Do some kids stay nice or have I got it all to come?

[breakfastbap]

My work colleague can be a bit of a cow at times!

I have DS age 16 and DD 13 and to be fair they are really good kids. Both doing well at school, so far they've been no trouble at all, okay, they leave cups and plates around in their rooms, DS can eat me out of house and home and DD does a brilliant eye roll and can be a drama queen when she wants to be - her bedroom can be a tip at times too. DS has a small, stable circle of friends who he plays football with but most of his time he's studying, playing football and online gaming. No drinking, drugs or roaming the streets causing trouble. DD has a small circle of friends and apart from the obligatory piles of makeup and spending hours perfecting her pout and taking selfies she lounges around on her phone in her room etc.

Having said that there is never any really bad behaviour, they will help with chores if I ask them or if I ask them for help with anything they are always willing. They are generally polite, well behaved and have respect for our home and their belongings. They both like a hug, I'd like to think they can come to me about anything and we can talk openly and have a laugh over most things.

The point is my colleague who has had quite a bit of trouble with her 20 yr old son seems to think I've 'got it all to come' and that they are going to be a nightmare soon. She delights in saying 'once they start driving look out' or 'once they start drinking then you'll have your hands full' or 'once she's got a boyfriend look out - she'll be a handful'.

So, is that always the case? I know DS has said that he's got friends who smoke, have sex with their Gfs and one girl his yr is pregnant. I know it's going on at his age and I'm hoping that he has more sense than to bother (he appears to). DD I think may be slightly more rebellious and outgoing but so far she appears to be sensible.

Does anyone have good kids who stayed good kids or will they always go off the rails a little at some point?

[fairywoods]

Bobochic you say I work with lots of teens and their parents. I have yet to come across a problem teen who had effective parents! There are always longstanding parenting issues (usually poorly thought out decisions that set DC up to fail) when teenage DC are difficult (or worse). I would love to hear a few examples of these longstanding parenting issues. You seem to be suggesting that all problem teens have rubbish parents which is somewhat unhelpful for those struggling with difficult teens. My DD has been easy and is doing well, my DS has been lovely until 16 but the last few years have been quite bumpy. I've read books, I try to back off and don't sweat the small stuff. I don't think it's entirely down to me being a crap parent, I am by no means perfect, but some of his behaviour I think is purely homonal. Some helpful advice would be appreciated rather than suggesting it's just down to ineffective parenting! And OP, I hope you continue to have 'easy' DC, but I don't think you can be sure until you're out the otherside

[Largemelons]

My eldest 2 are 18 and 20 and have always been nice. People loved telling me my then 1213/14/15 year old daughter would turn into a monster but I just couldn't see it ever happening.
She's 18 and still one of my favourite people in the world. My DS has always just quietly got on with life and at 20 he's still doing that!
My middle daughter has been difficult from birth and I'm going through a terrible time with her as an almost teen. But it was fully expected.
Personality doesn't change completely. Nice kids can stay nice kids! They may be a little more private or a bit moody but don't expect a complete Personality change.
From a MH point of view, my great grandmother had agoraphobia apparently all of her life. My grandmother is a complete hypochondriac with serious anxiety problems, my mum is pretty 'normal' and I've had anxiety all of my adult life.
Out of my 5 DC, I have a DS with mild anxiety but he copes and a DD with severe social phobia who doesn't even attend mainstream school despite being on medication and lots of CAHMS intervention.
I have 2 young DDs who seem fine although one tends to be a little more sensitive and anxious than the other.
Its interesting stuff but makes me sad for my DC.

[Titsywoo]

Just wading in on the MH issues (DD is 12 so not quite there with the teenage part yet). I have always suffered from anxiety and think MH issues are pretty prevalent in my family. DD also suffers but the difference is she talks about it. I guess because unlike myself (and maybe others in my family) is isn't ignored or brushed off. I hope that and the fact that she is on the waiting list for CAMHS will be to her advantage and she will suffer less due to not bottling it up.

[JustDanceAddict]

Interesting re MH isuues. My late mum had a 'nervous breakdown' in late teens (obv she told me in later years but I don't really know details) my late dad def suffered from anxiety to a large degree and myself to a lesser one, I am a massive worrier but I keep a lid on it as much as I can. Both DCs have had probs with anxiety so it is prob genetic more than anything. FIL also has big MH issues. I just think it was a lot more 'behind closed doors' than it is now.

