Haven't seen my husband for 3 days and don't know where he is.

[cbeebies12]

Name change only as I don't want this following me around on MN but also never posted in Relationships before but I lurk from time to time and it seems to be very supportive.

Husband and I had a big row on Monday and I told him to go stay in a hotel - there are a few open now in our city even with Covid. Since then he's sent me a couple of messages calling me a cunt but then nothing all day today except an apologetic message this afternoon and saying he has late check out and will be back soon. That was at 3pm. It's now 7pm.

To add to the story, I called the hotel and they said he is not currently a guest there (although couldn't check if he was yesterday). So now I have literally no idea where he is. He's not answering his phone.

I have a 2 year old and a 1 year old at home with me and I just don't know what to do. I'm stressed out. No idea why I'm posting.

He is an alcoholic too (on/off in recovery, struggles with triggers and relapses) so God knows how much he's had to drink or if he's passed out somewhere or what!

[PornStarOvaltini]

You haven't put yourself in this position OP. He has put you in it.
Hope you're ok. X

[speakout]

I agree alcohol and depression are intertwined.
I would even say there is not much point in having therapy for depression while someone is misusing alcohol.

But in any case none of this is your fault cbeebies12, your OH has chosen this route, your anger if any should be directed twoards him, not blaming yourself.
You need space apart, you need to focus on building your own life- if your OH chooses to sort himself out then that's up to him and not your responsibility any more.
You say he is fantastic when he is sober- truth is that is perhaps not even the real man anyway. That is a man who is probably feeling gulty for what he knows he is doing to his family, feeling guilty and over compensating for the shit he is putting you through.
Try living with him when he is not going through these swings caused by alcohol, and having to deal with the stresses of life in a more "normal" way. You may find that overly sweet man disappears.

I have a family member who has struggled with alcohol for years, during that time tings would be messy, dysfunctional, everyone around trying to scoop up after her, support her through her depression, relationship and job difficulties etc.
When she had sober episodes she was the sweetest most giving person, showering her family with gifts, sending cards, giving us invites, phone calls, affection, planning family days out. I could see what it was about.
Some years ago things came to a head with my family member- she was blind drunk, tried to drive, hit serveral cars, - thankfully no one was hurt- and was found by the police.
It was a huge wake up call, and she has been sober now for 8 years.

And the "fantastic" fluffy bunny side of her disappeared. She is still a loved member of the family, but has a more authentic personality.
No one really knew her while she was an alcoholic, and cbeebies12 perhaps you don't know your OH very well either.
He needs to make some choices about his priorities in life.

But you don't need to be a part of that process.

[Fizzysours]

Absolutely be careful with even discussing his depression with him as it is not the point. As PP has said, yes, drinking may be causing it. Or it may have other causes. Who knows, but one thing is for sure, the only way his life will be ok and he COULD work on his depression, is if he is alcohol free. My personal close experience of someone who died of alcoholism is that there was a huge amount of discussion of other issues...childhood trauma, eating disorder (not present in my opinion...alcoholics just don't feel hungry) anxiety etc as the family was trying to focus on things they could control (we have MH professionals in our family). But the issue was alcohol and it killed him. Do not let your OH tell you endlessly about his depression...he will only be ok if he stops drinking. Repeat this to him and you may get through. But remember....at the moment his primary emotional relationship is alcohol...be very ready to step away if he does not fully own and tackle this NOW as this will quickly affect your children. Hugs. Alcoholism is bloody shit xxxx

[Coyoacan]

But, this far down the line they, and his depression, have nothing to do with the drinking

Well drinking does actually cause depression as it removes vitamin B complex from the system.

But, OP, do start getting your stuff in order to get away from this man. He is the only person who can cure himself and he obviously isn't that interested

[Inaseagull]

So did you actually tell him you would go to a woman’s refuge? What was his response to that?

[AFitOfTheVapours]

None of this is your fault. You have not one ounce of control over his drinking in either direction.

As for the antidepressants, good that he’s agreed he needs to take them. But, this far down the line they, and his depression, have nothing to do with the drinking. They are two separate issues. Don’t let him use the depression as some sort of emotional blackmail on you and an excuse to himself for the drinking.

Having heard the “I’m something myself out” speech many times, what he has said to you sounds like the minimal stuff to get you off his back again (Sorry). With my H, this might come with a couple of weeks’ abstinence. He pretty quickly got back to drinking again. I wish I had been very much stronger about what an attempt at recovery looked like: therapist if poss, daily aa meetings and a monumental amount of determination etc. Not vague promises and guilt.

I don’t mean to suggest this is easy. I know it’s not but, equally, be very careful this doesn’t drag you too far down before you get away.

[NotaCoolMum]

YOU haven’t done anything wrong OP 💐

[pointythings]

You haven't. He has chosen to stop ADs. He has chosen to drink.

[cbeebies12]

Thank you to those who have shared their stories.

Husband obviously mortified and ashamed by his behaviour and says he doesn't want to drink.

