finally lost my temper with the inlaws, mil and gmil related!

[wickedwithofthenorth]

My in laws are very strange and toxic people. Have always been able to keep at a distance from them until dd arrived.
They do a lot of talking behind our backs and like to twist and blow things out of all proportion. Tonight I've given them something to really be upset about. I finally lost it and shouted at mil.
I'm normally a very calm and patient person, working with under 3s will do that to you, I've never ever come even remotely close to losing it like I did tonight.
Gmil called less than 10 minutes after dh arrived home from work, and her first words were 'why haven't we seen that baby'. We've not heard from only one other than bil for almost a month but in that time have tried to call, sent texts and emailed recent photos of dd, we've had one text back in that time.
Dh in his own words "can't be bothered with them" and has put off calling them because we can never do anything right so why try. He likes the quiet life and to do things he enjoys.
So for the first time since we've been together he actually tells gmil the truth, not that his listened to, but he tries. She lists our faults and moans about me keeping the baby to myself when they visit, 'she always takes her off to feed or change whenever we get close'.
I make the choice to listen to all of this because gmil is very used to manipulating people to get her own way and I hate it. Dh refuses to let me talk to her and eventually gets her off the phone. I'm furious and shaking with rage at this point, I tell him I'm texting mil to say this is unacceptable and he tells me not to be mean so I agree to call her instead.
Mil tells me she is sorry and she told gmil not to call us, I state that I can't accept that behavior and will not have dd around it. Mil then tells me that she isn't welcome in our home and she feels ill after visiting us, having her round is like a royal visit and dh waits on her hand a foot, she's the one who refuses to take off her coat. Since dd was born I've tried to include and welcome her but the fact of the mater is dh and I do things very differently from her. We're very informal people and live relatively simply (we buy enough to feed our small family of 3, not an army) and unless it's for work we live day to day doing what works for us. We've fallen into an attachment style of parenting and don't play pass the baby for the sake of it.
Mil is going on at us about lack of contact and I snap and tell her dh has recently only spoken to her when handed the ringing phone. She goes onto say they used to be such a close family and dh would never do that. I hand dh the phone and she descends into hysterics despite yelling at me seconds earlier. He gets her to give fil the phone who tells him this is unacceptable and he knows what gmil is like, before ending the call to calm mil down.
I'm well a wear this was the least sensible thing to do, but I'd reached my limit. As explained to dh I felt like I'd be violated and attacked in my own home and that my inner mama bear had been poked and was not happy, I needed to protect and defend my family. I'm not proud of losing my temper that way but I was pushed too far and have ignored similar instances in the past, I couldn't bring myself to do it again.
I am sorry that mil feels the way she does and for her being upset by the things that were said but they needed to be said. Dh is surprisingly alright with what I said, he isn't angry at me but apprentice about what will happen next and if there will be any relationship with his family, particually bil.
I've said I want nothing to do with gmil or mil until they both apologize and do not want dd anywhere near either of them until such a time. If I got an apology I would apologize to mil for how she was made to feel but state that I could only be pushed so far.
Gmil is the one at fault here and mil has received the brunt of my rage, but she is the one who has given a woman who is known to behave this way fuel for her fire, so has to accept some blame to. I know she is feeling just as violated as I do. I have some level of blame too and know things won't ever be the same but I think I'm okay with that and there might be the slightest chance in laws could learn from this, hell will probably freeze over first...
Now just waiting for the fall out and what may or may not happen tomorrow.
Really needed get that out, hope to sleep now.

