Professor Trelawny in Harry Potter

[hiddenmnetter]

I've been listening to HP on audiobook and have just noticed something:

Loads of trelawny's prophecies come true- she predicts the "lightning struck tower", she predicts the "Grimm" (even if it was actually Sirius) (not to mention her legit prophecies).

Am I wrong?

[CheerfulMuddler]

I love Ron.

Another prediction she gets right - on Christmas Day she says Lupin isn't going to be with them for long, and sure enough he leaves at the end of the year. Although given that Defense Against the Dark Arts teachers ALWAYS last a year, that's a pretty damn safe prediction.

[OlennasWimple]

I agree - amazing story teller and world builder, not a great writer. Doesn't mean that the books aren't brilliant

[PerfumeIsAMessage]

Absolutely an amazing storyteller- and an exceptionally intelligent woman (and I like her politics too!)

But as a writer?

This is an article which our students read as part of developing lit crit thinking- it sums up what I mean. Guardian Article

Her characters' stand-alone speeches/soliloquies though are brilliant- Dumbledore in particular. Ron's one-liners are perfect (I think she writes "Ron" better than any of her other characters- with Bellatrix and Kreacher a close second) I use one of Dumbledore's speeches (along with Steve Jobs and Earl Spencer) when my students have to think about persuasive writing.

Don't get me wrong- I adore the books- and cried more than once during my recent re-read.

[Shadow666]

Ok, well perhaps she is more of an amazing storyteller.

[ProfessorCat]

She's not an amazing writer

Erm... OK

[picklemepopcorn]

Part of that is the immensity and detail of the world she created though. Had they been simpler there would have been less room for error. The strike books are ok, but without the joy and wonder of the HP books. I don't remember being as invested in the plot or characters.

[PerfumeIsAMessage]

She's not an amazing writer- certainly not as far as HP is concerned, but I think she would be if she weren't rushing to meet deadlines and having to churn out massive books every 2 years on a specific date.

I think when you read them back to back (like I just did) it is clear that at times she didn't know where the hell she was going with the plot development which is a shame- there are dozens of pages of seemingly important stuff that turns out to be completely irrelevant, sentences thrown in that make you think "ha! here is a major twist" that dwindles into nothing and not just loopholes, but actual errors- there was a massive thread last year with all the plot "wtfs?"

Not a criticism of her, or of Harry Potter, I adore both. But I bet she's quite frustrated too that she produced what will undoubtedly be the best selling book series ever in the history of the world, but will not go down in history as a "great writer". When actually, she is. When she's given time. (I loved how absolutely perfect all her names were, people, spells, places- her imagination is wonderful)

I have only read one of her Strike novels so far, but I imagine now she's more in control of her writing, it will just get better and better.

[Shadow666]

JK Rowling is such an amazing writer. She wove so much into those books. Very intelligent woman.

[itchywanksocks]

Melj you might just be my favourite person on mn

[SuperBeagle]

Amazing explanation melj

[LikeTheShoes]

That's because Hagrid took him on a 3 day bender on that motorbike.

[stoneagemum]

Major discrepancy is Lilly and James died on 31/10/81 which was a Saturday, but Harry didnt turn up on the Dersleys doorstep until Wednesday morning

[WhatToDoAboutThis2017]

According to the Harry Potter wiki, Harry started Hogwarts in 1991.

harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/1991

Nicholas' DeathDay party was a year later, in 1992.

harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Nicholas_de_Mimsy-Porpington%27s_five-hundredth_Deathday_Party

The Lexicon agrees with this, though it does note a few discrepancies in particular days.

legacy.hp-lexicon.org/timelines/calendars/calendar_ps.html

[ProfessorCat]

Yep, the Deathday Party was in the second book, 1992. Not a month after Harry started at Hogwarts.

[stoneagemum]

Harry attended the death day party when he was 12, inthe CoS 1992 as it was hallowe'en

[ProfessorCat]

Harry was 11 in 1991 and started Hogwarts in 1991.

[stoneagemum]

Oops 11 in 1991

[stoneagemum]

If he was born I. 1980 he was 11 in 1981

[melj1213]

That time line doesn't work, Harry was a first year in September 1991 going by the death date of James and Lilly

Trust me, the timeline works - James and Lily died on October 31st 1981 - Harry was 15 months old (Sirius bough him a toy broom for his first birthday while they were in hiding from Voldemort) therefore he was born in July 1980 and was 11 on July 31st 1992 and started Hogwarts on September 1st of that year, a month later it was Nearly Headless Nick's 500th Deathday party..

[LikeTheShoes]

Harry and Ron's rubbish that they make up for divination homework in GoF all comes true too!

Harry predicts that he be "In danger of Burns."
5 minutes later he's fighting a dragon

Harry predicts that he will "Lose a treasured possession." And Ron predicts he will be "submerged in water"
Task 2 of the Tri Wizard tournament is Harry retrieving Ron from the bottom of the Lake.


Harry predicts that he will get "Stabbed in the back by someone he thought to be his friend."

He thought Barty Crouch was his friend Moody, but actually he was the one who betrayed him.

Harry predicts that he will "Come off worse in a fight."
And he kind of does in that fight with Voldermort at the end of that book...

[LottieDoubtie]

'Original HP ink- reinventing memories'

Hilarious piece of advertising at the end of the thread.

Thanks for posting this OP I love indulging my HP love by reading clever people's analysis of the books.

[stoneagemum]

Harry was born 31 July 1980, as he was over 1 year old when James and Lilly died, making him 11 in 1991 as one of the youngest of his year as hog warts has the same intake as English schools - unless we were all mistaken with 19 years later day earlier this year?

[stoneagemum]

That time line doesn't work, Harry was a first year in September 1991 going by the death date of James and Lilly

[melj1213]

Yes, JKR has said on numerous occasions that sometimes names she chose because they "sounded right" or fit the character later had a lot of significant meaning that either she hadn't known at the time and had turned out to be happy coincidences or turned out to be because she had vaguely remembered them from something she'd read/studied in passing.

Also the HP fandom was one that grew up during the technical age - we were one of the first fandoms that grew up on the internet in "real time" - yes Tolkein/Star Wars fans etc have significant online presences but all of their canon is closed ... HP fans were getting together from all over the world while the series was ongoing.

So when it came to the now infamous "Three-Year Summer" (the 3 year wait between GoF and OoTP was unprecedented as the first four books had come out annually before that) it lead to a boom in the fandom and many fans turned to fansites/fanfiction and forums to get their Potter fix and that wait meant that fans had time to analyse the books to death - for example the entire series was put into a "real time" timeline based off Nearly Headless Nick's 500th Deathday ... one throwaway line in the first book about it being Nearly Headless Nick's 500th Deathday on Halloween and that he died in 1492 gave someone enough information to work out an entire timeline - so Harry's first year was in 1992, when he was 11 so he must have been born in 1980, so his parents died in 1981 etc etc

So when it came to looking into JKR's use of Latin and mythology there was a lot of analysis/overanalysis of everything and she was more than happy to admit that the fans worked harder than she did when it came to research (JKR readily admitted that if she didn't have her notes to hand she would look stuff up on the HP Lexicon website because it was so extensive and in depth)

[picklemepopcorn]

I'm interested in how the subconscious is expressed in writing. Often there is far more content than the author has realised. Readers also make connections themselves, which is interesting too! An English tutor did a literary critique on a chapter of a well known author's novel and found all sorts of the things the author hadn't considered.