1 in 7 women made redundant after maternity leave. Plus, new guest blog from Maternity Action

[HelenMumsnet]

Hello.

Some of you may have seen this report in The Guardian of survey findings suggesting that one in seven women is made redundant after taking maternity leave.

The findings also suggest that 40% of the 1000 women polled found that, when they returned from maternity leave, their jobs had changed - with half reporting a cut in hours or demotion.

Does this surprise you? Or not? Maybe it's happened to you? Do share your thoughts...

*Update from MNHQ: We've now got a guest blog from Maternity Action over on the Bloggers Network. Do have a look, and let us know what you think about that, too.

[Kendodd]

I had the opposite experience. When I was on maternity leave for DC2 half of my deptment was made redundant. I was told I was exempt and protected from redundancy because I was on maternity leave, I was the only person in my deptment not included in the process.

I was gutted because I really wanted to be made redundant but wasn't allowed to even volunteer myself, which would have spared somebody else, who might have really needed the job, from being made redundant.

[ExRatty]

It happened continuously where I worked.
Was used in conjunction with a complete refusal to offer flexible hours on return from mat. The excuse provided was that as it was a sales organisation it was impossible to provide the service required on PT or reduced hours.
Our CEO said openly that a woman's mind would never fully be on her job on her return from mat.
My role was reduced due to a restructure that I wasn't informed about until my return. They had decided my new role on my behalf as I would never be able to manage my old role with a new baby
HR advised that I could take the role or take redundancy as the company had now restructured. HR Director said that it was a good deal as my new role had less responsibility but with the same salary.
I realised that she might not have my best interests at heart...

[countryhousehotel]

Yes it happened to me. My role was changed and HR said that it had changed by a big enough percentage (by their definition) that it was classed as a "new" role therefore would be advertised and I would have to apply for it - if I wanted to come back - alongside other candidates. In fact that was wrong, and under UK legislation I had more protection when on maternity leave than any other employee against redundancy. I should have been reappointed without any need to apply (unless they could prove that i was not eligible to apply, which i was, as the role was the same role but with a slight change in responsibilities, but nothing I was not qualified or experienced to do, and it was at the same level). I took legal advice, and my lawyer negotiated a handsome redundancy payout which also "compensated" me for the mistreatment.

I was lucky though. HR department were a bit thick and hadn't checked UK legislation (they were using the "global" policy), - in the words of my lawyer "it's a black and white case of discrimination, they would lose if you took them to tribunal" but i didn't want that stress, and neither did they so they settled.

I think in many cases the redundancy is cloaked in business restructure etc, so it's less easy to claim / prove discrimination. In my favour was the fact that emails from HR and my manager proved they were effectively going against the UK legislation (they didn't realise it at the time) and couldn't claim otherwise when the evidence was produced.

I should add that it was only my role in the department that changed, so less easy for them to claim a business case for the change. I actually put it to them after we'd settled that they'd tried to be clever and get rid of me because I'd indicated I wanted to return part-time. I still think that's true.

[mungotracy]

Redundancy happens to people regardless of their mat status. Maternity does not protect you completely from redundancies they must still be justified and anyone who solely made one mat role redundant would be in court in the blink of an eye. As it happens you have more protection for redundancy than a worker who isnt on mat leave. You also cant be demoted during maternity leave. You get the same job back....if however on return you fail to do the same job then yes you will face that. Sadly this article was very misleading and most of the other women posting on this board seem confused, most of them are claiming that their company acted illegally....which is unlikely...if they did its your own job to go and redress it... As to other issues if anyone actually has ANY PROOF that they are REALLY being paid less than a man for the same role with the same length of service then I really don't see why you don't do something about it instead of moaning about how unfair it is when there is a remedy.

[RichManPoorManBeggarmanThief]

It does surprise me at a personal level as I don't know anyone this has happened to in RL, apart from one person who requested 2 days a week, down from 5 days. They said there was a good chance they would make all PT redundant by the end of the year so recommended she stay FT. She said she'd take the chance, and then they did phase out all PT. The only other person I know was a Fixed income trader and then they made the entire department redundant, so that was that really. Then there are a few people who didnt really want to go back, so when the VR opportunity came up, they took it.

One of my close friends got made a partner at a magic circle law firm whilst on mat leave, although I know that's the exception, not the rule.

However, most of my friends have had positive experiences of returning to work and usually moan that their bosses are on at them to do more days rather than talking about redundancy

[HandbagCrab]

Yup, my role was restructured (the only one) during my mat leave. I know this has happened to one other mum of my cohort and know two mums made redundant on mat leave. I have several female colleagues tell me they are putting off having children now for fear it will damage their careers.

[Craftsonsea]

Yep, me and the other two mums in my office were just made redundant. Local government. My boss who made the decision has two kids, he is a bastard!

[FunnysInLaJardin]

I was made redundant 8 weeks after having a MMC. It was no coincidence!

[GwendolineMaryLacey]

It was strongly hinted that there would be no job to return to after my maternity leave. I had been in post for 13 years and just before I went off a newborn was advertised which comprised of 95% of my current work. When I asked what I would be doing when I returned I was told not to worry my head about that and to enjoy my baby

I resigned and consequently left a job in a place that I had loved and had been my dream job for years :(

[GwendolineMaryLacey]

New job not newborn ffs!