[wickedwithofthenorth]

Dbil is keeping dh in the loop about what is happening with the rest of the in laws.
Dh wants nothing to do with mil or gmil at the moment but is in contact with fil by email for the first time in his life. Mil's sister and her husband are being very supportive of dh as gmil and mil have also been causing lots of problems between them. Mil is blaming gmil for everything, despite admitting to bil that she put her up to calling dh, apparently she is planning to visit the gp tomorrow and ask for a referral form counseling. Dh wants to keep doors open because of this in the hope she might finally agree to family counseling to help deal with his some of his childhood issues. She's never admitted to needing help before, she's been offered various referrals since dh was 16, but I won't personally be holding my breath.
As for drip feeding, that was not intentional, more a thinking process to justify to myself I wasn't being awful to them without good reason. If I'd actively kept a record of their wrongs at the fore front of my mind I'd probably be a nervous wreck.

[Mandy21]

I haven't read all of the replies but can only give you the benefit of my experience. I also had a problem with my MIL when I'd just had children - up until they arrived, I'd been more than happy to play the doting DIL and just fitted in with her and her constant demands on DH (MIL was on her own). After I had children, they became the priority and the dynamic of the family changed (obviously) but she never really accepted that (the DH's family was now us and not her) and it all came to a head and I did the same as you - shouted at her (in person), told her how I felt.

Long story short - at the end of the day, she will always be DH's mother, and the grandmother of my children. I wrote to her saying I was sorry for the way I said what I said, but I wasn't sorry for what I said. I did apologise though (she never did) but thought it was worth doing so that my DH didn't feel caught in the middle. Its hard, every Christmas, every birthday etc, if there is an atmosphere. It just causes upset and angst for your DH having his mother and his wife at war.

I don't know the ins and outs of your situation, but its a really tricky situation. If you can bring yourself to resolve this, for all of you, including your DD, I would advise it.

[EldritchCleavage]

OP, just let your DH lead here. He knows these people. If he doesn't want them around (and I can well see why) then don't push for it out of any sense of duty or guilt.

I too think they sounded odd and unreasonable from the off. the supposedly bang-on analysis upthread came across as ludicrous over-elaboration to me.

[pumpkinsweetie]

My lord they are Toxic with a capital T!!! Your pregnancy & birth don't even sound like your own, jeez i'm surprised you have held it together this long tbh!

Lifting your top up, blaming you for your baby being breech, expecting to be at midwife appointments....omg, my mil was awful in my late pregnancies, determined for a boy, and insisted on being at my home for my arrival, along with my at the time obnoxious niece. That was bad enough, but fucking hell even they aren't a patch on this regarding babies!!

I'm non contact now thank god, maybe you should think about severing ties, they sound all consuming!

[ElaineVintage]

My goodness They have got to be the worst examples of toxic I have ever had the misfortune to hear about. You have every right to never want these people near you again. So sorry you have had to deal with this stress and abuse. Wash your hands free of these awful people and be happy again! All the best. x

[Crumbledwalnuts]

My in laws are very strange and toxic people.

They do a lot of talking behind our backs and like to twist and blow things out of all proportion.

I'm normally a very calm and patient person, I've never ever come even remotely close to losing it like I did tonight.

Gmil called less than 10 minutes after dh arrived home from work, and her first words were 'why haven't we seen that baby'.

From the first four lines of the OP.Which bit did you think was a lie, Bertha?

[Crumbledwalnuts]

No, you could tell from the beginning the in laws were being unreasonable. Some people are just perverse though.

[BigBoobiedBertha]

I don't know about this being a classic turn it upside down and blame the wrong person thread at all. It seems to that it is actually been a classic drip feed with a tidal wave at the end from the OP.

As the OP stood, I stand by my earlier post that she might need to take some of the blame and that a regular, pre-arranged meet up might be the way to go. There is a clearly a some bad feeling but some semblance of a relationship could have continued for the sake of your DD.

Obviously after the last post you wouldn't be unreasonable to cut them off, they sound awful, but that wasn't at all clear from the OP. I realise you were having a rant, OP, but, apart from the mention of MIL saying you were pregnant when you weren't, there was precious little back story. I am sorry if you are upset.

[SnookyPooky]

What awful people, detatch and ignore.

