Holidays with kids and ex - discuss

[Meeeh]

Maybe this is an AIBU post but putting it here for expertise in this forum.

Me: nasty divorce and poor ongoing communications with ex husband
Him: very amicable relationship with ex wife

His children have asked that their mother come skiing with them and him in the Easter holidays . Needless to say I’m less than thrilled.

Would like to hear from all sides and from those who may have a situation where there is heavy involvement with the ex partner.

[Meeeh]

@Annaminna some truths in there and I also believe in habitual comfort - ie doing something we’ve always done as it seems familiar and the norm.

That link probably provided more about my wonky ex though but thank you for sharing anyway.

[Qwertygert]

I completely agree and you need to do what is best for you. Me and my ex married young after i had an abusive relationship and he was safe. We split but remained close because all though we fell out of love we had a good relationship. We have gotten each other through some really really tough times and although we are not in love we still love and care for each other and will always be there for each other and we are lucky to have that. My last 2 exes I feel physically sick if I see someone who looks like them and luckily I didn't want more kids otherwise I don't think I could have been nice to them after what they did to me. DH ex started off well for 4 years until he met me and she became single. Now she is a horror.

I am very aware though once my ex meets someone our whole set up could change as he needs to respect her boundaries and maybe some of what we have will be a no go. Luckily our DD is coming up 11 so that probably would have naturally changed any way x

[Annaminna]

Current culture (i.e. mumsnet ) tells you that you need to be best friends with your ex — and his new partner — or you’re bitter and selfish, can’t let go, or aren’t putting the children first.
I do know quite a few people, who use these phrases because they don’t want to talk about reality. Why should I be best friend with someone I couldn’t bare to live respectfully at the same house/ under the same roof. Divorce isn’t a magical cure that makes an unacceptable person now to BBF material.

Exis often using different manipulation tactics to convince their ex partners that its their responsibility to take them to holidays and days out, for meals, fix their houses and DIY for them and so on, you name it. Always using: its for children!
Dads are easy to manipulate if they are saying that its for children.
In reality they are just want to have control over dads new life and have paid holidays or shared holidays so they don't have to be responsible of their lives.
Its also called "Stockholm Syndrome" and lots of exis are using it very cleverly.
counsellingresource.com/therapy/self-help/stockholm/

[Booboostwo]

Slightly different as neither of us is in a relationship but Ex and I take the odd holiday together. Not every holiday we take, but for example we are thinking of immigrating (all together) so we visited the country we want to move to all together. It doesn't mean we want to get back together and I don't think it confuses the DC.

My opinion is that when you co-parent with someone you are 'stuck' with that person until the DC are independent presumably around 18yo (assuming no abuse, neglect, DV). If we didn't have DCs I would happily never see Ex again, but we have DCs so what choice is there but to compartmentalize the part of our relationship that went catastrophically wrong and try to find a way to work together as parents.

[Qwertygert]

I would still holiday with my ex and I am married to my new husband. I went awsy to disney 3 years ago when i was in a relationship and invited DP at the time but he stayed at home. We are going to take our kids DD SDS and SD to America in 2 years and my ex husband has been invited to come with us all. We have a great bond and my DH gets on with him really well. He comes around for tea often and was at our wedding. He even paid for a wedding car and was our chauffeur as a gift (we did not know this until the day we were just using our own cars to travel) sometimes people can just be friends with exes. My DH is fine with the set up too. His ex on the other hand is completely different though! x

[PiellaLawson]

The biggest no possible!

All the women in support of this can't have any experience of this situation from the step mother point of view. No no no no no no!

[Meeeh]

@Dontdisturbmenow thanks. It’s not easy at times but the thing that bothers me the most is that my own ex does not afford me that level of consideration and respect. But that’s on him, not my new partner. I certainly wouldn’t want him having a bad relationship with her just so it matches my own situation.

[SandyY2K]

Taking advantage is subjective. Some parents think certain things are their responsibility.....so its possible he doesn't share your view on that.

Kids do have a way of demanding sometimes, which can be perceived as taking advantage.

