Unhappy about primary schools re opening

[Bitterglitter]

Is anyone else unhappy about primary schools being re opened as part of the lockdown easing measures?

I keep thinking about the kids who have underlying health conditions that aren't yet diagnosed.

My DS1 (5) was diagnosed with a benign heart murmur in feb this year. It was only picked up because he has a lot of follow up Paediatric appointments because he was premature. I don't even know if it's an issue as far as covid19 goes. But what about all the kids out there with undiagnosed asthma, diabetes etc?

Primary age kids can't and won't maintain social distance. And they will act as super spreaders too. Doesn't matter how well their parents maintain distance if all these kids are mixing it up in schools.

It just seems crazy when so many parents can continue working from home. Am I being hysterical?

ANY DEATH THAT COULD BE PREVENTED IS ONE TOO MANY

Do you mean any Covid death? And any other deaths that are caused directly because we do lock down does not matter? Because otherwise your post makes no sense? For you it’s ok for people to die avoidable deaths for other reasons? I think you need to clarify.

I wouldn’t be surprised if they say that parents who can work from home can keep their children home.

Home schooling is already an option.

Hi OP, just wanted to reassure you that the benign heart murmur shouldn’t cause him any problems. My DS was also under a paediatric care due to prematurely and has a heart murmur (an innocent murmur, if that’s the same thing) , as do I. The cardiologist saw said that it was completely fine and the paediatric cardiologist said my sons would cause him no problems in life. I do think that mothers that have gone through the Nicu experience have an huge amount of anxiety regarding their children’s heath I was diagnosed with PSTD and even though my DS is 9 I still worry about him being fragile, I was traumatised when he was born and he is still my miracle . x

@SoloMummy lots of us keyworkers have been keeping our kids at home as advised by the school if at all possible.

I can cope with this for a few more weeks but not till September.

It's inherently untrue that most people can wfh and homeschool. Virtually everyone I know is just about coping but not doing a good job of either being a parent, teacher or employee.

I wouldn’t be surprised if they say that parents who can work from home can keep their children home

You have always been allowed to keep your children at home and home school them. School attendance is not compulsory.

Well said, modgepodge.

I really think it will come down to "We are opening,- but you are are the parents, and can send them or not". I'm starting to find the "You're putting the economy before lives!!" mob a bit tedious. This is a unique situation, and poverty kills. We can't fund people to stay at home indefinitely. People should have the option to home-school, with their place kept until at least next term.

I also don't think you can ask teachers to double-teach, so no teaching in school plus lots of online support, which is probably happening more at secondary. Homework, yes, live lessons, no.

@Mightymurphy
That article is from the 28th if April - I doubt anything has changed since then

Possible the reason it's ok for children to not socially distance in the playground Vs socially distance in classrooms is about length of exposure. Breaktime 15/20 mins. Classrooms several hours.

Yes, closing a school is easy. Setting up remote learning from home is not. Nor is getting food to those eligible for FSM. Nor is working out who is eligible for childcare, who will take it up, and organising the rota. All this was organised in under a week. I honestly don’t see why some heads are saying it will take 4 times this long to decide which year groups will be in when, and the best way to keep them apart etc. I’d imagine most heads have already given it some thought anyway. Not to mention, until the kids are actually there we probably won’t know what will or won’t work. Just like in Denmark where they’ve had to abandon social distancing at playtime.

I’d imagine most heads have already given it some thought anyway

Yes, I’m chair of governors at a primary and our head already has comprehensive plans for how a phased return will work. It may need tweaking but the plan is in place. If other schools haven’t been preparing in advance then it shows a fundamental lack of foresight.

@GeorgieTheGorgeousGoat

But why are you only worried about Covid deaths? What about those suffering and dying in poverty, domestic violence, job loss, homelessness, postponement of operations? Why aren’t these deaths one too many for you?
Covid right now is a real threat to me and my family.
The poverty situation has existed all of this time and will not suddenly disappear due to staggered opening of schools. If schooling solved poverty we'd be a rich country!
Dv - there are already things in place. The issue with dv is that many victims of dv return many times before leaving. The crisis will have no doubt increased numbers in the same way the World Cup does. But we don't ban the World Cup do we? Likewise schools are not the solution. Victims of dv have always been permitted to leave their homes etc and seek refuge. That hasn't changed. If anything, the support is stronger.
Job loss is sad. It's a very unfortunate consequences. But you can't spend if you're dead can you. So as hard as benefits will be, they're there for such situations and we should be grateful for this.
Homelessness has actually decreased because of the legislation so a moot point.
Postponement of operations has been necessary. Some will resume. Its disappointing and I say that as a mother of a child awaiting another life changing operation. But I'd rather wait and have this carried out with the lowest risks than risk rushing it through now....

Also, social distancing is not an ‘all or nothing’ thing. If I had to be seen urgently by a doctor, and they had to examine me, social distancing would have to be abandoned in that situation. Does that mean I would abandon it completely and hug the receptionist on the way out? Of course not.

