Yr 2 SATS

[Laura0806]

Just wondering if anyone could tell me. my DD was entered for level 3 in year 2 SATS, She panicked and said she didn't get any right (although shes well capable of the work). What happens if she didn't take the level 2 but fails the level 3, what will they give her as a level?Also, not that it really matters at this age but any tips to overcome nerves or anyone experienced chidlren who grow out of it?It can't be very nice for her although i think they are too young to be taking tests myself. Shes not 7 till August.

[Feenie]

Is that the offical guidance though? Various friends DCs at different schools were all given their SATs marks last year, some along with their NC level but one of them at one school was given a L3 for all subjects, no sub level and she was told that was his SATs results, they had never been given an NC level the whole time they were there, they just used A, B, C, D.

Yes, it's the law - in England state schools the teacher assessment NC level must be reported. If the child attains a level 2 in Reading, Writing or Maths then it must be finely graded - a 2c, 2b or a 2a.

If a level 1 or level 3 is attained, a whole level need only be reported with no sublevels.

In Speaking and Listening only a whole grade is provided at any level.

[Feenie]

Same for Science - whole level only.

[MrsMelons]

I see, I think my friend may have been confused then as she was convinced it was just SATs results but it is likely that was his assessment result overall in fact.

Thanks Feenie, thats really helpful.

[Feenie]

You're welcome

[MrsMelons]

[breadandbutterfly]

At parents' evening this year, we were told ds was on course for 3cs or 3bs in his SATS. If he gets 3cs, does that mean he gets a L3? That seemed to be what you were saying, feenie??

From what I've seen of his work at home, his maths is clearly L3, but his writing doesn't seem above a L2 to me - would be enormously surprised if he managed to get L3 in a writing test. But acc to this thread, the tests don't matter that much - so if his teachers think he's a 3c in writing generally, will they assess him as L3 anyway??

Obviously, as a parent, I'd be pleased with all L3s - but only if that is his standard. I don't want him under loads of pressure later because he's assumed to be capable of more than he is (high-achieving older siblings, which might have influenced school to expect top marks??).

[MrsMelons]

They don't mark then as 3c or 3b in the SATs (I definitely know that bit if nothing else) just a L3.

I am not sure about the rest, presumably he would still be marked a 3c in writing if he was consistently working at that level in class?

[twitchypalm]

Daft question time dk they do yr2 sats at same time as yr 6. Ive got ds in yr 2and dd in year 4 and no mention of sats thanks.

[mankyscotslass]

I think that YR2 SATS can be done any time in the school year, but that a lot of school do the tests at the same time as the YR6 tests - ours tend to do all of the tests that week of the YR6 tests.

THey do do the YR2 ones over a 3 week period though.

[hamsternumber1]

Ours definitely give level 2 & level 3 papers, so some children do both.

[Feenie]

At parents' evening this year, we were told ds was on course for 3cs or 3bs in his SATS. If he gets 3cs, does that mean he gets a L3? That seemed to be what you were saying, feenie??

Yes. At KS1 the only requirement is to report any level 3 as just a 3.

Some schools may choose to finely grade it, but they don't have to when reporting.

And yes, if he works at a 3c generally, that's what he'll get.

[Feenie]

mankyscotslass is right, except that there is no set time limit for the duration of the tests.

[breadandbutterfly]

Can I ask, as a bit shocked - ds came home and said he had his maths SATS today but that his teacher (well, teaching assistant) said he was 'cheating' because he was talking to another boy at the end of his test and so she made him cross out one of his answers the boys had discussed (that he knew he'd got wrong anyway) and then she crossed out all the answers he'd written on the last page?!

He says they weren't told they shouldn't talk at the end and he didn't change any of his answers. I'm very uncomfortable with a 6 year old being accused publicly of 'cheating' in a national test, esp as according to here, assessments will rest largely on his work over the year anyway.

I'm going to call the school tomorrow and try to resolve this, but is there something I'm missing here?

[Feenie]

I would be as pissed off as you if my ds - also in Y2 - had been treated like this.