I do think that the NRP will bend over backwards a bit more...that's not unusual. They don't want the relationship to deteriorate or fizzle. It's hard when your child sees their teacher more than they see their own parent.

If you only see your child EOW, you want it to be pleasant...or it's 2 weeks till you can see them smooth it over.

[Dontdisturbmenow]

Ok, but to be fair, it's up to him to decide what's healthy for them or not. You can of course disagree, but that to me is not a good reason to insist that it doesn't happen.

Saying that, my hat to you for being secure in your relationship and not being bothered about their friendship because it takes a strong and selfless woman to do so.

[Meeeh]

@Dontdisturbmenow I’m not bothered that they get along. I also don’t worry he wants her back or anything like that. He’s a provider with a capital P and the thing that bothers me is that I feel like he gets somewhat taken advantage of. He finds it difficult to say no to his kids and think we covered all that above because I don’t think it’s healthy for them tbf.

[Dontdisturbmenow]

There are many reasons why you might not able able to live together but it doesn't take away the fact that it will mean spending less time together and dealing with a lot of issues that only come with sharing a household and mean that you experience something as a couple that is different to being s cite not living together.

That has of course nothing to do with emotional commitment.

What you haven't mention much is what your feeling is about their closeness irregardless of the holiday. Are you otherwise not bothered by then being friends or has it otherwise always are you uncomfortable and this is the top of the iceberg.

[chocolatesaltyballs22]

That's bullshit OP and I'm sure you already know that. I was with my partner for 5 years til we moved in together and blended our families. If you do it sooner you get accused of rushing things to the detriment of the kids, and it looks like you've thought all this through anyway. Can't win!

[Meeeh]

OP UPDATE - really interesting side point being raised around the fact that we don’t blend the kids and do not live together and the conclusions are being drawn that we are “not a serious couple” unless we live together.
The reason we do not live together is a cocktail of issues related to the kids and not uprooting them and my own very difficult ex. We jointly made the decision not to live together for now as it would mean moving half the kids to a new school and friends.

[Anuta77]

@Anuta77 hello I’m the OP - the ex and I have nothing to do with each other so your assumption that she isn’t nice to me is wrong. We have nothing to do with each other. I think that was said by somebody else cross-posting their own experience.

In this case, maybe it's not so bad....

[Annaminna]

That kind of getaway can work only when both ex-partners/parents are at the same page with their lives: both are single or both are in a secure relationship where both new partners are respected and friendly approached.

I have no insecurities about the BM in my story. (Yes, BM not an ex, because she isn't an ex-partner, child is a result of a careless one night stand).
We can not have those combined holidays for sake of making life easier. She hates me with no reason ever given. So we can not go all together because who would be able to have a good time when there is "the atmosphere"?
My partner wouldn't go away with someone who hates his GF. And my DP would not go even with someone who don't hate his GF because partners are doing those things together.

OP; if your BF wants to go to that holiday, then he is making a statement: me and my ex-wife are primary partners, you are not. You are only my companion when mother of my children don't need my company.
In many ways it seems like it is the case; You are keeping your lives apart and do not blend yet. If he is going, he will give a clear message (to his children, their mother, you and to all the people who are aware that they are on holiday) that they belong together and you aren't. Children will always hope that parents will get back together (least to the point they don't have other partners, sometimes even then). For his children you are not his partner, just a friend who comes and goes. They might even want to give a push now for sake of preventing you becoming the new partner to their dad. If they can make mum and dad spend quality time together then their parents should understand that separation was a mistake and they will be together again!
Children will never give up hope for reunion if their parents are nice/amicable to each other. Sometimes openly, sometimes secretly but they are hoping doesn't matter how old they are- even grown ups with their own families.
The only time when children don't hope their parents to reunite is when parents are fighting/hating each other.

[Meeeh]

@Anuta77 hello I’m the OP - the ex and I have nothing to do with each other so your assumption that she isn’t nice to me is wrong. We have nothing to do with each other. I think that was said by somebody else cross-posting their own experience.