[MrsJayy]

Mine were fine dd1 was a moody lippy mare but no real bother apart from the moody . dramatic nonsense if I'm honest she was a twat Dd2 was always easy going but it was just teen stuff like you had

[JustDanceAddict]

Mine is pretty decent, but she has another 5 years to go. We have a laugh and enjoy each other's company up to a point!! She has her moments and issues but hasn't given me trouble of a major kind yet. DS is the one more likely to give grief, but he's not a teen yet - he's a charming cheeky chappie with a rebellious streak. I think it also depends on how you want to pick your battles. I turn a blind eye or lightly remprimand some things other parents may come down on heavily, but I am firm when it comes to more serious things and make sure they pull their weight around the house. Am not perfect, but I don't see point of going mad over every little thing.

[misshelena]

It's a mixed bag and depends on how you define "good" kid. And sometimes, you just have to wait them out and not give up.

For me, I think of dd1 16-yo as a good kid. But from 12-14, she hung out with a group of nasty girls who relentlessly bullied other girls and each other. DD was herself extremely rude and defiant and fought with us every day. Then late 14, she started competing in her sports, made new friends and began to take her studies seriously. Her attitude towards us also improved dramatically. It's like a miracle! Like she just woke up one day and decided that she's had enough of the shenanigans!

These days, she continues to be her sweet self and is doing near the top of her grade at school, holding down a part time job, and is captain of her sports team at school. But she is also having sex with her (lovely & accomplished) boyfriend of 8 months, going to parties and drinking occasionally. I don't think she is doing drugs, but I could be wrong.
So of course, I still worry a lot about her.

[gandalf456]

Yes. It is the parents' responsibility but I dislike the way parents are automatically to blame. Part and parcel of teenagers is to rebel and grow away from parents. It's the terrible twos with swearing.

Mine were the most tantrumy two year olds. I WAS that parent. I tried all the textbook stuff it only half worked. I hate hate hate the way you get parents who do not have to try and their children just get it and are calm and even tempered and just behave just because they do and would if parented by Atlila the Hun. I honestly have worked harder over the years than these so called perfect parents.

Some children are just HARD. Teenage and tofdler years are notorious for that. Why does it have to always be someone's fault? And comi5from someone experienced with working with families its depreßing and you can see why people dont seek support because of course they wont be understood.

Still, when mine laugh with me and want to spend time with me and come to me when something is wrong, i know I have got something right . I don't have to be perfect and neither do they

[corythatwas]

How does one actually know what teenage mental health was like a generation ago or two generations ago or three or four generations ago? There were no ways of registering it in any kind of record until very recently and even when I was young it carried a terrible stigma, which meant people would rather lean heavily on family members than seek medical help. Suicides and suicide attempts were covered up if at all possible, because even after they stopped being illegal, they brought shame on the family. (Remember that bit in Downton Abbey where Carson says he is going to tell the family that Thomas is ill with influenza- otherwise known as a hot bath and a razor).

In my family, we have had depression and high anxiety for at least 4 generations, but my dd is the first who will leave a mark in any kind of record. I am not sure my mother suffered much less than she has, but the difference was that my DM got no medical help and was completely reliant on her family (including her young dd). I am not sure that was a better situation, or that it tells us a lot about modern life.

What I do think is that a lot of health issues, if not actually caused, are unmasked by the pressures of modern life: you could get away with shaky school attendance in my grandmother's day because they weren't fussed about statistics.

[WankersHacksandThieves]

I think to say it is all luck is to do some teens and their parents a disservice.

You see threads on here all the time where a parent and teen are at loggerheads and sometimes it started over the slightest of things, such as not keeping their bedroom pristine. I', not saying don't have a base standard, but sometimes it's not worth sweating the small stuff or trying to take a different approach for a change rather than being confrontational.

I definitely don't have the answers and I think personality, who they are hanging out with, your family circumstances, parenting, schooling etc all have a part to play and those aren't necessarily all equal between all your children.

So, is having "good parents" all that decides whether a teen is a "good teen" or not? I think that it isn't but putting the right kind of parenting in place is certainly and element of improving the chances, it's just not the only element.

[Bobochic]

No one's fault but still the responsibility of parents to guide their DC through.

[motherinferior]

Oh, I'm a dreadful parent. Slapdash, careless, veering between the over-indulgent and the draconian. I've worked since my babies were four months old and I never remember which days they're going into school early (not least because they get themselves up and out of the house).