[breadandbutterfly]

Oh, am hoping there is more to this story than I've been told as I know the teaching assistant well (has taught all 3 of mine) and she is v experienced (more in charge than the teachers!) so don't want a row but am Not Happy About This. :(

[Feenie]

Keep us updated, breadandbutterfly.

[breadandbutterfly]

Thanks - have just emailed the school asking his teacher to call me today to clarify situation - am hoping he misunderstood something as it sounds v odd... Will call school too in case they don't see the email (they don't always), to try to resolve this, as I was awake a large part of the night worrying about it. :(

[breadandbutterfly]

All resolved v quickly - as hoped, appears to have been a misunderstanding (well, a couple of misunderstandings). Teaching assistant called me shortly after seeing my email, and said she HADN'T crossed out any other answers, just marked that one answer as wrong (which he knew it was anyway). So his misunderstanding there.

She does seem to have told him he was 'cheating' - as the children were told clearly beforehand not to talk during the test - BUT she didn't realise he had already finished.

Hopefully no harm done - she said she'd tell him now that he hadn't lost any more marks than the one he knew he'd got wrong.

I'm happy to have talked about it with the teacher concerned rather than playing a game of Chinese Whispers with a teacher who might not even have been there yesterday (there are two part-time teachers, so the teacher I talked to today probably would not have been in the classroom yesterday, and would have had to go back and forth checking things with the TA).

Hope ds is now OK about it - he sounded upset yesterday at being accused (unfairly) of cheating, but if he understands it was a misunderstanding, and that in future 'big tests' he shouldn't talk until the teacher actually has his paper, hopefully he will be fine. :)

Hate exams for little ones... Six is very little to have the pressures of grown-up style 'exams'. :(

[MrsMelons]

THIS is why they are too young to be taking tests, they may have been told at the beginning but as they are 6 their 'listening' skills are not always great and may have forgotten by the end.

He wasn't accused unfairly of cheating as he was talking during a test which would not be allowed regardless of whether they had finished or not but I think it is difficult to have such high expectations of such young children and she should not have accused him like that at that age - all quite unfair TBH.

[breadandbutterfly]

Oh well, as long as he's not upset about it any more and hasn't lost marks, no great harm done.

But do agree it is a real shame they have to undergo formal testing at this age. I never did an exam until 11+ - and there are many who argue even that is too young. Six is so young to be doing 'exams' in academic subjects - in the US or Germany, say, they will not even have learnt to read/write formally by this age. In many countries, at 6 they are still at kindergarden, not in formal schooling.

[breadandbutterfly]

And yes, MrsMelons, agree that he wasn't accused 'unfairly' - but from his point of view, it was, because he didn't understand the rules, being 6 with no previous experience of exams.

Anyway, all resolved now, I hope.

[MrsMelons]

Hopefully he will forget all about it bless him!

DS1 has just done his and I went to see the teacher yesterday to check they were all over. The school apparently don't make a big deal about it but DS1 seems to be really suffering. He hates getting even one question wrong so the pressure he puts on himself is ridiculous and he has not been sleeping and been really down. It is such a shame as he did in fact get 100% right but he thinks he's 'rubbish' (his words).

I think it happens a lot, my colleagues DS1 has just done his KS2 SATs, in a practice Maths L6 paper he got one question wrong and was distraught. The parents didn't care of course but he was so hard on himself.

[breadandbutterfly]

Poor little things - though nothing on the shocking example of Taffeta's dd upthread - that was truly dreadful. Even in good schools where children are not so obviously 'labelled', the kids do know who is put in for which levels and which is the 'top' table etc - I don't remember any of this at primary. We had a star chart, but that was for good behaviour not academic achievement.

Big hugs to all stressed-out year 2s. :)

And their parents. :)

[MrsMelons]

They definitely do, at our school they have shapes or colours for groups but the children know which order they go in (least sides to the most sides etc, alphabetical order) and know which is the top/bottom.

I guess the fact that the papers have L2 or L3 on them gives it away for SATs

Glad it is over for all of them although DS is now convinced every piece of structured work they do is SATs!