DD doesn't want to start school

[depp1020]

Just before the end of last term in nursery, my DD would become very upset at the mention of starting school. She has a place at the infants school attached to the nursery and her new teacher often visited the nursery to spend time with the children who would be starting in her new class. The new class teacher is lovely.

When my daughter was due to attend an afternoon session in her new class at the end of last term, she would cry every time it was mentioned and was inconsolable on the day in the run up to it. The reason she gives for not wanting to start school is that she says it is too noisy and the teachers will use a tambourine, just like they did in nursery. DD never mentioned it being too noisy during her time in nursery. DD does not have any sensory issues.

DD was also starting to say nursery was boring during the last half term and that she wanted to stay at home. Every time I mention buying her new uniform, she gets very upset and repeatedly says that she doesn't want to go to school.

The majority of the children from nursery are going to her school, and one of her best friends is in her new class. But she says she's not bothered if she doesn't get to play with them as she would rather stay at home. I just wanted some advice as to whether this is usual behaviour for some children, or should I be concerned?

DD is an only child and I have been a SAHM since she was born. Homeschooling was an option I considered but didn't pursue as DD was starting to become very clingy and I was concerned that, as an only child, she would miss out on socialising with other children. She actually settled into nursery a lot quicker than I anticipated and her confidence has really improved. However, she was starting to get clingy again at morning drop off, during her last term at nursery. If we still lived in the area, I would have loved to have sent DD to Dolphin School in Hurst as I feel it has a more relaxed and nurturing environment but, as far as I am aware, a similar school does not exist here in the West Midlands. DD's school, even in nursery, has a reputation of being strict and I don't know whether this is part of the issue, and that she just isn't able to articulate this.

I visited many state and independent schools in the area before applying for a nursery place, but never found a school that felt just right and accepted that I would have to send DD to a good enough school, which most of them were, including the school that she has a place at. But I think my daughter's reaction to starting school is making me question whether good enough is actually good enough.

Thank you for reading; any advice would be much appreciated.

[depp1020]

Brilliotic, thank you for sharing your experiences. I’m sorry for the experience that your DS had. I hope your DD settles in well; you are right in that the personality of the child can make a difference as to how they perceive/react to things.

BubblesBuddy, you make lots of valid points. I hope I have conveyed in my earlier posts the reasons why I think DD doesn’t want to go to school, which I really don’t think are coming from me. My concerns really started on Friday when I started this thread and that is why I have been asking for advice, whereas DD’s negative reaction to starting school began several weeks ago. I think DH and I have been very supportive and positive during DD’s time at nursery and, since her place at the infant school was confirmed in April, have always assumed this was the route she would take. But since Friday, I have started having concerns and it has been great to hear other people’s perspectives. I am very grateful to everyone who has taken the time to read the thread and post. As I said in one of my earlier threads, DD has thrived at nursery and we do want to send her to school. And from other posters’ experiences it sounds like her reaction to change is to be expected, which is fine. I am trying to find a way forward, such as maybe sending her part-time initially. It sounds like you are trying to fight DD’s corner and I thank you for sharing your perspective.

With regard to the independent school, my understanding from parents of current and previous pupils is that it is not particularly pushy. Parents send their children there for the experiences and opportunities the school offers. It has a strong focus on music, sport, drama and art.

[5000KallaxHoles]

Mine could write their names at nursery - I think they pushed it a little too much too soon with DD2 particularly as she picked up a couple of shitty letter formation habits from doing so that we're still working on getting put right now. With DD1 they really had intentionally held off as she was having pencil grip issues - but the keyworker for DD2's cohort I think just fell into the trap of assuming parents would be expecting it and forcing the issue.

[drspouse]

Mine could write their names at nursery. I expected it and certainly don’t see that as academically pushy.
Well that's lovely for you but the majority of children won't have a hope of being able to do that. It's not an expectation for nursery age in the EYFS aims so yes, it's pushy.

[BubblesBuddy]

I don’t think a nursery child really knows what being in YR is really like until they experience it. Some children probably would play until they were 10 years old if they were slowed to. Why does she think that YR is a problem? Or is it because she’s picked it up from you and that this isn’t really the school you want? Or that you think home provides for her imagination more effectively? I do not believe she’s taken against school purely on her own without input from you. Your philosophy and the schools don’t match and she knows it.

