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Anyone know any adults with Pathological Demand Avoidance?

64 replies

SilkStalkings · 24/04/2012 16:57

Trying to get a picture in my head of our future as DS2 has just been referred to CAMHs re poss PDA. From the brief bit of reading I've done one would assume that most DX'd adults are in prison! Someone give me some examples of how PDA adults live/cope, positive or otherwise please. Aspie tendencies are fairly easy to spot and we have family role models on the spectrum anyway so I've not had this problem with our AS DS1.

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Auntynugent · 19/04/2020 23:34

just reading this makes sense to me my son has the same behaviour . I am at a lost what to do . He is a high function 19 year old who can talk his away in and out of everthing but he can seem to function on a normal level

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BigWorld · 19/07/2019 22:13

My father in-law has what was known as Aspergers. My husband has PDA and my son has Aspergers (mild autism). I can CLEARLY see the differences between Aspergers and PDA! My teenage son seems to have high morals, actually appears to find lying impossible to do! Almost always carry’s out any tasks I ask of him, has never been in any “trouble” in school. Has A/B grades in every subject, showers every day (without being asked), has asked to have braces to straighten his teeth (getting them next week). He also takes an interest in fashion and enjoys having new clothes. When he was younger (14 years old now) he was far more “difficult” he had “melt downs” from around one years old to about seven years old. Any change of routine could cause a melt down! He wouldn’t socialise in places such as soft play areas and birthday parties (just use to sit on my lap). Cried EVERY day going to nursery school. Emotionless looking little face, always seemed to look sad to me.
But every year he has aged it’s got BETTER. No longer has any melt down ever! Will laugh and smile like any other “normal” person (what ever normal means!). Now actually enjoys school, has a lovely group of friends. He also plays football (although not the greatest due to balance issues) but it doesn’t matter he enjoys! There are “differences” for example after school he needs to decompress and goes to his bedroom. He is fine now with a change of routine, no melt downs. But he will have questions and needs them answering such as - what time are we going shopping, we’re are we going, what time will we be back. I have also noticed that he really doesn’t do “small talk”. He is a lovely teenager, who wouldn’t hurt a fly, is bright and dare I say it, he is even popular! I believe he will be just fine.
My husband who has PDA is a Deputy Head Teacher. We have known each other since we were teenagers. There is a MASSIVE difference between his PDA and our sons Aspergers! I find PDA much more challenging and difficult to cope with! He seems to tell lies even when there is no reason to do so and even when he knows that he will be “found out” he still lies! When he was a teenager in sixth form I use to phone him up to tell him to get out of bed and go to school to to his A level classes. He just couldn’t seemed bothered to get out of bed, the teachers would warn him that he was going to fail his A levels. BUT he is bright, so somehow he actually got good grades without hardly ever attending school!! His mother told me that as a baby/young child he was a nightmare and that’s why they only had one child. Apparently he didn’t sleep right through until he was about 10 years old. As a child and teenager he use to take any ball such as a football or even a golf ball and throw it as hard as he could against any wall in the house! He did tell me that his mother would ask him to stop and he would carry on, eventually his mother would go after him with the slipper and he STILL wouldn’t stop. He went to University made one friend, didn’t socialise in uni but socialised with his old friends at home. His idea of socialising was to drink until he passed out or to take drugs. This went on from about 18 years old to 25 years old. He did all sorts of drugs! never became addicted but he tried everything! I would try to be the voice of reason! Reminding him that if he was caught his career in teaching would be over before it even began! After he eventually stopped with the drugs then came the worsening use of alcohol! I mean we all like a drink and I was out every weekend myself! However at the end of the night when other girls would go home with their boyfriends, my boyfriend was nowhere to be found as his night would be either him going home early as he was too drunk to be let in the nightclub or he would be in hospital! He would always “promise” never to drink like that again and I would always believe him, but of course he continued! He got a first class Psychology degree and then did a teaching qualification. His “brightness” has always blinded people to the fact that he has anything wrong with him, let alone PDA. He refused to wear shirt and tie to school when he was in his first year of teaching (he was the TEACHER! 😂) and the headteacher had to take him aside and give him a warning about the ways he dressed! Although the kids love him and he gets excellent results! After a few years of teaching he made deputy head he now no longer wears tie and shirt! Today was the last day of term and he comes home with 30 plus cards ALL saying the same thing! Thanking him for being a fantastic teacher, that he has made their child “like” school, how much they have enjoyed etc etc
Yet at home, I have to hide my money and credit cards or he will steal from me! He refuses to learn how to cook and will only heat up ready meals, it will take at least two weeks of begging to get one light bulb changed! The down stairs bathroom has had no floor tiles for three years (the new tiles I bough are in the garage). He cheated on me when I was pregnant with our first child, I was very ill when I was pregnant and he told me that I couldn’t give him what he needed so he went to get it off someone else! I should have left there and then and I did for about two weeks and then he came crawling back, although he wasn’t exactly full of remorse. I just wasn’t strong enough at the time to leave when I was heavily pregnant. When I was in labour for 28 hours he actually got relaxed enough to fall asleep, doesn’t ever seem to get “worried” about me. If I ask him to do something then he definitely won’t do it! It doesn’t matter if I explain how important it is, he just won’t and when pushed will turn around and say something like - YOU DO IT! So that’s why it was me on my own who has painted the hallway and both children’s bedrooms. His defiance seems to be getting worse as he gets older or maybe it’s because I need him more so I’m noticing his often cruel behaviour. For example, I had an early morning phone call saying my mother had been rushed into hospital I asked him to come to the hospital with me and he said “no”. I then calmly explained that I didn’t want to be alone if my mother was going to die that I needed him with me. He still said “no” and then he walked out on me crying and went to school. He didn’t phone me from school to see how my mother was until 3pm and then didn’t understand why I was so upset when he got home. Many years ago when I fell down the stairs and broke my foot he stepped over me crying on the floor and went to work! I had to phone my father to take me to the hospital. He doesn’t seem to notice dangerous situations (or maybe he just doesn’t care) EVERY accident the children have had have been when he was alone looking after them. For example he left the baby gate open upstairs and the baby fell down the stairs! He let go of our sons hand in a car park and he almost got run over! No matter how many times I ask him to shut all windows before going out or going to bed he just doesn’t bother! So it means I have to get up and recheck everything. The list just goes on and on it’s exhausting! To be honest I feel that I don’t matter to him and that he sees me as an object to use, to get something from. Of course him having PDA isn’t his fault I understand that, but after 25 years of cold and selfish behaviour my love and care for him has all but disappeared and I have asked him to move out. I mean it’s been 25 years, I’m all for supporting a person and caring for them but I too would like to experience some support and care! I don’t want to just give and give anymore. I mean I don’t think I’m asking too much - please can you not steal from me, if you need/want money just ask or take it but then tell me that you have taken some money. Don’t lie about it! Again I know it’s not his fault but the effect on me and the children is the same! It’s a negative effect and to live a life without mutual support and care is extremely difficult. It chips away and then one day I just couldn’t forgive anymore, I couldn’t move on anymore. I just wanted to be free of him and now I see him as one massive weigh on my shoulders.