[CookieDoughKid]

Hi Op. You need to detach yourself from all this drama. I can't think that this is good for your family dynamics and I'm sure your baby will pick up on your stress. Suggest to give a very wide berth and don't invite the in-laws round. When you feel confident your child is happy in other people company, let your dh take her to visit the in-laws. Give yourself a well earned break when he does. You are not going to change his family but you CAN limit the stress on you and do small things, like limit contact, like having them over on neutral grounds, like making it very clear upfront what their visits will entail in YOUR home (food/no food).

You and dh need to talk this through and present a united front.

You're not being nasty, you're doing what you can on tight budge/ tight time/ tolerance etc.

Time to give them a wide berth so you can be strong again. The inner mama bear will thank you for it.

BTW, keep your expectations low you may never get that apology. I'd leave it for now until Xmas. Lol

[Crumbledwalnuts]

My goodness it really was a classic mumsnet upside down reaction. And it wasn't even hard to tell from your early posts how difficult they were being.

Ignore them for ever. What a horrid pair. (Maybe some people will come back and say sorry for upsetting you even more, but I doubt it)

[MissMarplesBloomers]

Bloody hell Wicked.....if ever there were a reason to go no contact you have it.

I think the fact your DH is so relieved to be out of their grasp speaks volumes.

I'm sorry you felt you had to share so many awful details about your toxic inlaws, I hope you& your family continue to thrive in peace without them. If any family ever deserved putting under a patio it is your DH's!!!!

[wickedwithofthenorth]

Dh may not even cope with a monthly tea now if I'm honest, but will surgest it to him.
His brother is perfectly happy to continue their close relationship without any other family involment which is the only relationship he was worried about losing.
If he see that as secure he may very well wash his hands of the rest of them. He has been like a diffrent person the past couple of days. You can see that a weight has been lifed off him.
Dh and his brother have a lot of similar issues from the way they were brought up, his brother has started to see just how mad his family can be.
Dh has struggled for years as the scapegoat for mil and now the truth is out is starting to feel like his free.

[holidaysarenice]

Cross post.

Arrange a once monthly hour for tea, otherwise completely ignore their communication. Repeat, we will see you sunday xth at 3pm for tea, repeat.

[holidaysarenice]

The bit that stood out to me is that you fell out with gmil, then you rang (ran to) mil telling tales about gmil and ranting to her.

You escalated the situation.

You could have rang gmil bk said your piece and if needs be rang mil and said I'm struggling to contain my anger with gmil, can you speak to her please.

[wickedwithofthenorth]

