexual feelings. And they want these feelings validated by having gay equality - ie same sex marriage recognised.

Similarly people with strong feelings of gender dysphoria find peace and comfort in transitioning to the gender they identify with and seek validation via the GRA.

I'll just pick up on this, and say, in a healthy functioning society, we all want everyone to be able to make choices, live as their true self, love who they want, wear whatever they want, but there are also boundaries and social norms within a system of agreement.

You can't walk around naked, for example.
People will laugh and point if you go around wearing a permanent dog mask, or if you wear pyjamas at work. Etc... Etc.
Even if the person claims "I feel much more comfortable in my pyjamas. Pyjamas help me think more clearly and I am more productive" you just don't do it.

Likewise, with people suffering gender dysphoria. They may get comfort from getting other people to use counter-intuitive pronouns for them. They may get comfort from changing their name, and so on. But it crosses a line when others around them are expected to actually believe that the person is the opposite sex, in every situation.
There needs to be a function of agreement.

Being gay is a fact. Someone wants to marry someone of the same sex. It's cool. No one else is affected in the slightest.

With gender dysphoria, everyone around that person is expected to make believe and pretend things to accommodate the person's identity, which directly has an impact on everyone else, it's completely different to being gay.

[Qcng]

Huh.
No idea how that posted twice.