I told him I have a route out now after doing some research and making some calls. It's not a nice option but the only one available to me, I'd essentially have to go to a Women’s refuge and hope to eventually be rehoused somewhere. I'm a SAHM but can get a decent job if I tried. The issue is the age of my children, two children in childcare would eclipse my wages, let alone finding money for rent, food etc. I'd get a little bit in child maintenance down the line maybe but it won't be enough.

He has agreed that he needs to go back on his antidepressants and will find an addiction counsellor. I hope he returns to AA but I can't force him and have to let him come to that conclusion on his own.

I'm angry. Angry that I feel I need to care for him and it's my "job" to make sure he doesn't drink, but posts on here have made me realise it's absolutely not my job. I feel so stupid for putting myself in this position and having two small children with him. Problem is, when he is sober, he's fantastic. What a totally shit situation I've put myself in

[romdowa]

I'm the sister of an alcoholic, my sibling spent 10 years ruining our family (they became an alcoholic somewhere in their teens) and nearly killing my parents with the stress. I struggled to cope so much that I had to cut my sibling out of my life totally and we didnt even live in the same house. I can't imagine living with and having two children with one. For the sake of your children , please free yourself from this man. I had to sell therapy due to the affects of alcoholism on myself and my family and I would consider myself a very strong women. I cant imagine how it would affect small kids.
Contact woman's aid and Alanon, let them help you get the strength to make your life better.
You can not save an addict , they have to want to save themselves and they will just end up bringing you down with them most of the time.
My sibling went to rehab and is now sober and we speak again but if the day ever comes that they have a drink, I will go no contact again.

[LaurieFairyCake]

And what would happen to your pets - he can't be trusted with them either

[incognitomum]

Have you been back in contact with women's aid?

[FusionChefGeoff]

I would empty every bank account and piggy bank in the house to get you home if you were my friend.

Is there anyone else you can ask for help with getting money for the flights??

[fucknuckle]

OP, if he’s serious about recovery there are zoom AA meetings all over the country, every single day. he can call the helpline to get local details.

when i said living with an active alcoholic is hell, i have experience on both sides. i was raised by alcoholics. i was born alcoholic, i first got pass-out drunk aged 8 and didn’t quit until i was 41 (apart from when i was pregnant with my DD, when i didn’t drink at all). i lost everything, and nearly died. i got sober with AA, but i worked my arse off for it.

and then? i met a man, fell in love and moved in with him. you can guess the rest. he’s an alcoholic and cocaine addict. i did 5 years with him, all the time thinking i could save him.

you cannot save an alcoholic. we can only save ourselves. i left my ex a year ago. i saw him today and frankly he looks like a homeless person. he would drink in secret, lie to my face about it, be aggressive and forgetful and would deny any problem in the face of a massive amount of evidence to the contrary.

i can never, ever drink again. if i drink, i will die. this is the acceptance that every sober alcoholic has to find. there are no easy options. you quit, or you die. there’s that whole bit in between where you hurt people, destroy families and ruin lives, of course. that’s just the standard journey.

if your husband is serious about quitting he needs to start putting sobriety at the heart of his every action.

however, his abuse of you, the frequency of the relapses and this gold-standard tactic of being amazing for a little while so you can just smooth the whole thing over means that i think you should just fuck him off and live a better, saner life.

you don’t have to move to australia in the short term. i would, however, start making plans to put this whole mess behind you and give yourself and your children the life you deserve.

you are worth more than this.

[RiveterRosie]

One of my sisters is married to an alcoholic. She's 60 now and I've seen how her life has been destroyed because she stuck by her husband. She was the most beautiful sister, young and lively, and now she's like an old woman, bowed and careworn. Her husband's alcoholism took some of the best years of her life and has destroyed her life as well as his. My niece, who I am close to, has confided in me about the effect an alcoholic dad has had on his children despite my sister's efforts to try to keep things normal - the unhappiness is passed down the generations and shows its self in mental health problems.

His text to you was completely unacceptable - that alone should be enough to make you consider whether you should be in a relationship with this man. But the alcoholism, that he refuses to treat, is the "killer" as far as I can see. Don't end up like my sister, don't let your DCs end up like my nephews and niece.

Atm, if I were you, I wouldn't be worrying about going back to Australia. That would be my longer term goal for when things could be planned properly, but for now I would be finding a place where me and my children were safely out of the way of this abusive man, where I can concentrate on them and on myself rather than expending physical and emotional energy on someone who doesn't appreciate it or deserve it.

[Iyiyi]

I was married to an alcoholic and I wish I had left when they were much younger. My older son is 14 now, we’ve been split for 5 years and it’s affected him so badly.

We had a very unhealthy codependent relationship in which I saw it as my responsibility to ensure he didn’t drink. It’s amazing how you just get used to things being the way they are. It’s only when they stop you realise how awful it was.

Whenever I wasn’t home, I would worry that he was drinking. The breaking point was when I went out for a work dinner, and called home to hear him slurring his words. My mum has come to pick up our children because he was meant to be going to work, and she saw cans on the side. I was stressed that he would go to work drunk and lose his job, which had happened before. I was sitting there at the table pretending everything was fine, chatting with colleagues, and thinking, no-one else here is having to worry about their husband going to work pissed. No one is feeling ashamed that their mum knows their husband has been drinking before work. And I just didn’t want to do it anymore.