I spent the early years of my marriage trying to build a good relationship with my pils and gpils, even when dh wasn't always entirely comfortable with it. The result of that was no real relationship with them and dh being separated from his brothers because they are seen as children rather than the adults they are.
For three years, up until mil imagining I was pregnant, invites for lunch out, sunday diner, trips to the beach, popping around for a cup of tea and joining us for shopping trips were issued on a regular basis. None of these invites were ever accepted. Mil's sister was the only relative that visited our first home. On the other hand I made sure we attended every family event we were invited to and encouraged dh to interact with his family rather than watch tv. We missed two celebrations in that three years, both because dh was playing sport away from home. We always helped clear up after parties and offered to contribute food or drink, anything given would be given back to us at the end.
After that I let dh do as he pleased, he saw them when he wanted to see them, normally when he wanted to watch a program on sky and occasionally phoned them. I continued to attend family occasions with him and help where I was permitted to.
But we were of no real interest to them until I was pregnant. They were told very early on as we wanted to tell them ourselves and the news was already out where I work thanks to bad morning sickness. Dh does not get calls to congratulate him but has gmil calling him telling him off for leaving it so long before telling mil. We'd known days.
Mil goes overboard buying several prams, a cot, changing unit, her own changing bag, swing, bouncer, bottles, baby bath and lots of all singing all dancing toys. Really excited to be a grandparent, great you'd think. Not so much, fil has to return all these things as they really don't have the space or money or truthfully the need for them.
We get the first appointment to see the midwife, mil can't understand why dh wants to go and not allow her to take his place. Gmil is outraged and again calls dh to tell him mil is broken that she isn't allowed to be included in our pregnancy. I get dh to call her after every appointment to let her know how things were going and we gave her copies of both scans.
All hell breaks loose when my sister attends an appointment for a fasting blood test with me, dh was unable to go so my sister stepped up to look after me. Dh gets another nasty phone call, although we have no idea how they even found out about the blood tests in the first place let alone who went with me. He is told I'm being selfish and to sort me out because it's not fair.
Dh and I agreed between ourselves that if an appropriate opportunity presented I'd take mil to one of my appointments. This didn't happen, I had a relatively easy pregnancy but had lots of long term niggles; sickness, carple tunnel, problems with my feet and legs and bad acid re flux that I wanted to be able to discuss with the midwife in private.
We visited whenever we were invited and issued what invites we were able to, which for once were accepted, we had to cancel plans twice because I was really ill but always rearranged. Gmil and mil were invited to shop for maternity and baby things with me be declined, dh and I took out the things we had to show them on a few of my days off. Every effort was made to include them in our plans and excitement.
My bump wasn't my property and I was often ignored completely and they would think nothing of flipping my top up without warning. Creepy but brushed off as excitement, the dc I worked with were tactile too and loved talking to the baby. Gmil and mil were very resentful of the fact they couldn't feel the baby kick, she was in a funny position so most kicks were internal, dh only felt them once or twice. Dh was told I was turning baby against them and that he should be ensuring baby was awake and active when they visited.
I could no longer help them or go near the kitchen or eat any of the food on offer so he was also told off repeatedly for me being ungrateful. This was also an issue when they visited us because dh had to serve them and I had to leave the room when they had cups of tea, not welcoming at all, but being sick on them would have been much worse. Poor dh lived without tea when I was at home.
Our visits dropped towards the end of my pregnancy but dh and I kept in contact with mil. We were busy with extra scans and hospital appointments because dd had turned breech. Gmil phones as mil is dying of heart break as we've not invited her to scans or passed on any pictures from them; pictures not taken after 20 weeks.
After much heartache I agree to a c section, which had been the last thing I wanted. Dh gives the news to his family, telling then baby will be here on x date and asking them not to raise the issue with me because it's a very sensitive subject. I get a call while dh is at work, gmil, I've turned that baby breech so she and mil can't be at the birth and to have dh call the moment he gets home. I did everything within my power to encourage dd to turn, spent my life on all fours, had acupuncture, went on hours and hours of car and train trips because someone told me it made baby's flip, walked around with frozen peas attached to my bump. Agreeing to a c section was not something I took lightly.
Dh comes home to me in a state and the phone ringing. Gmil tells him his late with his call and calls continuously until he hears what she has to say. Mil has been beside herself all day, she's cried her heart out and wants to die, but he can make it alright, fil has looked up the hospital policy and a birthing partner can be there. Mil is waiting for our phone call asking her to be there.
We don't want this, I want dh and I'm not even comfortable with the idea of my mum being there. When he doesn't crumble the two days leading up to the c section are filled with text messages and answer phone messages telling dh he won't cope. His brother is dispatched and tells him this in person and reminds him about the time they spent in hospital as kids.
My mum has talk dh into coming in with me on the day of the section and sits in the cafe in case she is needed. Dh is my rock and spends the first 30 minutes of dd's life holding her.
When I'm out of recovery and back on the ward dh calls mil to give her the good news, she is happy for us but when told the time dd was born scolds him for making her pace the house with the phone for so long. It's only then that my mum is informed, she leaves without stepping foot on the ward.
Dh eventually leaves us for the night but before he goes home my mum drives him out to mil and they are shown dd's first photos together at the exact same moment in time.
Do you think dh's extended family were pleased for him and might call to congratulate him on the birth of his daughter? No. Late night he get gmil on the phone, how dare we exclude mil from her special day, wicked's mum was in the theater, she held the baby and cut the cord, she got to take the first photographs of the baby. He is really shaken and is still upset when he comes back to me the next morning.
Once we know what's going on with the day, dh calls to invite his family to visit. They are asked to come at 3 and reminded of the hospital's visiting rules; two visitors at a time and no children (just new baby's siblings) meaning dh's cousins can't visit us.
As usual they turn up on mass at 2. The hospital is strict, turn cousins away and allow gmil and mil to enter the ward. My sister, who rushed home from uni to pay us a flying visit is turned away because they refuse to leave and allow her in and the stand outside the thin curtains while my wound is checked, catheter is removed and I'm helped out of bed for the first time. They huff and puff about dd being kept in the cubical with me while this is all done. They don't leave until my parents arrive 3 hours later for their first visit and say to the midwife in charge that we might need some space. The midwife somehow manages to move them on, but only if dh leaves with them. Fil, bils, mil's sister and her husband miss the chance to see us and have spent hours clogging up the maternity waiting room.
Gmil places an complete to the hospital about their treatment on mil's behalf; being made to leave cubical in their visit, number of visitors restricted, children excluded and being made to leave before visiting hours were over.
That's our pregnancy drama. Anyone want more to understand the history with the in laws? Even without dh's personal issues there's more gmil phone call, lots of refused contact and more complaints against the community midwife and health visitor.
We've always forgotten things for the sake of family, didn't blink at dh's savings being with drawn before we were married or mil causing trouble when dh changed jobs. But I must have chosen the wrong people to try to shelter dd from because their her blood and that means there is nothing horrific enough they can do to justify me loosing my temper with them once. Yes I overstepped the line and was mean to mil, but this is a group of people who have no idea any sort of line exists.
Anyone want to suggest I grovel and ask for forgiveness?
I'd love to be making this up. I look back and laugh that I once considered mil a friend and was pleased I wouldn't end up being the dil with mil problems.