[Lynda07]

DioneTheDiabolist Thu 27-Feb-20 13:13:09
I would be ok with it, but that's because my Ex has joined DC and I on holidays and it has been fine and a bit more relaxing as I get the chance to chill on the holiday that i have paid shitloads (for me) of money for.
..........
That is excellent. I wish there were more people like your blended family. It is of course quite different if two 'exes' had a horrible, abusive relationship but when they can be peacefully amicable, it's good and certainly better for the children.

[Lynda07]

I've known two ex partners go on holiday together with their children. They resolved their differences and were friendly, wanted kids to go away with mum and dad occasionally. It was a good thing. Not every divorced couple hate each other.

[Anuta77]

I'm also not likely to be in a serious relationship with a man who gets on so well with his Ex in the first place that her going on holiday would even be suggested, because I could pre-empt this kind of thing happening.

Despite both exes of my DP proclaiming themselves as his family, they never showed any desire to go on vacation with him.

[Anuta77]

I believe OP mentionned that the ex isn't nice to her and tried to cause fights. Well, that's a big reason not to be ok with your partner's "friendship" with an ex. My DP has two of those emotionally dependant friendly exes and I did some reseach trying to make peace with it and it seemed that it only works when the ex makes efforts to be friendly with the new partner, so that she feels included (=important).
When the ex is sweet to the man, but not so nice with the new partner (like it was/is in my case), you know that it's not just innocent friendship and it's not in the best interests of kids, because kids would surely feel better if they know that EVERYONE gets along, not just the parents.
About kids not fantasising about parents getting back together or not getting confused, I think it depends. When our child was born, my SD would often ask my DP in a whiny voice to bring the baby to her mother all the while telling me to leave the baby more with her dad. She would never ask me and that despite our previously very good relationship. She would act as if I were an annoyance. And that was several years after the separation and despite her mother also having a boyfriend.
Unless the ex is prepared to include the new partner in the "family", I think there should be a very clear separation, otherwise there will be problems with the new partner (most of them at least).

[SandyY2K]

@KylieKoKo

would you want to be the girlfriend who stays at home while her partner goes on holiday with his ex?

It's not really him and his Ex like you've phrased it though...it's with their DC, which is a major factor. It's not like their swanning off on a romantic break for 2 in the Maldives.

I'm also not likely to be in a serious relationship with a man who gets on so well with his Ex in the first place that her going on holiday would even be suggested, because I could pre-empt this kind of thing happening.

How I would feel personally, doesn't take away my understanding of what it's like to be a child of the seperated parents.

[QuiteForgetful]

Well, I don't know why he did not tell the dc no, this is my time with you.

[KylieKoKo]

@sandyy2k would you want to be the girlfriend who stays at home while her partner goes on holiday with his ex? Would you be happy if your partner went away with his ex?

[SandyY2K]

I feel like you totally missed my point. My point is there are things I will accept in a relationship and things I will not

I didn't miss your point, I'm just able to offer a different perspective.

We're all different. If it's a dealbreaker for you, then that's okay. It's not a right or wrong issue.

I just wouldn't want to be known as the GF who 'didnt let' mum go on holiday with the kids.

[RUOKHon]

I feel like you totally missed my point. My point is there are things I will accept in a relationship and things I will not, and the fact that his kids might enjoy some of the things I would not accept would not compel me to let go of those standards and put up with it. If a man suggested to me that he wanted to go on holiday with his ex, it would be a firm no I am not comfortable with that. If he went anyway, regardless of whether the kids enjoyed it, it would be over between us. I have my own requirements and priorities in my romantic relationship that are entirely separate from what the kids might like. That is natural; I am not a martyr that will put up with being unhappy and not feeling respected by my partner for the sake of someone elses kids

100% exactly this. Acting in the children’s best interests is reasonable. Allowing the children’s demands to undermine your own boundaries is not.

He should never have put you in this position, but since he has, you need to tell him clearly that you are not comfortable with the suggestion and if he ignores your feelings about it the you’ll have to re-evaluate the relationship.