As a pp has said, it's it just about the difficulties of social distancing with young children, what about staff levels? In our school, there are around 8 members of support staff and 3 teachers who are classed as 'vulnerable ' - not the shielding group, but still advised at the start of lockdown to work from home, get online shopping etc. What happens to those staff? If they are back in school, it makes their efforts to stay home, stay safe etc a wasted effort and if they are not back in school, it makes the school's job even more difficult. Yes, schools do need to reopen as soon as they can safely do so. But there has to be done very careful consideration given to the definition of 'safe'.

@flowerycurtain
The ONS stats say differently.

@SuitedandBooted
If a teacher is teaching in the class, then why can the lesson not be recorded and shared online? Not ideal, but better than nothing and given the children won't be on the carpet there's no chance they'd appear so safe to do.

I think so many people have worked themselves into such a state and lost so much perspective that the only thing to do is crack on with a gradual reopening, including of schools, so that people see the sky isn't falling. I can't really see all those people who swear they'll stay in until 2025 keeping it up when everybody else has gradually gone back out again and failed to DIE IN SCREAMING AGONY.

A child dies in a car accident about once a week in the UK, and many times that are seriously injured. But yet we still put children in cars. All over the world children will have undiagnosed health conditions and yet they just generally do not die of Covid. To go back is clearly the right thing for children - the question is what the effect might be on adults. But nobody's got a gun to anybody's head to get you to send your child in, so dereg and homeschool as you please.

Is that not an issue what ever is doing the rounds though, cv, flu, measles etc. We recently discovered dd is not immune to rubella, despite mmr. There are no guarantees.

Frenchcroissant

Apparently they are opening 1st of June“

Just further speculation by another newspaper, hit very badly by drop in sales and desperate to increase circulation .

Do wish they’d stop it.

If you don't want to send your son back, then don't send him back. It is not an unreasonable course of action for you to take.

The government has already recognised that it is hard to get really young kids to social distance and it's possible that the younger year groups won't go back until september anyway. That's one siggestion that has been put forwards.

However, schools cannot remain closed until we have a vaccine. Whenever schools do open (nobody actually knows the answer to this) parebts are going to have to make their own minds up about what the right thing to do is.

There IS still an advantage to seating them a safe distance apart in the classroom even if they can't enforce SD outside.

All day, close contact, inside is far more risky than running around together outside.

What they need to try to do at break tones is stop them from holding hands/hugging/sharing food/toys etc and keep them moving about

Low risk group and also noted they are less likely to learn in a self-directed way, so some will be falling behind. Not least that working from home with primary age kids about is very, very difficult.

To be honest, I think it will be highly phased though, with vulnerable kids still off and not all year groups in at once or even all week to allow staggered opening and social distancing. Also some teachers will be off as shielding. It’s not going to be all 4-11 years olds returning full time and en masse.

There's been no official announcement about when schools will reopen, and when they do it:s not going to be a case of everybody in. I really wouldn't worry about it. We both work from home so can homeschool for a bit longer. If I'm not sure it's safe mine won't be going in.

Gwyn I think you mean shielded kids, not vulnerable. Vulnerable is those in care or under a social worker.

Solomummy
They could try, but in my experience young primary lessons aren't all done in an environment quiet enough to make following online easy.

Many primaries seem to be just setting online tasks, so I think that could continue.

For a more realistic model on how schools/childcare are likely to reopen in this country have a look at the timeline set out by Leo Varadkar for Ireland starting next week:

Phase One (18 May)
Outdoor meetings between people from different households will be allowed and childcare for healthcare workers will be opened
Phased return of outdoor workers such as gardeners and repair workers, as well as the opening of retailers which are primarily outdoor
Certain outdoor public amenities will also be opened

Phase Two (8 June)
Household visits will be allowed and plans will be in place to open up business with consideration for safety of staff and customers
Small retail outlets will open with social distancing observed
Open public libraries.

Phase Three (29 June)
Small social gatherings will be permitted and playgrounds will open, while creches, childminders and pre-schools will be available for children of essential workers in a phased manner
Those with low levels of interaction can return to work
Non-essential retail outlets with street level entrance and exit can open.

Phase Four (20 July)
Creches, childminders and pre-schools will be opened for children of all other workers on a gradually-increasing basis.
Those who cannot work from home will return to work
There will be a gradual easing of restrictions for higher-risk services like hairdressers
Opening of museums, galleries and places of worship.

Phase Five (10 August)
Larger social gatherings will be allowed and workers across all sectors can return to the workplace
On a phased basis, commencing at the beginning of the academic year 2020/2021, primary and secondary schools and third level institutions will reopen
At this point there will be further easing of restrictions on high-risk retail services.

Of curse this is all dependent on the level of infection/deaths remaining low.

Even if they did reopen schools in England before the end of summer term, it would be on the basis that not every class would attend school every day, more likely that in Primary it would be one or two year groups each day so that children attend school 2 days out of 5. But for now it is all pure speculation, whatever the newspapers may claim.