[LEMisdisappointed]

Chirst, your poor DH, stuck between his parents and you!!

Can't you make some allowances that the Gmil is an old lady and a bit stuck in her ways?

You stepped way out of line imo.

[differentnameforthis]

no invitations to pop over/have a play date etc. The result is that none of the family goes over there much and we're all a bit miffed at missing out on our gorgeous niece.

How about you phone her & ask if she would like to come to yours? Or suggest meeting up?

[Crumbledwalnuts]

Gosh this thread is a classic mumsnet turn it upside down blame the wrong person.

OP carry on doing things your way. You're probably quite stressed and tired, which is why you blew up. The older women sounds difficult to deal with, but time will make things easier.

If you don't do things your way now with your baby, because of them you'll regret it later. It won't make a bit of difference to them, though.

Things will be fine Just let them calm down for a couple of weeks and it will all be fine. Don't block their numbers just yet, but if they ever get antsy end the call, or the visit, or the conversation.

[MissMarplesBloomers]

Wow ....how abou some of you having a go at OP walk a mile in her (& her DH's ) shoes?

You can't judge one families standards by another and clearly some of you are lucky enough to have civil if not warm loving relationships with your own family & IL's.. Not everyone has.

It sounds to me like Mr Wicked has lots of childhood issues from his upbringing and struggles with that vs his sense of duty.

Personally I don' think anyone has "a right" to access to the new babies in the family, they are not toys to be passed around and each visitor "have a go"

If the famiy limit their numbers when visiting and make themselves comfortable (not taking off your coat is rude) and accept hospitality that is offered, then the child will relax with all the "strangers" which after all to the child they are. Then as he child gets older they feel more confident with these new special people in their life & will react accordinglly.

I HATE seeing children being forced to kiss or cuddle their GP's /aunties it should come naturally.

[wickedwithofthenorth]

Nothing to do with prefured ways of cooking. Food just doesn't taste right unless it's out of them. In five years of marriage I've tried.
When the chip pan died it took them almost a year to replace.

