Chocolate labs - are they a relatively new "invention"?

[giddly]

Probably a stupid question, but i went to see a friend yesterday who has a beautiful chocolate lab puppy. It got me thinking - when I was a child (I'm quite ancient) I only remember yellow and black labs. Now I would say chocolate is probably the most popular colour for a lab round here, but I think I only cam accross the first one about 20 years ago. Are they a new strain, or did I just lead a very sheltered life prior to this? Also the lovely "red" ones seem new too.Are they a distinct type, or just a very dark yellow one / very light brown one?

[LEMmingaround]

Ooh just looked at the images. They look wrong somehow

[dotdotdotmustdash]

Apparently the 'silver' gene doesn't exist in purebred labs, despite their breeders insisting it does. There appears to have been the inclusion of Weimaraner at some point to produce it.

[WeAllHaveWings]

Never heard of a silver lab before, have looked the pictures and they do like very Weimaraner-ish and not typical lab.

[TheAbominableWoman]

Fox red is just a shade of yellow, though. Not a different colour.

[WilburIsSomePig]

Oh there do seem to be a couple of anti chocolate lab comments on here. :(

I have a rescue chocolate lab. He is neither dim nor overweight. Though he is the most delightful, affectionate chap I have ever owned and I cannot imagine life without him now. My son used to be petrified of dogs (all dogs) and we were very careful about which dog we chose and we couldn't be happier with him. He is DS's best friend and has made a huge different to our family and he appears to have developed his own little fan club of children in our village. :)

I do agree with a pp who said that labs (or any dog for that matter) are overweight because of over feeding.

[Skinheadmermaid]

I'm not sure about the colours but I remember labradors as a child as being barely bigger then knee height-now the ones I see are all monsters with heads up to my waist! The black ones seem to be very aggressive as well, but that's probably because the owners don't bother training them as clearly labradors are born perfect...

[easylife73]

I don't agree that black labs are more aggressive than other colours...as with any dog it's down to personal temperament and training etc. Ours is a big, black, entire male, but he has never shown any signs of aggression at all, he's a big softy.

[wheresthelight]

My aunt has bred chocolate labs for above 35 years! she showed at krufts throughout the 80's so guessing not all that rare

[jaynebxl]

We had a choc lab over 30 years ago and she was a bit dozy but lovely and well behaved.

[moosemama]

I think the weight, behaviour and intelligence thing can be a bit of red herring as the vast majority of Labs most people encounter are pets who are under-exercised, over-fed and little trained.

It's rare, if not unheard of, to see a healthy, well-behaved Lab around where I live, in fact I have to avoid our local park because my pup ended up fearful of other dogs thanks to being leaped on several time at a critical developmental stage by huge overweight Labs that didn't have an owner in sight.

I think the problem lies in them being seen as perfect family pets and given a quick trot around the park or trundle on the school run, rather than proper exercise and mental stimulation. They are a working breed and are very often failed in pet homes.

I saw a Lab at a vintage car show last weekend that I honestly believe may have been bigger than the one in the recent TV programme about obese dogs. It couldn't take more than two steps without collapsing in a heap.

My experience of chocolate Labs has not been good, which I will admit has made me very wary of them and perhaps a bit too quick to make assumptions, but I like to think I judge each dog on their own merits rather than label a breed or colour. That said I do know several gundog trainers who won't take on a chocolate, but I guess it's possible they just may not have come across any decent well-bred lines.

[motmot]

Interesting. I did wonder why you never ever see chocolates working. Yellows are my favourite, but I think the black gene is stronger? And once you go down the route of colour bring the main aim, I'll agree you'll run into trouble. Hopefully it won't happen with the fox 'red' ones

[dotdotdotmustdash]

I suspect fox red is the new 'chocolate'. The must-have colour in labs. I guess it's cos foxes are cute, just like chocolate sounds much more family-friendly than liver.

[FuriouslyFrottingFerret]

Oh don't mention chocolate labs :( there is one called 'Angus' which has been advertised 3 times on various facebook selling pages - he appears to have had 3 owners in the past 2 weeks, he's only 11mths old - he has been sold for £50 twice, £100 and is now on preloved for £200, I think people keep buying him thinking he 'looks nice' but don't realise what a handful a young lab can be. I hate some people.

[littlewhitebag]

My yellow lab is not overweight. She is lithe and slim and very beautiful. No waddle but she has a lovely wiggle.

[moosemama]

Now that's the type of Lab I like to see littlewhitebag. Sadly we don't see enough of them these days.

I did see the awesome sight of a man walking no fewer than eight gorgeous, lithe working Labs along the beach together when I was on holiday. Noisy children and yappy, loopy beach-happy dogs everywhere, yet every single one only had eyes for him. The were all walking around him in a little huddle, matching his pace and ignoring everything else that was going on around them. They all looked so relaxed and happy too. It was a spectacular sight.

[Elliptic5]

I'm on my second chocolate lab, both have been bred from championship stock but have turned out daft as a brush, think it might be me tho' . Generally they seem not to be as easy to train and are more pets than working dogs but there are always exceptions.

[PushPineapple]

They've been around for over a century- they've become very popular in recent decades.

I first came across them in the 80's when I read a book called Emma's Story. It was about a chocolate labrador called Emma who was chosen to be a Guide dog to a lady name Sheila Hocken. Sheila Hocken went on to write a series of books about Emma and her subsequent experiences as both blind and able to see plus the various other animals in her life. Sheila's first book was published in 1978.

[PurpleFrog]

The book is "Emma and I"!

[tabulahrasa]

That book is the reason I have a Siamese cat, lol

[PushPineapple]

There was a kids book written about Emma, which is how I was introduced to the others. I believe it was written by her puppy walker.

[TheRealThursdayNext]

We have a very slender chocolate lab, always been a bit of a loon which we used to attribute to her being a rescue, but now she's over 9, it seems she's just a bit of a loon. I do think they must have been badly bred when they got 'trendy' but they seem to have faded from fashion now (in favour of labradoodles and other made up breeds) so may improve.
Many people don't realise that you can have quite distinct 'types' of lab, show types which are the lardy crufts ones, and gundog types which are slimmer and high energy (as ours is). When our 25kg bitch met my then bosses 50kg+ dog I was quite amazed by the contrast in size, and a bit worried for his heart!

[TheRealThursdayNext]

Oh and forgot to mention 'fox red' is actually a very dark yellow lab. Probably started off as an accident but now selectively bred by some. Lovely one near us called Mango :)

[MehsMum]

I agree with PPs about lardy labs: lard and lack of recall seem to go hand in hand. I love the look of the lithe and agile working line labs - and none of the workers I have seen round here have been chocolate.

I saw two labs at the vets recently - one pet/show-bred and one working-bred and it was instantly obvious which was which.

[BOFster]

Can I ask a perhaps daft question? How does a breeder select for 'good' traits? Is it a question of only breeding from dogs with the desired temperament/intelligence etc? What happens to the dogs who don't have these qualities? Presumably they aren't 'culled', or am I being naive? How can a breeder tell what an adult dog will be like when they are puppies? Do they hold back animals with undesirable traits, or sell them on? And if they do, how do they know that someone else won't breed from them anyway?

I'm just curious as to how it works.

[littlewhitebag]

Mehsmum Mine is slim with slightly dodgy recall! How do you explain that one?