Can't keep rocking DS but not sure how else to get him to sleep :-/

[BreeVDKamp]

DS is coming up to 5 months. He has been in his own room for about a month which is going well. I really want him to self settle, obviously, doesn't everyone? But I don't think that's something you can push, from what I've read.

Currently have to rock, pat AND shh him to sleep, then transfer him to cot when he is asleep. He has a teddy and a dummy (which he always takes out and plays with). Am trying to get him to thumb-suck instead but he won't! He has a musical mobile and a star projector but they're too stimulating for him.

I cannot keep rocking him, but that's the main thing that lulls him to sleep. He can do without the shhing and patting but the rocking is the key. My knees are starting to really hurt and my back hurts from holding him all the time! He will no longer feed to sleep, which is good.

If I put him down drowsy he snaps wide awake and I can leave him in his cot rolling around and laughing/chatting/shrieking to himself for about half an hour and then he'll start whinging and crying - at this point should I just leave him until he falls asleep? I think it would escalate and he'd scream for ages. Although in the car, when I can't do anything to help him, he only screams for half an hour before conking out. But would like to avoid CIO where possible!

Soooo what can I do. Have been trying to get him to sleep just with shhing and patting today but it's not cutting the mustard. HV says not to sleep train until 6 months, and in not looking to per se, I just need tactics that don't involve rocking!

[Monkeybrain10]

Curl up on your bed with him and give him a cuddle , maybe some relaxing lullabies too, then mive him to cot once he's asleep. It may be controversial but babies naturally are comforted by mum cuddles and it will allow you to take some time out (and spare your back) and get some rest too.It may not be ideal but it's better than a shreaking baby and hurting back....and you get a snooze too!

[BreeVDKamp]

Yes DS refused his cot when it was in our room, hence the co-sleeping. One day we put the cot in his room, he slept in it for the first time that night. Had to rock him to sleep, then transfer him asleep. Once he was used to being asleep in his cot, we thought about stopping rocking, and then I wrote this OP haha! :)

[Jemm04]

She has a cot in our room but refuses to sleep in it! So we cosleep. But she is getting increasingly restless and I think needs her own space.

[BreeVDKamp]

This week though his sleep has been terrible as he's cutting his second tooth, ha! If it's not one thing it's another...!

[BreeVDKamp]

Jemm it's going well, I feel a world away from my OP! Is your DD ILin her own room? I know it goes against current advice but we out DS in his own room at about 4 months as I stopped BF and cosleeping and he's such a light sleeper that when we came to bed we woke him. He still wakes if we make a noise downstairs eg close the front door, but the white noise has been amazing at cancelling out the majority of noise.

Anyway, the main thing is the rocking. I'd say now that about 8 times out of 10 he falls asleep in his cot!! I thought it would be way harder than it was. I took advice above and sat next to cot with side lowered and shh and pat him, sometimes strike his head and he generally just turns over and clutches his bears and goes to sleep. Sometimes I hold his dummy in as he likes taking it out and looking at it.

I think the KEY is that in hindsight he was clearly giving us signs that he was over being rocked. He could cry and resist sleep lot more than previously, meaning I rocked him more furiously meaning my knees hurt even more!

[purplefizz26]

The (free) mothercare app has a baby tunes section with white noise, there is a repeat button so it plays continuously

[Jemm04]

Hi Bree, am just wondering how it went? I currently have to walk round with my 4 mo old in my arms to get her to fall asleep and hoping there might be light at the end of the back pain tunnel!!

[BreeVDKamp]

Yes. That was a good day. Last night however, he was up at 10:30, 12, 1, 2, 4-5, 5:30-6:30, then we finally got up for the day at 8:30! And his naps today have been short and hard to get him to take. Clearly not going to baby group at 1:30 today, as he'll either be asleep or exhausted! :( I need to make some friends though :( oh well!