[wickedwithofthenorth]

In laws, apart from middle bil, won't eat food cooked outside of their own home. Our wedding was intresting because of it.
Dd screams when she is held that way, this is just ignored. It's not a whimper, it's a full on scream. If you get the imnpression it's a gentle rock with her lying there it's not. Back arched, takes a lot to hold her there.
I'm well awear there are diffrent ways of doing things, we do what works for us, others who have her have their own way with her, and she's always happy to play at the nursery I work at.
Dh can not have crisps and chocolate in the house because that was his diet most of the time when he was younger and having to mostly fend for himself.
I'm sure some problems lie in my cramped household, our livingroom/dining room is not a nice place to be when it's full.

[pooka]

Might be a kosher/non kosher thing (pots and pans, I mean). Harder to properly cater - more reason to have small supply of things for inlaws to eat or to nip out for biscuits when they come.

[InTheFace]

But OP, do you not see how off-putting you are being by dictating how GMIL and MIL interact with DD? You are telling them to put her on their knees and read her stories/play with her toys. That is obviously not what they want to do with her. DD may be your priority, but she is not the only person in this equation. If they were suggesting something harmful, then sure, step in and stop it. But rocking her? I mean this in the nicest possible way, but just relax. If your DD doesn't like it, she will let them know by crying. If you pounce as soon as she does, or try to anticipate the crying by not letting them hold her or dictating what they do with her, not only will GMIl and MIl not learn for themselves what works and doesn't work, but DD will not learn to handle being with anyone other than you. You might be creating a princess with this behaviour!

Also, this may seem shocking 10 months in, but your way is NOT the only way. There are plenty of things that you do not do for your DD that she might enjoy - this is what uncles and aunts and grandparents and so forth are about. Yes, you are best placed to meet her needs, but this isn't about needs. This is a social visit. Just make sure she is fed, clean and not needing a nap, and let GMIL/MIL/DD get on with it. Don't hover, don't watch every move, don't suck in your breath with every move that might make DD cry or yelp. It will be fine. They won't break her!

As for personal space......my mind is boggling. Your DD is 10 months old. What on earth do you mean? You do appreciate that concepts like personal space are acquired traits, learned through living life. At 10 months old, humans need kisses and cuddles, close physical proximity - it equaates with reassurance and presence. Your baby has no concept of personal space. She's only been a person separate from her own mother for ten months!! And you call yourself an attachment parent....double standards? You are totally projecting here, possibly to your DD's detriment.

Finally, the food. Crisps and chocolates do not go off. Why wouldn't you buy some and keep them in a cupboard for when they visit? Does DH not want to because he wouldn't be able to stop himself from eating them? Puts his priorities into some perspective.

Honestly, OP, you're getting a bit of a bashing here but it's because a lot of posters are viewing your behaviour as really very unreasonable by their standards. The fault lies in your household, not your ILs'. (Although I admit the bit about using own pots and pans is a bit weird: do your ILs never eat any food not cooked in their kitchen? Or do you have weird pots and pans?)

[pumpkinsweetie]

I'm kind of with you on this one, i think i understand what you are saying. Basically they come round in large numbers expecting food which is fine except they don't eat what you put in front of them.
Aswell as that baby is treated like pass the parcel from one person to the next and your dd doesn't like it.
I totally get that, it's a shame some people think new babies mean more than just a cuddle and instead treated as some sort of plaything.

I think there is more to this too, considering it was your dh that limited contact it's obvious that he also knows they are toxic people. Which is good, atleast he has aknowledged it.

I have been through similar and worse and it's such a shame when ils or parents choose a time when a mother is most fragile to cause trouble. It is no wonder you snapped tbh. It sounds almost like your baby is a novelty to them, ie "when can we see 'that' baby". Babies are not an it, or a that and should be referred to as he, she, by name or ops baby.