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susan82 · 20/06/2019 16:31

Hello, just read this thread and could have cried. I recognise myself so much in what you all say!!! My 7 year old DS is currently being assessed as he too displays traits for PDA. I can't take directions from anyone, I have to do things on my own terms and have to be in control. Can be very wearing but so relieved I'm not alone

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pineapplebryanbrown · 09/06/2019 21:28

I suspect both my adult children have this. My youngest has always been recognised as having some form of social communication or processing difficulties but not the eldest.

However I'm convinced my eldest is far more severe. He's 28 and has never worked, I don't think he can really. He refuses to be reliable or independent.

I've just asked him to take the bin out, this resulted in a meltdown from him. Not fair, later, in a bit, you do it.

I don't know why I ask, he might have if I hadn't asked. It truly drives me nuts and everyone thinks it's due to me being soft or something.

I think I've been a normal mother but I've just chosen, sometimes, not to live in a battlefield.

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Jackie1957 · 19/05/2019 00:06

I’m in my 60s and only heard about it a week ago. I recognised myself immediately and it breaks my heart that it could have made such a difference to know. Branded a trouble maker my whole life. It explains SO MUCH!

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Jackie1957 · 19/05/2019 00:00

Exactly the same with me. How strange. Colleagues hated me but the kids loved me and my results were too good for the school to sack me.

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Alona1976 · 04/07/2018 10:05

I am awaiting official diagnosis of PDA and I am 41.
There is no doubt in my' mind that I have it, because EVERY aspect of my life has been negatively affected by my absence of knowledge about what pathological means.

I have, despite this, had lots of successful jobs and I have achieved above average most of my life (l say ' lots' because I havent been able to stick at anything for over two years)...I was top of my finance and accounting class (till I failed to show for part two of the exam) and I have held managerial positions in work ( albeit not for long).

I think I might of avoided avoidant behaviours if I had known what made me so flighty.

If I had known ..
.then I would of been able to break the stupid patterns of behaviour that I have wasted much of my talents upon.

Having a loving family now, is helping me break my chains.

And I am 41

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Rabblemum · 24/03/2018 13:35

Thanks for that. It was hinted my son may have PDA and he has no demands on him now, after years of shouting and a wreaked house we have peace and a great relationship. I’m not sure my son needed a diagnosis but a big change in environment. Schools are horrible for naturally anxious, lively kids and I think school was killing his soul, with help and with a good environment as an adult I think he’ll be fine.

