Pre school are concerned

[Soulcakequack]

My little boy is 3 this summer. I've started to noticed a widening gap between him and his peers in terms of social skills, communication, following simple instructions and attention.

I wasnt too bothered I just thought he was young for his age. However his preschool teachers are quite worried. And have flagged up a lack of eye contact as additional area of concern ( I have noticed it but as it's not none i didn't worry)

He is a lovely kind cheerful little soul. I sent him to preschool at 2.5 for a few hrs despite being Sahm because he was keen to play with 'the boys and girls'.

The school are kind and supportive. But I'm so frighten for him. Deep down I know something isn't quite right. I used to be an early years teacher and ive been quietly concerned for a while. i don't want school and friends to be as tricky as I fear it could be for me.

And I've no idea what to expect from the process and my experience is only a snapshot of what happens in reception.

Can anyone advise me please?

[Wh0Kn0wsWhereTheTimeGoes]

All your situations on here are really resonating for me, even though I am 10+ years further down the line now. What I would say is that I've had so much support from other parents a bit further on the journey than I am, both on MN and in real life, I continue to do so as we negotiate the teenage years. So it really is the least I can do to take a bit of time to support others.

What I would say to all of you is, you are doing a great job, you have picked these things up early together with your pre-schools etc and you are acting on those concerns. Many children get a lot further on before anyone realises they need additional support, these things can be very subtle and professionals do often brush off parental concerns but whenever you start intervening you are doing the best you can for your child.

As for the talking to, not with, yes, that's us too. Adults compensate without even realising they are doing it, other children don't and that's a big difficulty, same with playing games etc. I've found the gap does grow with age, but I also think it gradually starts to shrink again as the children mature.

[FrayedHem]

Soulcakequack Reading your posts, you're very in-tune with your DS's needs. You've instinctively created a nurturing and supportive home-life for him. Don't be cross with yourself for not being more concerned earlier, it's hard to access support for toddlers. DS1 who was "in the system" at 2 and didn't really get any additional support until he was 3 and half.

[LightTripper]

Thank you so much for sharing your experience Wh0kn0ws. It's massively encouraging to hear about your DS being happy at home and starting to find friendships a bit easier.

Even as an (as far as I know) NT but extremely shy/anxious/socially clumsy child (E.g. I remember even aged 8 or 9 absolutely hating it if my Mum spoke to a shop assistant and feeling overwhelmed, let alone trying to do it myself) I felt a similar pattern. Little kids just playing tag etc was fineish. Then between say 8-13 it got very hard and I had a succession of not very suitable "friends" and bullying. Then found my gang of various "misfits" in my mid teens and ended up with some of those girls becoming friends for life. Although I assume I was not ASD (no obsessions/tics that I can remember which I think is a condition?) I hope that DD may eventually find her "people" in a similar way, even if it's a slow road for her too.

Does anyone know if ASD people can find it easier to socialise with other people on the spectrum or not? I'm just wondering if I should also be looking for social groups/clubs for her? Or maybe this is something she could do online when she's older?

Anyway probably getting ahead of myself there.

Regarding difficult babies, we were if anything the opposite: DD always slept pretty well, stayed where she was put, didn't open cupboard doors or pull things off shelves, ate most things put in front of her, etc etc. That now seems to be a "passive" presentation that is apparently quite common for girls. She is definitely getting more opinionated and wily now, but we felt so smug lucky with how easy she was... I guess it is payback now! From what I read they seem to think that ASD can be associated with unusually high or low sensitivity to sensual inputs, so I guess DD is at the unusually insensitive end. She can definitely sleep through a small bomb going off (quite handy with a newborn in the house). Though I am the same so again I struggle with knowing where the ASD ends and her personality begins (which I know doesn't really make sense as a concept as there is no hard line... But it is this kind of madness of trying to identify which "bits" of her are ASD which I need to stop doing).

[Soulcakequack]

Oh light I can see your mind reeling, it's so hard. It's 5 am and I just can't sleep. I'm so worried and sad. We've been trying for another baby for a long time and I'm wondering should we stop? Would he cope? It feels like he will need my undivided attention so we can manage this.

