How do you reconcile having a relationship with a man and your feminism, are they fundamentally incompatible?

[Scarletohello]

As I get older and more feminist I find I'm less able to tolerate even casual sexism in a partner. I look back at past relationships and wish I'd had MN to help me leave dysfunctional relationships. I'm currently single and feel like my standards are so high now in regards to what kind of behaviour I'm prepared to (not) tolerate that I despair of ever being able to have a relationship with a man again where I can feel equal, respected and with someone who can understand female oppression. Am I setting my sights too high? How do you square being a feminist with having a relationship with a man who has been raised in a world of male privilege and entitlement..?

[AsAMan]

I'm sure I've read 70% of young men watch porn weekly. So if you add in sexist friends and "been to a strip club" that will actually be a really fucking huge percentage of men in OP's defense. Majority at least right? Dh is lovely but one of his long time friends is a massive cunt.

We rarely see him due to distance but if I had that criteria Dh would be out too

[PumpkinGordino]

have the women here compromised? Many have said that he wouldn't be their dp/h without feminist leanings

[peggyundercrackers]

pumpkin given the responses on this thread many women seem to find men who are prepared to step up and the woman aren't doing the majority - both sides have compromised and found what works for them.

[PumpkinGordino]

Obviously it's worked out well for you peggy but the problem with the compromise advice is that for many many women the reality is that they do the vast majority of the compromising and men have to adapt very little. I'm not saying it can't ever happen equally (as your relationship demonstrates), but it very often means the man's needs are met far more frequently than the woman's

I would also say that life is too short to spend it in a relationship with someone who isn't right for you

[Daisy17]

"99% of the male population have either watched porn, been to a strip club or have misogynistic friends"?!!! And then people wonder why women don't want to identify as feminists. Precisely because people would assume they identify with such nutty statements.

[peggyundercrackers]

life is about compromise - for everyone - men and woman alike.

I dont class myself as a feminist and neither does my DH however we both believe in equality (to me feminism isn't about equality though...) - I would never ask him to do something I would not do myself no matter what it is. My views are not more important than his and vice versa - we speak about things and make decisions between us - sometimes it goes my way, sometimes his.

if you aren't prepared to compromise then I think you will find it difficult to find a partner and be happy however I think lifes to short to be anal about every little thing.

[HermioneWeasley]

Most of the women I know have feminist partners, so they can't be that rare

[Sollers]

My partner would probably not describe himself as a feminist, but he acts as one. And he doesn't watch porn because he thinks it's pathetic and disrespectful.

I hate the "he's lying.." posts too. How much of a fool do you take me for?

[Hakluyt]

"My DH is a feminist. I found this statement really depressing

& I would never be with a man who watched porn or went to strip clubs or had misogynist friends. So rules out 99% of the male population for me I guess??

I suppose you believe 99% of women fit some bullshit stereotype too."

I find the statement really depressing too. But if you take Mumsnet as your sample, every time anyone is upset because they discover that their partners have been to a strip club or watch porn there ar always loads of peple piling in saying any man who says he doesn't do those things is lying,that all men watch porn and it's no big deal. And, by extrapolation no wonder if their partner is a humourless, sexually repressed feminist harridan who tries to stop them.....

[Stirrup]

My husband would not identify himself as a feminist although he would say that he believes in gender equality (not sure about the difference between the two...).

Sadly, I think as we have settled into our relationship, I have become more (actively?) feminist whilst DH typically cannot see/does not always want to see my point of view. This seems to have become more of an issue since we had our son.

I am quite happy for DS (3yrs) to explore anything and everything and try really hard to raise him in a gender-equal way whilst dolls, princess dresses, declarations of love for his little friends (male) really make DH squirm. He thinks I go too far.

As much as I don't want it to be the case, I think it has driven a slight wedge between us. But in everything else, he is really fab. He cooks, cleans, changes nappies, picks up DS from childcare... (Although sometimes he needs a prod...)

[maddy68]

I think any relationship had to have compatible values to be successful. That doesn't mean always agreeing but the fundamentals have to be there I think.