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tartanterror · 18/03/2018 09:47

I know this thread is an old one but I have a random question! Does anyone, or DCs, here suffer from night sweats or over-heating? This seems to happen in our house and I was wondering if it is possibly linked to the different “wiring”? Thanks

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user1499421397 · 06/02/2018 22:56

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Aimee1989 · 04/01/2018 17:47

I am currently fighting for a diagnosis of PDA as I fully identify and I wouldn’t mind sharing my story with anyone who would like to find out not ebut I’d rather not put it out on the net right now so if anyone would like to contact me please PM me and ask anything you like. There may be a lot of bad but there’s also a lot of good so don’t give up hope!!!! I’m a single mother and I struggle but I’m still doing it 6 years later!!!!

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Desperatedan69 · 11/07/2017 20:32

Oh my goodness, this describes me entirely, you and I have exact same life patterns, I also totally resonate with the above post of thinking if I'm a volunteer I won't get trapped in having to do stuff.

It's not that I don't like doing stuff, I just like to have the choice about it.

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1805 · 30/06/2017 16:35

popgoestheweezle

Thank you for your story. My dd has a dx for ASD, but I highly suspect PDA is in the mix too. She dislikes school too. I have always said she needs to leave school at 16, go to college, and become self employed, so it's great to hear it can happen! I hope your business is going well. I am sure you are determined to make it work!! Good luck and thank you.

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rikoryuki24 · 26/06/2017 16:43

And if anyone wants more information on PDA, how it is for adults and what it is in general then feel free to view my blog: dragonriko.wordpress.com/

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rikoryuki24 · 26/06/2017 16:42

I'm a PDA adult. I've never even been in trouble with the police never mind in prison, nor have I ever been in care home/institution/hospital etc because of PDA. Some of us tend to internalise our frustrations or try our hardest to 'behave' despite our brains trying to stop us doing anything. Some of us mask too so we seem 'normal' in public but let it all out at home. We can hold jobs, many of us have kids and many of us are in or have been in good relationships, we can have lots of friends and get along okay in society. Changing our environment does help to a certain degree, but demand avoidance is so pathological in our genetic make up that even if we had the whole world doing whatever we wanted we would still see demands and try to avoid them. For us, even simple things like breathing and using the toilet are demands we try to avoid, this affects our mental health too in that we become depressed because our bodies are trying to stop us doing the very things we so desperately want to do. We have many coping strategies that help us trick our brains into allowing us to do things but this doesn't always work and is incredibly exhausting. The future for PDA kids can be positive, especially if we understand that we have PDA, if might seem bleak for us during childhood but many of us seem to do so much better as adults, though we are late developers so don't expect us to start managing our own difficulties until late 20's/early 30's.

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Rabblemum · 06/06/2017 17:27

If you have a child that never does as they're told don't you think parents try to change the environment, I know I have. I took every bit of advice I could about my son's behaviour and it all made him worse. I did think PDA was a shorthand for soft parenting but I now think it's a real problem. I'd love a child who went to school, but school isn't for my child and that's that.

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Rabblemum · 23/04/2017 13:43

Thanks for that post. It would be easy if this condition was environmental because most parents would do anything to get their child to behave but some kids are born like this. People love to judge but not just show some compassion, judgment is so much easier.

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WingleBerry · 04/08/2013 13:36

I'm an adult with PDA. I have a support group on Facebook for adults with PDA, their partners and also parents of both adults and children. It's proving to be a very useful tool for us all - here is the link

www.facebook.com/groups/381608325204854/

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Zynda · 15/07/2013 23:29

Zombie thread I'm bumping here but I have been googling this PDAS and this thread popped up. My son has a dx of autism and I've always felt that that wasn't quite right, but I have stumbled on this and read this link here and it describes my son to a T.

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HotheadPaisan · 30/04/2012 14:44

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SilkStalkings · 30/04/2012 14:25

Other news, my parents have said they will def pay for him to go to the hippy school if mainstream school becomes a real problem. Good to know and good to count my blessings but hope it won't come to that.

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HotheadPaisan · 30/04/2012 13:40

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HotheadPaisan · 30/04/2012 13:39

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sazale · 30/04/2012 13:25

Hotheadpaisan, you're the first person I've heard describe my dd 13 with regards to the novelty factor! If it is something that she thinks others would like to do and she's given the impression that it's special, just for her, then she'll give it a go until the novelty wears off!

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SilkStalkings · 30/04/2012 13:24

I think crocs are very sensible shoes for school! Could you get some black ones for him?

Our paed is a neurodevelopmental one, she's referred us to CAMHs I assume for testing in a suitable venue as he won't speak to her lol and I suppose she'll review the evidence with them to decide DX. DS1's autism assessment took place over 3 or 4 play sessions with observations by a nursery nurse, SALT and Clin Psych all reviewed with the same paed.

Have to say DS2 was impeccably behaved at a Harvester restaurant last night! And at home was doing some adorable roleplaying as 'Andy Benches' (Cbeebies Andy's show), even gave me an invisible wrist communicator so I could join in. When he's nice he's very very nice... and lulls me into false sense of security...

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