[Wh0Kn0wsWhereTheTimeGoes]

I'm awake too (different reason). My DS was a very easy baby/toddler too, apart from food issues which are an ongoing source of difficulty. No climbing, no running away, no trying to get into cupboards etc. That has persisted, he is very sensible, never been in trouble at school, very rule-abiding on the whole. As for having another baby, we did, just under two year gap so I was pregnant again before we had realised the extent of DS's SNs, but I have never regretted it, not for a moment, in fact I think having a sibling has been hugely beneficial for DS.

[Soulcakequack]

Who I can't thank you enough for your help, I hope your early morning isn't due to anything troubling.

My son did run climb open cupboards a lot it's much better now but then it's sometimes ive work on with him extensively.

Im starting to think I need to get some help advice for us outiede of preschool. I'm wondering if a private SLT is a good place to start.

[Wh0Kn0wsWhereTheTimeGoes]

No troubles, just heading off out somewhere early today, must get myself out of bed now.

[Chasingmytail17]

We haven't had sleep problems either but I think he is under sensitive. He loves to seek out lights, soft things etc. He also likes noise and throwing himself about. We too have found parenting difficult and more hard work than some of our friends seem to have, now we are starting to realise this may well be for a reason. He is our first so we had nothing to compare him to and for ages I just thought he was just a handful. Now I am starting to see the behaviours as a sign he is having difficulty with things. I was worried when at around 2 he started head banging when cross or frustrated. Normally only once but he would get so cross and then just purposefully do it. It is so lovely to have you all to talk to on here and comparing tips and thoughts really helps. It is also lovely to hear the stories of those children that are now older having been through this stage. Thank you all! My next worry is the looming school situation. He is not starting until September 18 but I have no idea where he will end up going and how we will get him the necessary support. I understand without EHCP it is very difficult and these are hard to come by and take ages to get. So I am told anyway!

[LightTripper]

Than you Wh0, hope you get a chance to enjoy the sunshine!

Sorry about the mind whirl last night!

On second baby we also went ahead not really recognising there was any material issue with DD. As Wh0 said, if second baby is NT or not severe I think they will be great playmates for each other, and longer term hopefully friends. If DS turns out to be severely affected then life will doubtless be hard, but that would have been so regardless of DDs situation... So no regrets here, so far at least!

[Chasingmytail17]

Seconding LightTripper. No regrets with DS2. 10 months atm so no idea what the future holds but hoping they will be good friends and help each other through life no matter what it holds for either of them.

[Soulcakequack]

I'm really sorry if the question of siblings was rude. We've had a hard time conceiving a second child and where on the cusp of looking into fertility treatments.

I'm struggling with the idea of not having more children. But I feel horribly guilty that I might take time and money needed by my son away from him trying for another.

[Chasingmytail17]

I did not think you rude at all Soulquack. Completely natural feelings to have. We were not really aware of the possibility DS1 had ASD when I got pregnant although he has always been quite hard work as I mentioned. I think I woukd have still wanted and had another even if we did though. Sorry to hear you have the added pressure of fertility treatments which cost a lot, that's really tough! I do not know what the future holds as DS2 is so little but I am so glad they have each other and I hope their relationship grows as they get older and that they always look out for one another. I believe a sibling is a wonderful thing to give to any child.

[Soulcakequack]

So over the last few days ive been really tearful. It's like the scales are falling from my eyes and I can see all these issues.

Other than wait for the pre school to arrange an observation from the Inclusion Officer, what I can do? Because just waiting feels hard.

I've booked a gp appointment and will book an eye test. I'm starting to look into private speech therapy.

At home me and Dh are trying to make more time to play and communicate with our son.

We're really at the start of the process and I feel very lost.

[FrayedHem]

Hanen do some good books. I've only read the More Than Words book which is marketed towards ASD but I think the ideas are very transferable for any child who has some social communication difficulties. The other one recommended is It Takes to Talk.They are v expensive though!

