Secondary school tours and open days - what to look for and what to ask?

[ArchMemory]

Just that really. We have a child in Y5 and are booked to attend some open mornings / evenings etc but I don’t know how to get the best out of them. Is there anything we should be looking out for? How do we spot a good school? How do we know whether a school will suit our child? Will it be obvious?

It may be a moot point anyway depending on maximum distances but I genuinely feel overwhelmed by the significance of the choice. At primary school we just chose the nearest school (admittedly we were lucky it was good anyway). It just all feels so significant at secondary.

Thank you

[Kazzyhoward]

How about more practical things, like do they have lockers or do they expect the poor kids to carry all their books, kit and coat around all day?

Good idea about the canteen menu. My son was actually quite excited at the thought of being able to choose his own lunches, but ended up with packed lunches again because the canteen sold most of the things he didn't like. (Better now he's in sixth form as there's a dedicated sixth form canteen that does sell a better range).

Another practical matter is buses - we were shocked to find there were no school buses or service buses to the school from the North of the town, meaning a lengthy walk uphill through town from the bus station, though they did have school buses from the south. As we saw a number of school buses from the North to a different school on the other side of town, we'd just assumed that provision had been made, but no.

[Toomanycats99]

I think watch out for how the students interact with the students - do they seem at ease with them. My daughter in y8 is on a school council run by the head.

She is amazed that he is friendly and chatty - she had assumed in this position he would be this remote strict figure.

I have had calls from her tutor when she has been upset at school so I like what I see of their pastoral support. They also take the same form tutor through the school so I guess they get to know them very well.

[Kazzyhoward]

She is amazed that he is friendly and chatty - she had assumed in this position he would be this remote strict figure.

Our son's head is also very friendly and approachable. In year 7, DS was on the outdoor pursuits residential and found himself in a canoe with the head who had come along to help. He was used to calling him formally, i.e. Dr Smith, but first thing he said was "call me Dave" whilst we're in the canoe. It really broke down the barriers!

[Toomanycats99]

Just realised I meant how the teachers interact with the students!

[TheBrockmans]

Dd is on the other side, first time she is being let loose to show people around. The question she is most dreading is 'what is the worst thing about your school?' She has settled on the queues in the canteen because most of it is perfect for her. She genuinely loves her school and hopefully her enthusiasm will show through. Remember that the students are often only a few years older than your dc so they won't know everything. I would though look for a genuine enthusiasm about their school. In her school they just ask for volunteers whereas in her sister's school they have to attend so this may make a difference.

Ultimately it is just a snapshot and say if your child is really sporty my dd isn't so she might not know all about the sports so don't let that put you off. Going around in yr5 you have the luxury of time so you can go back for a second look next year. I would also recommend looking at the Ofsted reports, talking to parents with dc in the schools. Also though be realistic about your chances of getting in and the journeys. We ruled out a school we did really like which was two bus rides away, for us the balance wasn't quite right, however a different child and if we didn't really like the school she is at it would have been a contender.

[my2bundles]

Just wanted to add please be tolerant and kind to the students taking you round and help them feel at ease. At my child's high school it's the new year 7s who take prospective parents and students round the school and remember they are only 11 and only been at the school.for a few weeks.

[sussexmama33]

I am also looking for Y5 ds. Some schools start GCSE courses in Y9 and do them over 3 years whereas others stick to the 'old' system of doing them over 2 years. Also look at where the leavers go. Do they stay on for the 6th form? If so, where do they go after that?

[CassianAndor]

my2bundles that is surely an extraordinary idea. How on earth can a Year 7, who's only be at the school for a fortnight, possibly be able to answer parents' questions and give an informed tour of the school? I have to say, that would give me a very poor idea of the SLT.

[Toomanycats99]

My daughter did it in y7 and will be doing it again in y8.

[my2bundles]

Cassion it actually works extremely well

[CassianAndor]

how? Would a Year 7 be able to answer the kinds of questions asked on this thread?

Sorry, but as a prospective parent I need something more than the perspective of a child who's been a pupil of the school for a fortnight.

I looked at a few schools last year and all the guides were at least year 9, and the few that were articulate were able to give me a good idea of the school.

[sussexmama33]

I've been shown round by a Y7 and Y9 together which works well. Was shown round by a 6th former at another school and think they were maybe too far removed from Y7 by that point to be as useful on their own.

[TeenPlusTwenties]

I agree y7 is too soon. Our school uses y9s as the 'tour guides' but has anyone who offers from y8 upwards helping out at open evenings.

I agree though you have to be tolerant. Some tour guides will be chosen because they will be good ambassadors for the school. Others will be chosen to bring them on, increase their confidence etc, and they might be less articulate etc.

[CassianAndor]

maybe - but for me this is a really big decision that will change our lives and we will almost certainly have to move. Same for many in DD's primary.

So I'm afraid that have an inarticulate child show me round is really really not helpful. I;'m not sure I agree with these being used to 'bring children on'. Too much is at stake for many families.

Of course I would not express that to whoever is showing us round - but it doesn't exactly help if I feel I'm not much the wiser at the end of a tour than at the beginning.

[my2bundles]

The role of the year 7 is to show them round the school, if you have questions about your child's future of course you ask an adult. The way it works is that tne children show you to the classroom you want to go then there is staff to answer questions and run a demo of how tne class works/run activities for potential students. Yes the school does this to help build skills in the current year 7, why shouldn't they?

