Awful class really getting me down

[itisfarfromperfectnow]

I have them p5 Friday and I start every weekend in such a horrible mood as a result.

They butt in constantly and when one does it starts a whole chain of nonsense with kids calling across the room at one another.

The walking around ... a number of them think absolutely nothing of getting out of their seats and walking around when I’m speaking. When I tell them to take their seat they get enraged and tell me why they were out of the seat (usually putting something in the bin) despite this the classroom always looks like a bomb has hit it when they’ve been in.

They are so bloody rude and aggressive to me, it really gets me down.

Constant noise, even when they aren’t talking someone will be banging on the desk or leaning back in their chair pulling the remaining chair towards them and smacking it into the desk repeatedly.

Someone always urgently needs to go to the toilet (I’m not the teacher toilet troll, I promise) and argue and scream at me. Same with being ill and needing to go to the first aid room.

If I dare show any signs of annoyance or irritation with this they get very offender and discuss loudly how rude I apparently am.

I’m utterly sick to death of it.

[noblegiraffe]

Oh I’ve been there, it was awful. By Christmas I was ready to walk, tbh.

Things got slightly better after Christmas, not entirely sure why.

I understand why you are dubious about classroom management suggestions of silent work etc as it would have been a non-starter for my lot too.

I’d never seen anything like it. They were almost manageable the rest of the time, and P1 were actually teachable, but Fri P5 was a zoo. They all hated each other (like, fights out of lessons hated) and then they decided that they hated me too (normally I get on well with my classes).

Teaching from the front was just awful, so they had a booklet to do when they came in (if they were all sat in their seats and had done a handful of questions after 15 minutes I’d take that as a win). Then some teaching, then more worksheets, easy stuff, lots of 1 mark questions.

Then herd them out and go home and drink.

Fun stuff would have been a nightmare, ditto anything practical, interactive, or computer based. So easy worksheets it was.

[likeafishneedsabike]

What a great description of what it is like to teach a class like this. Hell. Without a proper behaviour system, to support you, I would go down the line of carrot and stick. They have four lessons pw and everyone in the class is aiming for a ‘full house’ on the thank you board (or whatever system you prefer). That will win them a positive postcard/email home/phone call home. But it has to be every lesson, including Friday afternoon. Any calling out, leaning on chairs or cross classroom chat and they can kiss that reward goodbye. Meantime, anyone who goes in your ‘book’ for the fore mentioned crimes, then God help them. Parents will receive an unbelievably shitty letter in the first class post.
I am no expert myself but I have seen this approach work way better than detentions. What do you think?

[noblegiraffe]

That does assume that the parents will be supportive.

[Cantsleeppast3am]

I'm not a teacher but if the parents aren't supportive you're fucked whatever you do???

[likeafishneedsabike]

True, Noble. However, the parents seemed to get behind this far more than a detention. The letter I refer to includes a list of crimes spelt out in black and white. Far less opportunity for the child to make their own version of events, and much clearer than a phone call IME.

[noblegiraffe]

Honestly this thread is giving me flashbacks. If I hadn’t been so experienced and knew for sure that the problem was them and not me, I’d have quit teaching.

OP, you have my total sympathy. Keep on complaining about their behaviour to your HOD and higher. Cry if you have to - if you see them 4 times a week you’re a core subject and they can’t afford to have you go off with stress? It might make them realise that the problem is serious.

[PixieN]

You need more support from above. When I had a class like this, I divided my board into two sides: positive and negative. If a student did something well, they were on the positive side and earned merits/rewards especially if they got up to +2 or +3 during the lesson. This could mean a note in planners, stickers, postcard home or chocolate prize for the best work/best behaviour. Any negative behaviour, such as shouting out etc would be recorded too as a warning. They had 2 warnings, but if it got to 3, they’d be removed from the lesson and this would equate to an automatic detention and/or phone call home. If they messed about in the lunchtime detention, it would mean an after school detention run by SLT. You do have to have a decent behaviour policy in place and may have to arrange sending pupils out in advance though - if not with supportive SLT than another colleague or colleagues where you can send pupils to work quietly in the back of their classroom. Then you can start to build relationships. I remember a hideous Y8 group where I had to remove 6 pupils at one point! 😳 It did get better though. You have my sympathy - it’s awful when you get behaviour like that. P5 on a Friday is also the worst time to teach!