[FrayedHem]

Also have a look at Stanley Greenspan. I had the book The Child with Special Needs which has a lot of ideas for parents to help children with development issues. It was a few years ago but I may still have a copy. I will have a look tonight (about to go out) and if I find it I'm more than happy to pass it on.

[Chasingmytail17]

The Hanen More than words book is good. Winslow publishing website UK sell for £39 I think which is cheapest I found online. Soulquack just take each day one at a time. I felt lost and in a miserable bubble for at least 2 weeks after it was suggested and the 'penny dropped' it is a hard time but I think you will feel better soon, as you say taking action does help, well did for me anyway. Some days are still very hard but it is early stages for us as well

[LightTripper]

I've only just got more than words but it does look good from a quick skim.

A friend who is a social worker also recommended this site which has games to build social and communication skills. Some are a bit basic if your child is verbal (as I think all ours are) but it also has stuff on principles for developing your own games and finding the right degree of difficulty.
sites.google.com/site/autismgames/home/parent-tips

[Chasingmytail17]

I'm finding the joint attention issue quite hard atm, trying not to get sad about the lack of eye contact with DS. He only really looks at me properly when we are playing ready steady go tickle game or maybe singing, the rest are very brief glances. We also seem to be struggling a lot with questions about anything he has done or seen even if it was only a minute ago. He can answer questions about descriptions of objects or books. Or things like where, what, who but everything slightly more abstract just gets met with a wall. Finding today hard the gaps in his ability to communicate seem gulf like and I wonder if he'll ever be able to communicate with someone his own age well :(

[Wh0Kn0wsWhereTheTimeGoes]

I can't remember what specific resources I used with DS that far back but he was referred to SALT around his second birthday and the inclusion officer and nursery made lots of targets and suggestions for him. By the time all this was happening DC2 had been born, which was great in that I had another 9 months off work with him but obviously with divided attention. I really just remember making a big effort to play with him, talk with him, teach him nursery rhymes etc. It is hard, I'm inclined to look back and remember all the good parts now, which is how it should be, but it is tough at times, especially when you see the differences with peers. What I would say is yes, make some extra effort, but try not to let it take over your whole life, I have done at times and then realised I have been treating him more like a project than my child. Easier said than done though.

[LightTripper]

Hi Chasing, I wonder if you've seen "An Early Start for your child with autism" by Rogers, Dawson and Vismara. I haven't got to the joint attention chapter yet but I've been finding the earlier chapters interesting. It has a nice balance between explaining a bit of the theory but also some practical ideas for ways to build skills. Going to Wh0's point, it is also very big on making learning fun.

[Soulcakequack]

Chasing its hard, before the penny dropped I was getting quite sad that my son didn't like me. And that he was stubborn and hard to talk to talk.

What you describe about joint attention sounds so so familiar. And it scares me for his future. However the small silver lining is that I understand him a little better. I hope the process will allow me to understand him more and more.

Thank you all for the book suggestions and website I will definitely be trying them.

[Chasingmytail17]

Thanks for the book suggestion LightTripper. Haven't got it so will do. Looks good. You are right Soulquack we must do everything we can to build up understanding and hopefully that will make a big difference for both of us. I keep reminding myself of all the positives. He may not look at me directly but he runs to greet me and loves cuddles! I just have to try harder to enjoy him for all that he is and not worry so much for the future. Easier said than done on the hard days

[FrayedHem]

If anyone wants my copy of this book <a class="break-all" href="//www.amazon.co.uk/Child-Special-Needs-Encouraging-Intellectual/dp/0201407264?tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21" rel="nofollow noindex" target="_blank">//www.amazon.co.uk/Child-Special-Needs-Encouraging-Intellectual/dp/0201407264?tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21 PM me and I will happily pass it on.

When DS1 was dx the paediatrician told me that DS1 assumed I knew what he was thinking and seeing (wrt eye contact and joint attention). How true this I don't know but it did help me to adopt that assumption when he was a preschooler.