Glad you managed at least some baby free evening time! :)

[MadGhostlyGnome]

10.30-7.30 is amazing Bree!!

[MadGhostlyGnome]

Well, positive: he slept in his cot for long enough for me to have dinner and collapse in front of a programme with DH.

Negative: refused to go in cot once I got into bed and ended up staying in our bed all night.

The white noise definitely helps although we are going through batteries at a rate of knots, seems to help him stay settled for longer.

Argh I don't know whether to take the 'easy' road and just keep co-sleeping which is not as comfy as having the bed to myself but easier for night wakes or persevere with the cot.

[BreeVDKamp]

Ooh also he did 'sleep through the night' couple of nights ago!!!! Although think it was a fluke as he was ill so sleeping loads, and in bed with me, so whenever he stirred I put his dummy back in. But 10:30-7:30 which was good as we both needed a rest!!

[BreeVDKamp]

*lobs her 7 month old...

[BreeVDKamp]

Hi Mad! How was your night?

Right well things have improved for us somewhat, although efforts were suspended last week - cut his first tooth last weekend, then had a horrrrrrrible worrying virus with rash last week and would NOT be put down for a few days, poor baby. He was so sad. But thankfully seems better now!

I have been parenting alone for the last couple of weeks - I know loads of people do it, but HOW? Was tough!

Have just put DS down for a nap - took about 20 mins, fell asleep in the cot with the side dropped and me sat next to him patting/stroking forehead and shhing. He cried on and off and made the whine he makes when he's tired. But was much better than I thought! The harder it is to get him to sleep, the shorter the nap, so don't know when he'll be up.

White noise machine is a godsend, think it definitely helps him sleep longer. Already on 3rd set of batteries though, so going to find a mains-powered analogue radio to use instead.

Have stopped using monitor as it was too sensitive - if we made a noise downstairs, or a train went past outside, it would go off, plus can't really use it with the white noise, so it's gone now. Good as it really stressed me out!!

I just have to be super consistent now I think. PP above who just loves her 7 month old into the cot and he falls asleep is totally living the dream!!

[MadGhostlyGnome]

Watching with interest as I've got a six month old in a similar position. He feeds to sleep at night, gets put down in our bed (we're generally cosleeping for sanity) and then I ninja out to try and have dinner and evening time with DH.

He wakes up anything from once to three or four times from when I put him down to when I go to bed, and often I just give up and fall asleep early with him. Sleeps okay during the night, rolling towards me for feeds and usually wakes around 6am.

We have a sidecar cot so going to try some of the suggestions on here tonight: in cot with my hand on his tummy shushing, batteries in the white noise and fingers and toes crossed for a better evening.

Keep us updated how you get on Bree.

[BreeVDKamp]

OK thanks everyone!

Last night the worst we've ever had, the first time I've properly been like 'argh!'. Walking in the park just now a crying child woke DS up 20 mins into his nap and that was that. This morning though he has an ulcer-looking thing on his gum, front and bottom, so hopefully that's a tooth which could go some way to explaining the worse sleep!

[MadgeMak]

For white noise we use a cheap digital radio set to static on FM. No need for apps or having to leave your phone in with the baby then.

[FATEdestiny]

... By about 12 months though, I make a point of ever never going to a cry straight away...

[FATEdestiny]

I believe in both going straight away to a baby crying. And also waiting and taking a moment to asses what the cry is for before going.

It's not a black and white thing IMO. It's an age thing.

At 5 months old I would go to a murmur straight away. Up until weaning is fully established (around 9 months ish) I would assume that any cry was a need so would go immediately to meet that need.

By about 12 months though, I make a point of ever going to a cry straight away. I will listen to the cry first.

The difference between a baby my months and my baby at 12 months is that:

• I can be certain she isn't waking/crying with hunger
• I know she can find her own dummy and blankie in a moment or two if she needs them to go to back sleep
• She can and does go from awake to asleep without me

The only reasons a cry in the night needs my attention at 12m+ is poorly, in pain or uncomfortable (like nappy too full).