My teenagers are lovely. Sensitive articulate hard-working young women with social consciences and lots of friends. Nature over nurture, definitely.

[gandalf456]

So that's not really anyone's fault is it?

[Bobochic]

Teenage mental health is worse than it has ever been, according to the media. Parents have to bring up their DC in a world that has very different pressures to the world they grow up in and it can be hard work to guide DC through the unknown

[RhodaBull]

There has never been a door slammed or a voice raised, but then DH and I would never do either of those things.

We can't escape our genes - well, if we can it takes a huge amount of effort. Dh is a bit prickly and very sensitive - and dd is very like that. If she feels she's been misunderstood or ridiculed there are tears and ructions. I am a festerer and ds is inclined towards a bit of brooding.

I wonder if there is less "bad teenage behaviour" nowadays than a generation ago? I know people in their 60s who complain that their parents were horrified by their (probably only a tiny bit rebellious) teens and kept on droning, "We fought a war for you," etc etc.

[Squirrills]

Mine were both pretty hard work up to the age of four. After that life just got easier. I was wary about the teenage years and yet I needn't have been. Now 20 and 18 they have never been anything other than a pleasure.

We were quite strict when they were little but if I think back very hard I can't think I've ever had to "impose sanctions" since they were in primary school. As they got to teenage years I relaxed as many "rules" as possible, trying to insist only on things that really matter.There has never been a door slammed or a voice raised, but then DH and I would never do either of those things.

I don't know how much is due to parenting or how much is due to inherited genes or how much is just luck. I know families with 3 children who all had the same parenting and one goes off the rails while the other two are fine.

[Bobochic]

Rhoda - I agree. And it is up to parents to guide the child they have!

[RhodaBull]

I think corythatwas is right - it's more about personality than a particular age, although at some points in life traits become more exaggerated. My mother always said that a nasty old person was once a nasty young person.

A toddler prone to tantrums and rages will no doubt become the teenager who slams doors and "hates" you. The quiet toddler can morph into the one lying on its bed listening to emo music for hours on end. The bouncy toddler charging full-pelt into nursery will become the teenager glued to social media and out partying.

[Bobochic]

I work with lots of teens and their parents. I have yet to come across a problem teen who had effective parents! There are always longstanding parenting issues (usually poorly thought out decisions that set DC up to fail) when teenage DC are difficult (or worse).

[mumonahottinroof]

That is one very particular situation. Do not extrapolate from it that all parents of tough teens are "useless and stupid" because they are not.

[Bobochic]

My DSSs' mother thought her sons were nightmare teens. They were horrible to her because she was useless and stupid! She would ring DP to complain about them but he had nothing to say - they were fine with us. Different parents, same DC --> completely different behavior. In the end the DSSs came to live FT with us and were very easy and straightforward.

[thatwouldbeanecumenicalmatter]

I was that good teen - so were my siblings. My reason was that my Mam knew loads of people that if I misbehaved it would get back to her quick and wouldn't be worth my while

Although honestly I was quite a placid, anything-for-an-easy-life child so it didn't occur to me didn't have the imagination to 'get into trouble'.

Current friends who have late teens (5 that I can think of from the top of my head) are all surprisingly but hand on heart nice kids who are quite studious, help look after their younger siblings types and don't give their parents grief other than asking for money/being messy usual low key issues. I'll have to ask them what their secret is

[mumonahottinroof]

My mother was just a bit deluded as to what was going on - plenty of rebellion but she just never found out the bad stuff because, in hindsight, I was very lucky and got away with things. The rebellion had nothing to do with the way she brought me up and a lot of teenage rebellion has nothing to do with parents. I repeat if you have had/have easy teens then you are just lucky, ditto easy toddlers, whom I remember you being smug about way back on here as well.

[Bobochic]

mumonahottinroof - can you not see the contradiction in your post? Your own mother failed to let you be your true self and manipulated you into role playing the teen/person she wanted you to be, yet you claim it's teens, not parents, who have the problems?

[Useruser44]

I agree it is deeply insulting, camhs comment regularly about what a great relationship me and DD have it doesn't stop her being very tough. I had a great relationship with my DM hit 13 and hated her for 3 years she'd honestly done nothing wrong and I knew even at the time I was being ridiculous , I just couldn't stop, even the way she ate irritated me