How do you think she will cope with a far more pushy independent school at 7 if she wants to play all the time? That sounds like a total miss match to me. She won’t want that either. She clearly likes her home experience but she needs guidance and support for transitioning to school. However you will find that YR isn’t overly formal. Obviously parents like this school and their children are happy. If you want the independent school you will need to ensure she does start to enjoy school or the next move could be extremely difficult as there will be far more homework and high expectations academically and behaviourally. That’s what parents pay for.

Also state schools have to teach children. They are judged on progress the children make so if they play and cannot write their names, one could see there would be a problem. Mine could write their names at nursery. I expected it and certainly don’t see that as academically pushy.

[drspouse]

My DCs school is vastly different and has much more lunchtime supervision. For a start YR and Y1 have separate playgrounds.

[brilliotic]

Hi OP,

I have an April DD starting reception too. Also I have an older child, and am finding that starting school is a whole different experience for second/further children than for PFBs!

You said the school doesn't have a January intake - well it might discourage this, but providing it is a state school in England you can simply send them an e-mail now or in September stating that your child will be starting in January (or April, for that matter) and there is nothing they can do about it.
Part-time is a little more complicated, in that you have a right to go part-time I believe, but the exact format of this has to be agreed with the school, so they might veto your desired way of going part-time. Even if you can legally enforce your own part-time pattern onto the school it makes a lot of sense to discuss and find an amiable solution with the school, that actually works for your child and for the school.
On the other hand, with an April baby you can stay part-time for the entire year if you wish, as your child won't be CSA until September 2019. But you must take up your place by summer term 2018 even though your child will not yet be CSA, or you will lose your place.

You asked for experiences:
A child in DS' class started in February after half-term break, at age 5. All other 29 children had started together in September, all full time from the start.
This child was very popular amonst the kids as the 'new child' and had no social issues whatsoever. Whereas in September, there was an incredible amount of social wrangling going on, establishing social hierarchies in ways I found shocking for 4/5 year olds, and was very painful for my own child.
Learning wise, the child was at least average in every topic, ahead in some (my own child's 'academic' learning slowed right down in reception, as he was one of 30 and preoccupied with social stuff rather than learning at his own pace, following his own interests, with close adult guidance/support - he would have learned much more in terms of maths/reading if I had kept him home).
Regarding settling in to the school routines and missing all the 'induction' activities at the beginning of the year, this child only profited. Instead of having to show 30 children the ropes, the teacher got to focus on just the one - and he had 29 class mates he could ask/copy if he was unsure. Whereas at the beginning of the year, everything can be a bit manic as none of the children know what's what, they copy each others' wrong behaviour, the teacher has to streamline everyone into a working routine before they can get to know and consider individual children's needs. For my DD, the first few weeks are what I am most concerned about, for this reason.

A couple of years later, a friend sent her summer born DD part-time. Initially she attended mornings only, after four weeks they changed to mornings+lunch, by October half-term the girl was asking to go full time, and though she did get pretty tired, never looked back. She definitely wasn't left out socially due to this. My take is that due to having her needs be met by having more time off, she was more able to pay attention/join in at the times she was in school. Also I think that for many children the social aspects and the very scarcely supervised free play in reception are the hardest, most tiring parts.

My now 8yo DS often said he didn't like nursery school - it turned out, because of meal times and the teachers making him drink more than he wanted to. In reception, he began really to dislike school, again because of lunch time: On the one hand, because there is preciously little supervision at lunch (nor in the times when most of the class has 'free play' whilst the teacher is working with a small group). If there happens to be a child in the class who for whatever reason lashes out at other children, verbally or physically, your child at age four will have to learn to deal with it pretty much on their own. You can 'tell the teacher' (if you recognise the behaviour as wrong in the first place - my DS was spat in the face, which was so outside of his frame of reference that he had no understanding of how bad it is and would never have told anyone) as much as you like, you can still be kicked under the table/have to endure deliberate meanness. All the lunchtime supervisors might do is insist you remain at your table rather than walk away from the situation, as you haven't eaten enough yet.

So I see many good reasons for delaying the start date, and/or going part time.

However every child is different, and though DS' 'full-time from the start' reception experience was pretty awful, we will still be sending DD from the start and will probably trial full time (the teacher has assured us that we could change back to part time if it wasn't working). Mainly because DD is such a different child than DS. I am hopeful that she will benefit academically from school where DS didn't; and that the social stuff will leave her untouched, whereas DS was hugely sensitive and aware of social relations, and therefore felt every rejection/isolation/put down very keenly.
So IMO it depends also on the particular child.

[depp1020]

That is very sound advice, Littlefish. DD has demonstrated that she can attend five sessions a week from her time at nursery. So it might be a good idea for her to attend every day but just to have a shorter day, as you suggest. I think that would be less disruptive. I'm sure that the phonics teaching happens in the morning.