[Piggywaspushed]

I used to have a class like this on Tuesday afternoons.

Tbh, you may not be able to change them, so might need strategies to help your stress levels.

Two things I did, with a modicum of success : reminded myself it was an hour of my life . Said to myself 'it'll all be over in 56 minutes' and made a conscious effort to go in smiling, which, to an extent worked. I managed to convince them that I loved them...

Getting up and wandering around is a red line to me. I would either move the bin next to me (since I doubt they want to come to me!) or remove the bon from them and deal with mess at the end by walking around with it.

[churchandstate]

This sounds like a failure at leadership level. Sanctions are being set and ignored, and not followed up. Students don’t feel accountable. You are being encouraged to pander. Get a new job?

[Lougle]

I'm not a fan of this, but at DD2's school they have a 'learning hub'. First offence, name written in the board. Second offence, hub. 24 hours isolation learning. That means that if they get 'hubbed' in P5, they spend the rest of that lesson, then P1-4 the following day in the hub, copying from 'relevant' text books.

The list of hub offences is long and varied. Talking out of turn (even if they are asking about a homework), dropping pens, turning on seats, getting out of seats, even asking why their name is on the board. Anything which is seen to disrupt the efficient education of other children.

When the hub was first introduced, DD2 told me of about 6 kids who were 'hubbed' in one day. Bearing in mind that most of her classes have the same children, she was getting closer to a private school education by the end of the day! That number has gradually dwindled and I hardly ever hear of children being hubbed now. There are a couple of persistent offenders and a couple of children with SN whose behaviour disrupts, but is dealt with by sending them to the SN block to do their work.

I hope it gets better for you soon.

[TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince]

Can you get them to line up quietly before they go in.

Rewards often work well in this type of thing. I mean chocolate rewards.

I’ve had classes like this. Last year, l had a class that broke me. I’d been doing a demo and had to stop 6 times to break up scuffles and fights.

I don’t usually have problems line this, most classes are fine. It’s them not you. Can’t some of them be moved to other groups? This is usually the best snswer

[TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince]

And we have a supportive SMT and we still have difficult classes.

Also, another thing I find helpful is staying at the front and picking off the offenders one by one. Try not to move or walk round a lot. This l find can agitate

[be47]

They sound just like my year 11s who I refer to as my 'demon class' - I've had them 18 months and if anything they're getting worse! They're not all bad, but when 20% of a class are genuinely terribly behaved and another 50% are easily distracted and immature it can be a real nightmare. I've got no practical advice to offer, unfortunately, just sympathy and solidarity!

[TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince]

And also we all get the terrible class sometimes. It will be someone’s else’s turn next.

[be47]

@TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince that's also very true - my year 10s are utterly glorious (all 3 classes of them!) whereas one of my colleagues is having a really tough time. I expect across a career it all balances out, even if it doesn't feel like it at the time.

[PanicAndRun]

You just described my class in primary, with the added bonus of stuff flying in the air,tables being flipped,pencil pots thrown about,kids leaving the classroom or getting in fights.

I'm a TA and actually broke down last week and said I couldn't cope. They said all the rights things on that day came for an observation,nothing changed. This week I was told I need to update my behaviour management techniques (observe other teachers/TA's) and remember every day is a new day.

[UpsyIggleDaisyPiggle]

Zero tolerance. Put a list of work with explanations on the board do that you don’t need to interact. Just stalk around checking behaviour. Warning to whole class at the beginning of the lesson is their first warning. Name on board at first instance of trouble. Apply sanction at 2nd instance. Follow through on this - it’s all too easy to keep giving more chances.
If the behaviour starts to improve over time, start reintroducing activities where you need to interact with them.