[TeenPlusTwenties]

Maybe inarticulate wasn't a good choice of word. But some kids will volunteer information and be naturally chatty, others you as a parent need to put more effort into asking questions.

[Kazzyhoward]

At my son's school, the tours are done by years 10 and L6.

We were really impressed by the sixth former who took us around when we went for a visit - he was a fine ambassador for the school, could answer all our questions and confidently showed us around.

[Kazzyhoward]

Of course I would not express that to whoever is showing us round - but it doesn't exactly help if I feel I'm not much the wiser at the end of a tour than at the beginning.

That's how we felt when we went to another school open day - we cut the tour short as it was pointless, the poor lad hadn't a clue. Instead of giving us a tour, he just kept asking which subject next, so we ended up criss-crossing the school from one end to the other. When we asked him to show us the computer science suite, he didn't even know where it was. Eventually we politely thanked him and just wondered around ourselves.

[ArchMemory]

Thanks all! I should have started this thread sooner as a lot of the replies came in when we were already on the tour.

The school we visited this morning is a large comprehensive - over 2000 pupils (inc 6th form). There were talks by the head, assistant head for KS4, the head girl and head prefect. Then tours in groups led by a Y10 plus a Y12 and two Y7s tagging along (so they were there to talk to but not expected to lead). The school was very crowded and higgledy piggledy - buildings that seemed stretched to the seams. I did feel like we were seeing the real school (the other schools we’re planning to visit have open evenings or weekend mornings) which was good. Pupils friendly and seemed engaged. They achieve good things academically and their size means there are lots of opportunities (eg large classics department in a comprehensive). But it was all rather overwhelming. A lot of people I know don’t like it because of the size. Outstanding OFSTED but it’s 7 years old now. New head (previous head retired) although she’s not new to the school, has been there a long time.

My son liked it though and says he can imagine going there. So that’s good! He hasn’t seen any other schools yet though (and neither have I).

[Toomanycats99]

My daughters school is about that size - one of their comments was that particularly for a levels they have such large numbers they can still offer a god choice of subjects.

My daughter seems to copy well with the size of it! In y7 they leave early for the first week to do to miss the rush while they get acclimatised.

[jackparlabane]

So far my favourite school is the one where we were give maps and trusted to wander around, with staff and pupils on every corner and in lots of rooms to guide and answer questions. Showed confidence in the kids (the y7s happily led us to various areas and the older kids were fairly articulate)

[Cuddlysnowleopard]

My Year 8 is a guide this year (my year 11 is helping in a specific department in his school).

I found the guides to be the most useful part of the open days. Ask them how classes are structured, what happens if they forget homework, what the gold's like, do the lunchtime clubs actually run as per the website.

Watch how they interact with the teachers. DS1's school had a lot of interaction and banter, which was spot on for DS1.

[Cuddlysnowleopard]

Food, not gold!

[LolaSmiles]

As the prev poster says, open days and evenings show schools at their best. I would say, though, that a chaotic and badly organised school won't pull off a good open evening with full finesse. However, most schools will show you what you need to see to be impressed.
I would half agree.
I know of some not so good schools with new buildings who put on a brilliant show for open evenings, and some brilliant schools with dated buildings who don't go for all the show and finesse (mainly because they don't need to).

Somewhere in the middle is quite good. I'd not be impressed by gimmicks or finesse. Talk to the students and see what they say, ask them what they think the best and worst points of being at the school are.
Ask students who they go to if they are upset or worried or are being bullied.

On data and headline figures:
If you know your catchment has high performing primaries then be aware that it's much harder for a school to get a high progress 8 score if they have to get grade 7/8 to keep at 0 for progress 8
Ask about ebac entry, MFL uptake,
Look on the DfE data site for open bucket points (some schools manage to get amazing p8 scores but actually most students don't have access to ebac because it's narrowed in y8 and then they really drill the open buckets to compensate)


When you go to departments:
Are staff friendly and willing to talk about their subject, assessment etc in parent friendly language or do they come across like they've been briefed on the key lines?
Watch the staff interacting with any student helpers - it's a good window into how they'll interact during the day
Do schools have a range of exercise books out (a range of year groups, abilities etc or have they put half a dozen out that all happen to have perfect handwriting)
Can staff outside the SEND base talk about SEND and inclusion confidently?


Sorry that was a bit lengthy, by hopefully it will be useful.

[Cedar03]

DD's school uses Year 7 children for their open evening. DD, now in Year 8, admits she wasn't that much use last year as she found it hard to remember where everything was. But, the important thing is that you have a lot of young children who have just started at school and are enthusiastic about it - they are where your child will be soon enough. They can remember that first day at school because it has only just happened. That's something that makes an impression on your child - they can see themselves as being like that child. I think it helped our DD to see the future.

We asked our guides who the mean teachers were. At the school she now goes to the guide (a year 8 child) said 'xxx can be a bit of a dragon, but none of the teachers are really awful, they all have their good points' which amused me as being honest with a bit of back tracking in case she was only supposed to be saying good things.

I also think that all secondary schools feel on the big side, they are a confusing mix of buildings because they are unfamiliar to you when you are on the tour.