Tiredbadger, I did consider homeschooling before finally deciding to send DD to preschool; she attended two morning sessions a week. I just felt that it was important for her to spend time away from me with other adults and children, particularly as she was becoming very clingy. This clinginess still continued when I would take her to weekly classes and stay and play sessions on the other days. DD's experience at nursery has been very positive, which is why I do want to give her the opportunity to go to school. I think that her not wanting to go might be a combination of the change that is happening but also the high expectations from the school. I think if she wasn't an only child with the potential to still be clingy, then homeschooling would be a good alternative. Thank you for sharing your experience; you are very fortunate to live in an area with a significant homeschooling community. If we do decide to go down this route at some point in the future, I may have to pick your brain! Out of interest, do you have a rough idea how long you plan on homeschooling or are you going to let things develop organically? Have people that you have met in your homeschooling community sent their children to school at some point and, if so, how did that work out?

[Tiredbadger]

Just to add another perspective, I am choosing to home educate my 4 year old and one of the many reasons I've decided to was because she didn't want to go to school. She had a place at our local primary which we initially deferred for a year and have now given the place up.

I am lucky to live in an area with a huge home schooling community with almost daily activities so she is getting all the socialisation and learning through play at her pace. It's not for everyone but it works for us, for now. Facebook is brilliant with finding local groups and meet ups. HTH.

[Littlefish]

At the school where I work, we offer all children the opportunity to start full time from day 1. However, we also offer the opportunity for children to attend papt time if parents think it is more appropriate. We always suggest that children attend 5 days a week though, so, for example, 5 morning for a week or so, followed by 5 mornings and lunch etc. Some children continue to attend part time until the October half term, doing a mix of whole days and half days. Almost always by this time the child is asking to stay all day.

You have a legal right to say that your child is going to be attending part time and the school cannot refuse. Be aware that they will tell you all sorts of things about the child missing out socially, or missing out on phonics teaching etc. Just see if you can find out if there is a set time in the day when they do their phonics input as it's worth making sure your child is there for that part of the day.

We suggest attending every day so that children get used to the routine of getting up and coming to school every day, even if they are shorter days.

[depp1020]

Thank you for sharing your experience and the advice, 5000KallaxHoles. Yes, it is a good idea to keep the first day low key too.

[5000KallaxHoles]

One of mine gets very very unsettled by transitions anyway - and her behaviour will decline the second moving on gets mentioned > from nursery to reception, and again from reception to Y1 and Y1 to Y2. Once she knows where the land lies - she's absolutely fine (10 minutes getting look round the new classroom and say hello to the teacher and it's sorted).

I did move mine from a school which I wasn't comfortable with how early it formalised education though - and although logistically it's more of a pain in the arse in terms of me having to do the school run by car and the like - it was definitely the right way to approach things with my kids.

I'd keep the uniform buying and the like low key, don't make a big thing of it because that'll feed into it in her mind and then keep the first day brisk and chirpy with an "ooh have a nice day, I'll pick you up at hometime and we'll have X for tea" or whatever and really don't dwell on it - the idea of the change coming is probably a large part of what she's getting upset about.

[drspouse]

you may not be able to pick and choose what part time you can have
It is entirely up to you. School can advise but they cannot insist.

[depp1020]

Thank you for sharing your experiences, Fatted and Witchend. It sounds like DD's reaction to change can be quite normal. And that is fine. I think what I am getting concerned about is if the expectations (academic and behaviour) from the school are too much for DD, and I think she has alluded to this. She just wants to play - all of the time. She has a fantastic imagination and uses expressive language, and plays in every single room of the house. I think she genuinely wants to stay at home because it is more fun and relaxed, and just wants a continuation of this. But she has thrived at nursery and learnt so much that she applies at home - the topic last half term was 'Inventions' and she's spent so much time over the holidays inventing things.

I totally see the benefit of going to school but unfortunately didn't find a school that felt like the right fit so we are just trying to make the best of the situation. I think that the reason I mentioned Dolphin School upthread is because I think it would have been a great fit and maybe I am just mourning the loss of this is an option. But of course I will continue to stay positive and keep things lighthearted.

[Witchend]

Being nervous about going to school is perfectly normal. I don't think it's easier for them when they're older.
If you try putting it off for her then she might suddenly decide she will like it, but I think the chances are higher that she'll have longer to worry about it and the worry will grow.
My oldest spent every summer holiday from preschool until year 5 worrying about the change. Within a couple of weeks of being back in September she was fine.