There are many more reason baby will cry when waking at 5 months. Most usually wanting to go back to sleep with help or hunger. The quicker you can respond to these, the easier it is to get back to sleep IMO.

[SparklyTinselTits]

I used to go in to my DD the second she made a noise.
But then one day, I was really poorly, and DH was working away, so it took me longer than usual to get out of bed to go to her....and in that few minutes she just rolled over and went back to sleep! I was so surprised! But that proved that she can do it, she just wasn't because I was probably exciting her by going in the room.
I think you are right in saying that if you keep going in straight away, then he will never learn to soothe himself. You being there all the time will become a bad sleep association which will just be more difficult for you as he gets older. Better for everyone to sort it now....can't be rocking a toddler to sleep, your back would be in bits!

[MrsMogginsMinge]

We did a similar transition to passmethecrisps at about 5 months. More patting/shushing and less rocking (moving via gentle swaying) until we were more or less stationary while cuddling. Then I started cuddling next to DS on our bed (to get him used to falling asleep stationary and lying down) - that was the game changer for us. Then lying near him on the bed with my hand on his tummy, then him in the bedside cot with my hand on his tummy, then me sitting by the cot with patting/shushing, etc. Now he's 7 months and I just lob him in the cot awake after a quick cuddle. I also introduced other sleep cues (white noise, Sleepytot bunny) as I took the rocking etc away. Obviously this will all go wrong at the next sleep regression but for now it's going ok. I did find there was a risk of cumulative over tiredness if I tried the new ways for all sleeps, so if it obviously wasn't going well I would retreat one step to something that worked and try again next time. I concentrated my 'training' efforts on bedtime and morning nap (as they are the easiest to achieve) and went for whatever worked in the afternoon to save the day. Final thought - it sounds obvious on paper but if it's taking e.g. 15/20 mins to rock to sleep you need to allow at least that time for the cot settling to work. It feels longer, somehow, when you're doing it, and it's tempting to give up after 5 mins, so keep going!

[Anastasie]

I was always under the impression that the faster you go to them, the more reassured they are and the less they will bother next time (as in, I know someone will come when I call, so no need to yell!) - so I used to go to mine like a rocket and often he never really woke. He settled back to sleep because he didn't have time to get fully conscious.

Sometimes though they can cry out and they are just dreaming or a bit uncomfy and they don't wake anyway. So I'd go and stand there straight away, see if they are awake, if they cry out again and look fretful then I go in and feed (or rock or whatever) as they are clearly going to need help and the longer you leave it the more conscious they get and further out of their sleep iyswim. And then the harder they will be to settle again.

Btw I don't believe in self settling. They either need you or they don't and it's not dictated by a conscious decision making process. I think babies need us to settle them sometimes, and to try and train them out of that is a bit futile and a bit unfair.

But saying that, often yes they do just go back to sleep if you don't do anything.

[Angelina77]

I use an exercise ball and gently bounce mine to sleep, saves your back and knees.

[Passmethecrisps]

That would depend how you are feeling. My DH used to give me a cuddle when I woke to dd stirring. I didn't stop me getting up but it gave me a minute to listen and think about what I was hearing. The thing is that during the day you are attuned to the cries and know what they need but at night it becomes a bit more, well, primal and your instincts are more fight or flight. This is my own theory by the way! I am not talking actual science.

But I felt I needed a minute or two to wake and consider what she actually needed. Sometimes it was me in the room, other times it was over on the time I had taken to think about it.

I still occasionally launch myself out of bed and she is nearly three

[BreeVDKamp]

Also one more thing, I'm never sure whether to go in straight away when he stirs, or to wait... If we go in straight away, he'll never learn to self settle; if we wait for a bit, he'll wake up fully?

[BreeVDKamp]

Thanks for the support, advice, will be getting one of those white noise thingies!