[cansu]

I have tried numerous things over the years. Nothing will completely solve the problem but putting some things in place might help a little:
1 Have something easy such as a wordsearch of key vocab on their desk for when they arrive. Give small rewards for those who do it silently.

1. Have lessons that follow a predictable pattern e.g wordsearch, teacher led activity, paired task, independent task, plenary. Start with insisting that teacher led activity is quiet and focused. Allow them time to work with partner where they are allowed to talk.
2. Think about where they sit. I find that irritating kids who distract others are often better at the back where their behaviour is less visible and disruptive to others.
3. It is a cliche but it is important to watch your own reactions. It is easy for them to spot and react to your tone, attitude and general demeanor.Fake it. It might feel like a nightmare but be determined not to show it.
4. Try the old 'listening now, thank you Alex' trick. Assume compliance and thank them for it before they have done it almost! I spent a day trying this technique out and found it surprisingly effective.

[noblegiraffe]

I remember a Friday P5 where one kid in particular kept running up to my desk and switching my computer off at the wall. I couldn’t do a call-out on the computer because obviously it was rebooting so I picked a nice kid and gave them a note to take to reception.
The naughty kid then rugby-tackled the nice kid to the ground and wrestled the note off him.

[Phineyj]

I had a class like this once. Not with so much overt bad behaviour (sixth form) but really bad chemistry. I tried a bunch of different things but the only thing that helped was a big date list by my desk at home where I crossed through each date with thick black marker pen. The parallel class was delightful.

I met one of the students by chance on the concourse of a big London station a year or so ago (she sat quietly at the side, ignored the nonsense, got an A* and is now studying the subject at university). 'Wasn't our class awful?' she said. I replied that now we'd both left that school I could admit yes it was!

Courage, OP.

[MsAwesomeDragon]

I've got a class like this this year. It's not even Friday afternoon that I see them, but Wednesday afternoon.
They are ok on Monday and Tuesday (not great but manageable), then Wednesday afternoon is like a zoo. Yesterday I stopped my lesson completely, shouted like a maniac, and made them do the most simple boring exercise I could find in a textbook. The first 2 people who spoke after that were removed and given detention, then the rest stayed silent (they sulked no end, but they did it silently!)

I'm introducing a reward chart on Monday, where they can earn up to 5 stickers per lesson (just for being bloody quiet and doing a small amount of work) and if they manage to get 13+ stickers in the 3 lessons in a week they get a lolly. This has worked with previous terrible classes, so hopefully it will tame this lot. I have only had behaviour this bad from 2 classes previously and this is now my 15th year. I know it's them and not me, I teach other "challenging" classes without any of the same issues. Most classes like me, or respect me at least, and know that if they behave well (or even just adequately)they learn a lot in my lessons

You don't sound as if you've got much support from higher up. They should be dealing with the racist incident harshly, and walking out of detention shouldn't be tolerated at all. I'm quite lucky in that we have department detentions and things get escalated if they disrupt the detention or don't attend. Currently 2 of my pupils are excluded from my lessons (they are given work to complete in a sixth form lesson) until they attend the detentions they have missed so far. That was organised without any input from me other than setting the original detention, so I didn't need to chase them up and get them in for another detention with me (which they don't care about in the first place!).

[BeingATwatItsABingThing]

I lost my shit completely with mine yesterday. Having asked them to be quiet multiple times, I declared that anyone who spoke between then and the rest of the day would be in for their entire break. 5 did so within a minute. All of them were told they’d be in at break. After that, they all managed to stay silent after that.

[WhiskersPete]

I have this with a year 10 class this year. I only see them once a week first thing on a Mon morning. It puts a real downer on my Sundays.

[TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince]

Nobke Guraffe. That’s why l have 2 computers when on teaching a difficult class. Have a departmental laptop separate from nine. And have that dept one set to oncall. 6 on calls in one lesson 😭

[TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince]

Sorry about typis