Love. Do you think it is something that you have no control over or

[claireybrations]

something that if you work at feeling then you can make yourself feel (or not)?

Just wondering

[MrsMattie]

You can't turn feelings on or off. people can grow on you, though.

I do believe that you can ease yourself out of love with someone if you really want and need to - if, say, they aren't right for you. It might hurt, it may take a while...but it's absolutely possible.

[cory]

Agree with solidgold. I'm probably one of those people who could have lived happily on my own if I hadn't happened to meet the right person. But my friend just seems conditioned to look for love wherever he goes. Or else he is just rationalising a high sex drive . But I find the sentimentality of it a bit creepy: talking himself into being passionately in love with every new woman.

[solidgoldbullet4myvalentine]

I also think that, for some people, love is just not that big a deal and they would rather be 'alone' not devoid of friends, but simply not engaging in long-term couplehood. Unfortunately, because the propganda in favour of longterm couplehood as the 'only' way to live, many of these people make themselves and others miserable.

[solidgoldbullet4myvalentine]

Janos: yet the feelings are the same. It's more a matter of random luck whether or not the love-object reciprocates.

[beanie35]

I don't think you can make yourself fall in love with someone if you never were, or if it has died. But, I think you can build a diffrent type of love, one of respect, kindness to each other and taking pleasure in each others company. I think people tend to play down this type of love, if its not fireworks and orchestras playing in the background when you're with your partner, society seems to see this as a sign of a failing relationship. Having experienced both, I think there is a lot to be said for loving someone instead of being in love with someone.

[cory]

I feel the same about MrCory, LeQueen. But a near relative of mine has the diametrically opposite attitude to being in love- he just can't live without it. A man in his fifties, he has had some longterm relationships (including one very longterm), but he has never come out of any one relationship- however heartbroken- without looking for a substitute within weeks. He just can't cope emotionally on his own. I find this totally weird, and would not be flattered by it if I were one of his girlfriends, but then we are all different.

[MorrisZapp]

I was listening to Radcliffe and Maconie the other night and they played 'It's Getting Better' by Mama Cass. Obviously it's a great song that everybody loves to sing along to but they had a chat afterwards about how intelligent the lyrics are compared to so many so called love songs.

Certainly, my own (treasured, successful) relationship is much more like this 'growing' type than like the instant gratification type, and I suspect it's v common, though doesn't sell as many films etc:

Once I believed that when love came to me
It would come with rockets, bells and poetry
But with me and you it just started quietly and grew
And believe it or not
Now there's something groovy and good
Bout whatever we got
And it's getting better
Growing stronger warm and wilder
Getting better everyday, better everyday
I don't feel all turned on and starry eyed
I just feel a sweet contentment deep inside
Holding you at night just seems kind of natural and right
And it's not hard to see
That it isn't half of what it's going to turn out to be
Cause it's getting better
Growing stronger, warm and wilder
Getting better everyday, better everyday
And just like a flower that takes time to bloom
This love of ours is taking time to grow
Ba da da da da da da da da da da da
And I don't mind waitin', don't mind waitin'
Cause no matter how long it takes
The two of us know
That it's getting better
Growing stronger, warm and wilder
Getting better everyday, better everyday`

[chandellina]

"if you are trying to persuade yourself to be in love with someone because other people think he is right for you, or he if a "good man" and a reliable provider, or loves your children, but your heart is not in it, then it is unlikely to happen (or to last)"

maybe true - but I have had friends who married guys like this, and it really has worked and they love them to pieces now.

there are so many nuances of what makes a relationship work. For one friend, she did feel there might be someone better out there for her, but her now DH loved her in such a solid way and that IMO was a great start and something to really treasure. The deciding thing for her was that he "got her," and she "decided" to really go for it and love him back.

[claireybrations]

Pitchounette I agree, sometimes it can be circumstances that get in the way of a relationship and make it difficult rather than incompatibility.

Chandellina do you think your dh could lend mine that manual

The love/lust differentiation is interesting too, a lot of people do seem to give up once that initial spark goes and think there is no point in working at the relationship ( I don't see working at it as a negative thing either)

[Pitchounette]

Message withdrawn

[claireybrations]

That's a good point notsoclever-it's never going to work if you think there is someone better for you out there.

Lequeen that is really lovely and yes, I do think it is quite unusual to still have that head over heels feeling

[notsoclever]

I think that it depends entirely on the context and the intention:

• if you have once loved (and lusted after) someone but the feeling seems lost, then if it is the genuine intention to re-kindle that love, it can be done.