[MrsFionaCharming]

When I first met my DP we were students. I was dating someone else, but we had a lot in common and I wanted to be friends. He's naturally very into equality, but like most teenage boys, he did on occasion make comments without really thinking.

So I sort of made him into a bit of a pet project! I'd send him links to articles, and tell him about things that were effecting me / women. By the time I broke up with my girlfriend, I had him pretty much perfect.

We've been together a few years, and he's very into feminism now. He's particularly interested in gender representation in TV/films and is always trying to teach people about the Bechdel test!

Obviously he was close to perfect anyway, I just had to educate him a little. I imagine many men just wouldn't be willing to learn.

[msrisotto]

My poor DH and I were together when I had my feminist epiphany so I think he was socialised into feminism simultaneously as I was discovering it/learning about it myself. Without that, I wonder if he would be aware. As someone said above, he started from the default of being kind and respectful but I think he could have gone on completely oblivious to what it is like for women. His eyes are open now!

[KarmaViolet]

I hadn't seen that particular article - fantastic!

[messyisthenewtidy]

Ah yes that old chestnut!
Have you seen this from Ben Goldacre? www.badscience.net/2007/08/pink-pink-pink-pink-pink-moan/

[KarmaViolet]

Yes exactly that - evolutionary psychology seems to be finding some sexist shit and then saying it's inevitable because of the cavemen. The one I particularly loved (I think it was the Mail, of course) was someone who'd done a paper "explaining" that women prefer pink colours because cave women probably gathered rather than hunted (even though we don't actually know this) and so had to keep an eye out for nice pink berries.

[messyisthenewtidy]

Oh that's really interesting because I'm an avid atheist but I also find the atheist community to be very patriarchal, not surprising when you consider some of the opinions towards women held by Darwin. I also find the emphasis on evolutionary psychology perpetuates sexism: using evolution to explain one's own misinformed opinions on how men/women should behave is no different than using religion IMO.

If it's any help my mum (who is a Christian) and I lovingly disagree all the time in front of DS and it hasn't harmed him. He is aware that it's up to him and actually enjoys the discussions.

[KarmaViolet]

messy Verdict still awaited! We're expecting our first child in 2 weeks and we ended up on the subject of how we'd feel if s/he wanted to become religious*. I was brought up as a Christian and I find the C of E mostly harmless whereas DP is more on the side of militant atheism - I find the Dawkins-style "atheist movement" just as patriarchal only with less excuse! And then we ended up talking about wicca and paganism and other alternative spiritualities and whether those are any better or not.



*These are much easier theoretical conversations than talking about what is actually going to happen in approximately 2 weeks.

[NoArmaniNoPunani]

My DH is a feminist. I found this statement really depressing

& I would never be with a man who watched porn or went to strip clubs or had misogynist friends. So rules out 99% of the male population for me I guess??

I suppose you believe 99% of women fit some bullshit stereotype too.

[FishWithABicycle]

The title question seems to come loaded with a massive and sexist preconception of what men are like. My DH is possibly more enthusiastically feminist than I am!

[ByTheSea]

My husband is a feminist. I wouldn't have it any other way.

[ByTheSea]

My husband

[messyisthenewtidy]

What was the verdict btw?

[messyisthenewtidy]

Bloody hell Karma not at all

I would love to have a DP I could discuss that kind of stuff with. Round here any reference to "the patriarchy", much less its connection to spirituality, would be likely to get you an eye roll and another "that Messy's been thinking too much again"!

[KarmaViolet]

I'm a lesbian

Although in all seriousness I see plenty of misogyny amongst same-sex partners. A female partner doesn't always mean a feminist partner, sadly. I know queer politics are not always popular in feminist circles but I became interested in queer theory after seeing how heteronormative many same-sex relationships could be. Queer theory wasn't the answer to it but it certainly gave me an alternative perspective on it.

Fortunately for me my partner is also a feminist. That doesn't mean we always agree on everything, we've spent the entire evening disagreeing amicably about whether spiritual belief is inevitably linked to a patriarchal structure (that makes me sound even less fun than I already am).