Part time may be an option, but be aware that you may not be able to pick and choose what part time you can have, most likely mornings in school.
I think part time is great for children starting, I don't know why people are so against it. Two of mine started straight in full time (Winter birthdays) and one (Summer birthday) did a week of part time and then full time. I think for two of mine that part time for at least a term would have been much better for them, and it wouldn't have been bad for the third.


What I would do now is not talk about it much. If she brings it up treat it as something casual. "I don't want to go to school." "Really? What would you like for lunch?"
You don't even need to get her trying on uniform etc. Just get stuff that will fit well enough.

If you treat it as not a big deal then you are helping not to build it up in her mind. She will still worry-as we all do when change is coming, but if you seem relaxed about it then it can't be too bad can it?

[Fatted]

Being nervous about starting school is totally normal and not at all any reflection of whether or not the school is any good.

The reluctance to go to nursery may purely have been because she knew change was coming. Honestly, the summer term is so hard and I practically had to drag my boys off and out every day in July!

DS2 who's 3 starts nursery school in September. He stopped wanting to go to nursery by about May (we get funding here for 2.5 hours from 2). Once he knew he was going to be going to school with his big brother, he just couldn't be arsed with nursery I think, was complaining all the time about going and was demanding to go to school.

I think once they know change is coming, they do start questioning everything and it makes them nervous. But like others have said, sell the positives. Lots of fun, new friends, lots of activities etc that she won't get at home.

[depp1020]

Thank you for your responses. I do like the idea of the part time option and will discuss with DH. This could really suit DD as she does get tired. She was still having a two hour afternoon nap until the end of April, when we encouraged her to drop it. Although she could quite easily have continued. Five mornings a week at nursery were just about manageable for her, even during the summer term. So having to go to school full time six weeks later is going to be a huge struggle. I think the part time option may give her the best of both worlds - I will look into it.

[Oscha]

Deferral just means going into reception a year later! Nothing has to happen in the meantime :)

Part time is definitely an option. I know quite a few people who sent their summer borns 4 days a week for the whole of reception. You can also (until she’s 5) just decide not to send her to school for the day if you think she’s tired, or you want to do something else. Legally, she doesn’t have to be there. Realistically, it’s nice to work with the school and work out a plan with them, so the teacher’s not being messed around, but she doesn’t reach compulsory school age until she’s 5, so if you want to send her mornings only, or 4 days a week, or take her out when you feel she needs a rest, or anything else, you’re perfectly entitled to do that. She doesn’t have to go to school this September.

[drspouse]

You can do what you like if she's under compulsory school age (the term AFTER she turns 5).
You tell them, you don't ask. It sounds like she might be happier with e.g. part time till Christmas. Some schools suggest they go for mornings only to have the "academic" parts but the school sounds a bit too pushy to me and I'd be inclined to have a day off to do fun things!

[depp1020]

drspouse - would it be too late to request a January start or could I contact the school when it opens in September? Or should I just send them an email and hope that someone picks it up over the holidays? Do you know the impact of doing this when everyone else is sending their children in September?

[depp1020]

Oscha - is part-time an option? I don't know anyone who's done this. Do you mean just send her for mornings only or three days a week, for example? Do you know anyone who has done this and how it worked out?

You have also mentioned deferring her for a year - are children in these circumstances then homeschooled? If so, I think it will be even harder to get DD to start school.

[drspouse]

They don't have a choice - they have to let her start in Jan. It's your legal right.

[depp1020]

Thank you for your insights, Lumpy76 and cakesandphotos. Unfortunately, the school does not offer a January intake otherwise this might have been an option. I am not aware of any of the other local schools offering this either. I'm not sure about the option about deferring her by a year because then I think it would be even harder to get DD to start school and she would be going straight into Year 1, which is a lot more formal than Reception (assuming of course the school agreed to this).

[Oscha]

She’s a summer baby-you could defer her for a year, or send her only part time?

[cakesandphotos]

I agree with Lumpy. If you feel your 4 year old isn’t ready, you’re not legally obligated to send her until she’s 5. Does the school offer a January intake? I know our local primary does. Could be just the extra time she needs

[Lumpy76]

Mum of 8 children says Go with your instinct - only you know your child and what’s best for hem!. Legally your child does not have to be in full time education (at school or otherwise) until the summer term 2019 or September 2019 (the start of the school term after she turns 5 - so depends on when in April the birthday falls (before or after Easter) so you have options if you don’t think full time school is the right choice right now xx