• if your culture and expectations are to meet someone who is a good match for you, and that by both working hard at it you will feel love, then yes, it can be done.

BUT...

• if you are trying to persuade yourself to be in love with someone because other people think he is right for you, or he if a "good man" and a reliable provider, or loves your children, but your heart is not in it, then it is unlikely to happen (or to last)

• and if you are making a pretense at staying together, but inwardly looking around for "Real love" or torturing yourself with thoughts of that "possible affair - the soul mate that got away", then I think there will be a real uphill battle.

[chandellina]

i'm in the you can make it happen camp. It works best though when there is respect, appreciation and humility on both sides.

Much like in a traditional arranged marriage, I think there should be a level of acceptance that - this is my man and I am his woman and I should be the best woman I can be for him and be free with my love.

so far it's worked for me and DH. sometimes i think he has been handed a manual on the right time to bring home flowers, tell me he loves me, etc. Somehow he almost always seems to get it right when I am needing those symbolic displays.

I also read great advice recently from one of the agony aunts - think it was Mariella F?

something like - you should always treat your partner the way you'd treat your best friend - meaning, don't talk to them in a manner you wouldn't use with your BF. I find that so apt, because it is so easy to tell off your DP, and talk to them in a rude or belittling way when you're angry, but it is very destructive over time.

[MorrisZapp]

Totally agree with blu etc, and what Mariella F said.

Love is indeed a complex emotion but I'm no fan of the 'but I love him' defence for crap or weak behaviour.

Contrary to what Richard Curtis etc would have us believe, love on it's own isn't enough.

I do believe in making love work, and accepting that life is mostly prosaic and practical.

[Alibabaandthe40nappies]

I agree with Anna, and what I think she's talking about is the same thing that makes a lot of arranged marriages work.

If you are 100% committed to your relationship then you work hard at loving someone, and at making yourself loveable. As time goes on, there are more reasons to love someone. Me and DH fell head over heels in love when we first met and he proposed a week later. 4.5 years later we have been married for almost 18 months and have 6 month old DS.
I still love him for all the reasons I fell in love with him, plus I love him for 'giving me' DS, and I love him for being a good father, and working hard to support us, and making me hot chocolate in the night when DS is having a feeding spurt.
There are lots of things he does that drive me up the wall, but we talk about things and never go to bed angry with each other no matter how much we might want to - so any frustrations and negative emotion are never around long enough to erode the love and respect that we have for each other.

I think people can be too quick to look for the bad in something, to say 'oh this doesn't feel quite as perfect as it did'. When you do that and choose not to work at resolving things, you are subconciously starting to look around at other options. Before you know where you are you have fallen out of love, and then it's very hard to get it back. This has happened to two of my aunts, and although they are still not divorced from their husbands, they all live very unhappy and unsatisfied lives because they feel shortchanged.

Falling back in love is possible. My Dad's parents were so so in love and have always been one of my model relationships. But they went through a very bad patch in their mid-fifities where my grandma really fell out of love with my grandpa. It took time and a lot of commitment for her to fall back in love with him, but they were of a generation that took their marriage vows very seriously.

God I've waffled on and on - sorry. It's something I feel very strongly about!

[Janos]

Absolutely solid but wouldn't that be more accurately termed obsession/stalking ?

[solidgoldbullet4myvalentine]

Thing is, you can 'fall in love' with someone who doesn't love you at all, ie doesn't want any kind of relationship with you. SO you have to control your feelings, or you will end up in jail. Just because one person feels love, doesn;t mean the object of the love necessarily owes that person anything, let alone sex or a relationship.
Of course, a lot of the time, love is reasonably mutual (though there is usually a lover and a beloved, TBH ie one person cares a bit more about the love than the other does).

[Janos]

Agree with cory, expat, blu et al.

You can't help having feelings but you damn well can help what you do about them. It's called being an adult!

[cory]

Can't help feelings- at least not instantly. Can help actions though. Over the years I have heard some pretty shabby actions defended on the lines of "well, I just couldn't help my feelings". Including sex with an underage teenager, cheating on a partner, trying to seduce a child". Or even failing to provide for a child adequately because they didn't feel they loved it.

I can't help noticing that the people I know who think feelings are everything are also the people who have seriously messed up other people's lives. Most people I know tend rather to believe in some sort of balance between what you can help and what you can't help, and in the idea that it isn't always about me gratifying my feelings.

[violethill]

I think you can stop yourself ACTING on falling in lust. I don't think you can stop the instinct though.