However hard it is to do - and it is hard, because alcoholics seize on reasons to drink, and what better reason than your marriage ending - it won’t be as hard as your whole life being dominated by it.

[midnightstar66]

@NotOdd that's not true at all. Australia is signed up to The Hague convention therefore is as straightforward as getting them he as if she'd taken them to France. He'd also get guaranteed legal aid as a left behind parent and a barrister to do all the hard stuff! OP on the other hand being the abducting parent would face the costs herself!

[ThumbWitchesAbroad]

@Cherrybakewellard - that's easy to say if you have access to that kind of money. Not so much if you don't.

www.nsw.gov.au/covid-19/what-you-can-and-cant-do-under-rules/quarantine
This is just for NSW but it will be similar in other states. So if the OP's parents are in NSW (assumption, but that's where I am so it's my go-to for info) then she'd be looking at another AU$3000 (£1642) on top of her flight costs, which she already said she hasn't the money for.

[NotOdd]

Not actively having his permission Is very different to actively having his non-permission IYSWIM.

Yes it’s a risk but if the OP took the children out of the EU their father would have to peruse her through the international courts to bring them back. That is going to be a very long, expensive and difficult process for him. And no one is going to get arrested for abducting their own children if they're not breaching an existing court order. The key here is to remove them before he gets the idea to make an urgent application for a prohibitive steps order.

[RhapsodyandAshe]

@PyongyangKipperbang

Be careful.

Are they British Citizens? If they were born, registered and have lived here their whole lives then he could have you charged with child abduction if you removed them without his permission.

Rather than get the money for flights, see a solicitor to be sure of your rights and responsibilities.

Children don't even have to be born in a country for the Hague Convention to have a massive damaging impact on where you can take your children.
If the father (or other parent but it's mostly fathers who use this piece of legal fuckery) is on the birth certificate, you must always have his permission to cross borders with your children, or a very good legal team to establish why his permission should not be required.
If people try and cross borders without the permission of the other legal parent, they can end up being imprisoned on abduction charges.

[AudTheDeepMinded]

@Cherrybakewellard That would be your choice, doesn't make it good advice though.

[Cherrybakewellard]

@midnightstar66

14 days quarantine or a lifetime of being with your 'D'P and putting up with his shit? I know which option I would go for!

Well despite the prohibitive cost it then wouldn't be much fun when OP is forced to return to the UK and face a high court case for parental abduction. As the 'left behind' parent DP would get full legal aid however op would face the costs for that too! Australia is signed up to The Hague convention.

Was he really asleep from 3pm having been checkin out/not booked in another night. I don't buy that!

I would still take the chance in her shoes.

[WB205020]

If you argue enough for 1 of you to leave for several days then you need to seriously rethink the relationship. Perhaps separating isnt a bad thing if its clear to you that the is nothing to salvage.

Its always hard to get both perspectives from a 1 sided story so i tend to fence sit. Calling a partner a cunt isnt nice and is probably one of the worst words you could call them but that as a individual act should breakup a relationship. If it does, there are far deeper issues going on.

What i would say though is why did you DH put 'stop shouting at my children'. That's not a random thing to say, that's quite specific. As i say, its difficult to get both sides of things from a post but there is a chance you do shout at your kids. Most parents do when they are naughty but i would be interested to know the cause of the arguement and whether your behaviour had something to do with it!

[WinnieLowCo]

Yes, makes total sense, if he's gone for 12 hours then you yell at him when he gets back.

If he's gone long enough for you to wonder if he's dead, if he's ever coming back, if he's been in a car crash, if he's moved out.............. then he won't have to face as much anger and questioning when he returns.

He will as time goes by have to extend the benders by a few days each time.

Men and women are supposed to be equal but we all know that that only happens when the man is decent enough not to want to abuse his power. And often in the family structure when there are young kids, he does have power.

My x's particular training was to react so angrily to any request for help with the child that I never asked. He worked hard at work, blah blah blah but he would react so angrily as though the extent of my effrontery asking him for help left him flabbergasted and wounded.
Same for housework. Same for saying no to his sex pesting.

[pointythings]

Hi Aud, no, I wasn't on this thread but here I am.

For what it's worth I think you need to take some mental deep breaths and then do some thinking.

Your husband is an alcoholic. Alcohol comes first in his life. He has decided to give up on AA because denial is easier for him than accepting that he can never drink again.

This means you have only one realistic choice and that is to end the relationship. You don't have to run straight to Australia to do that, you can do it in the UK. Take your time, find out all the information you need - savings, income, pension pots, equity in the house if it's owned. You don't mention whether you work or are a SAHM - you may have to get a job if the latter.

Armed with that knowledge, petition for divorce. His alcoholism is grounds enough. And believe me, your children will already be affected, young as they are. The toddler especially will be picking up on what's happening with him. Your DC deserve better than an addict for a father.

You should join a support group. Al-Anon isn't the only one; there are others. I still attend one two years on from my husband's death. A support group will help you detach emotionally and find the strength to end the relationship without bitterness. Just talking to people who get it is incredibly powerful.

You can do this and you should do this. Life without an addict is amazing.