[Smithson6]

mungotracy dont be so irritable. Most people were responding to the questions which were- were you made redundant in maternity leave and if not had you job changed when you went back? Tis an interesting question.
Some people who did loose their jobs will have done so under dubious circumstances, others not and this is reflected in the range of replies. We are all aware that we can appeal to tribunals and other legal systems if we have been discriminated against but not everyone wants to as it is a long and tiresome process that can also affect your chances of future employment.

[msrisotto]

Well I am horrified :( No kids yet...

[mungotracy]

Smithson 6 i'm not irritable?????? what an ofd thing for you to say. Im Honest. Just pointing out many posters have not answered the question asked and chosen to use it as a generic platform to discuss their perceived mistreatment and some rather irrelevant items about men being paid more. (Which might be relevant in another thread,, they are not relevant to the guardian article.) There is a distinct difference between 'made' redundant and pressured to resign and 'voluntarily redundant' Im simply keen the topic is not derailed by people who want to broaden the area of discussion, theres other topics for that. This is about being MADE redundant or the role changing significantly........

[Gonzalez2]

Yes, happened to me with my first child. Returned to work FT after 6mths, was told the week before I returned that my role was being terminated and that I would need to find another role in the company. I returned to try and do this, found the only roles available were lesser ones so went down redundancy route. Having had a second child and been out of work for a while (not through choice) I feel I face the prospect of my career being over at the grand age of 36. With hindsight I wonder whether taking the lesser roles/pay would have been the better option but it was a very difficult decision to take with hormones/child not settling. I accept my employer made a business decision but I still feel there must have been a better way.

[Smithson6]

mungotracy well you came across as being chippy to me. A lot of the interesting posts here have talked about how posters felt sidelined or pushed out under restructuring etc. which is relevant because they are grey areas where women can be discriminated against but probably wont stand up in tribunal. I read the thread and didn't see anyone "moaning" or "confused" about the situation or anyone talking about men being paid more.

[nenevomito]

I wasn't made redundant, but ended up leaving for another job anyway.

Before ML I was the Support and Testing manager with two teams under me. I returned from ML to find that my assistant had been promoted to a new (and better paid) position as Testing manager, taking half of my team with him. On top of that my boss started to override my decisions, where before he had full faith in me. He also undermined me with my staff, even when it involved someone who had a holiday request refused, but went and booked it anyway then told my boss I'd approved it. I said that was ridiculous as it would leave the team without any staff for two weeks, but I wasn't believed.

The only bright side to that episode was that I did manage to get a new, and much better paid job AND did it before all of the holiday, so they were left with no one in support for two weeks. HA!

I would call that constructive dismissal.

[KatieMiddleton]

I think this might trump most for shittiness. Obviously this happened to a friend

Not only was my friend's job advertised without telling her but she found out her job was being restructured after her FIL read an article in The Telegraph that her office where she was the manager was being merged with the office next door. In other words the bastards employer briefed the press before they spoke to her. Does she win the thread?!

I have hundreds of these because I do some voluntary work helping women who have been screwed over after leave. They have all got a pay out but when the career damage, emotional fall out and reduced earnings are taken into account it's hardly adequate compensation.

[mungotracy]

Smithson

"I read the thread and didn't see anyone.... talking about men being paid more."

Please see page one

"I'm still about £5000 in earnings behind the man who got that job at that point."

So ill be ignoring your attempts to attack my position by branding me as 'snotty' until you've actually read the thread ok....

[mungotracy]

Smithson to explain further.........Its one of those odd stat things......redundant after maternity is pretty broad, you could get similar stats off men I expect if you asked "were you made redundant within say three years of having a child?" redundancys common these days....... redundant as a DIRECT result of maternity is entirely different and where the focus should be and is where the discussion should be based...

[Smithson6]

well that's 1 out of 95 then. I'm not out for an argument, I want to read the stories that the posters have about their experiences in the workplace after having a child and wanted to reply that I don't think that anyone is "moaning" or "confused". Its an important issue.

[MrsJamin]

I was replaced by my maternity cover so they had no motivation to agree to my request for flexible working. So in essence it was made impossible for me to return.

[Smithson6]

and actually, this thread has not asked for specific clarity about whether redundancy is a direct result of maternity leave, it has asked whether posters have been made redundant on maternity leave, whether their jobs have changed when they got back to work and for them to "share their thoughts" which is actually very broad. If it is important to you that people clarify what their actual status was then ask them to. Don't call them confused and infer that they don't understand how stats work. over and out.

[elastamum]

Having read the thread, there are a large number of posts here which could easily be regarded as constructive dismissal.

The problem is that most women dont have the energy or the resources to take a case to tribunal, so they just go, and their rights get trodden on.

Or they dont want to ruin their chances of re employment at a senior level through a high profile tribunal case, so they just sign a compromise agreement and take the money. (Like my friend too )

But, there is no doubt that the majority of posts here support the guardian piece. Sadly, discrimination is alive and well in UK plc

[RubberBullets]

I was on a temp to perm contract and was told that they were happy with me and I would definitely be made perm. I announced my pregnancy and then all of a sudden the perm disappeared and I was back on the dole. This was a couple of months after being made redundant from a different company a couple of weeks before my wedding.