Please can someone tell me about Steiner schools?

[cinnamonbun]

I'm looking into schools at the moment and was recently talking to someone whose kids go to a Steiner school in Kent. It sounded great (no formal learning until the age of 6 or 7 and lots of creative activities, etc) but DH says he's not keen as he's heard lots of bad things about Steiner schools...

I was hoping someone with experience could tell me about the good and bad things. I live in London. Thank you :)

[MarioandLuigi]

I couldnt help thinking after we had visited that it was very much like a hobby school, in that they seem to spend alot of time on various activities that could pass as hobbies, and much less time on actual learning.

[maverick]

Recent threads on Steiner -well worth a read.

www.dcscience.net/?s=steiner

[cinnamonbun]

Wow, i didn't expect so many replies and didn't know it was such a controversial topic. I did run a quick search on MN this morning but most mentions of Steiner was in the AIBU section so ignored them. I know the Steiner school in Islington doesn't have the best Ofsted report but I got so inspired when hearing my friend talk about it. But not being allowed to use computers, surely that's not the case anymore?!

[mrz]

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/education/516991-can-anyone-just-quickly-sum-up-the-whole-steiner-shebang

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/education/560454-for-anyone-wanting-to-know-about-steiner-waldorf-schools-but

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/education/329285-if-stiener-schools-are-so-good-why-doesn-t-the

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/education/487528-steiner-waldorf-schools-and-institutions

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/education/508456-steiner-waldorf-schools-and-institutions-2

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/primary/1057722-The-True-Nature-of-Steiner-Education

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/primary/745737-steiner-education-for-early-years

[mathanxiety]

They are just as much against computers and tv as ever, and their demands about how you regulate your home life can be quite intrusive, depending on how they think your child's soul work is proceeding.

[koekje]

Soul work? Dear Lord...

[SkinittingFluffyBunnyBonnets]

There are also rumours about racism in some schools and also predjudice against children with SN.

All I know is that my DH pointed out that there was not ONE child of an Ethnic minority in the school we visited....an this was in a very diverse area.

One could argue that perhaps the school did not appeal to other cultures...but come on...ALL of them? Did it only appeal to the white families nearby?

[mathanxiety]

The alleged racism or impression of appealing to only one set of people may have something to do with Steiner ideas of reincarnation and the idea of perfecting the soul -- there are quite rigid ideas of what constitutes perfection in Anthroposophy; these are central to the culture and the aims of the schools, and permeate every lesson. The 'teaching' of 'history' is done with the basic idea that western development represents a pinnacle of human civilisation.

[mrz]

www.steinerwaldorf.org/faqs.html#it

www.steinerwaldorf.org/faqs.html#tv

www.guardian.co.uk/education/2007/oct/30/schools.uk1

[SkinittingFluffyBunnyBonnets]

Either way mathanxiety it certainly wasn't for us! It looked and felt odd....te kids acted strangely and the walls were full of frankly weird art work.

That was what spoke to me loudest...no signs of originality in the art on the walls.

[onesandwichshort]

"To be honest, like so many people, I didn?t go to Waldorf looking for Waldorf education per se, I went to Waldorf because I was looking for something different."

I think that's the key problem.

I think that's why they still get people in, too. Lots of people want an alternative, and Steiner is pretty much the only alternative on offer.

I spent 2 terms at a Steiner toddler group (linked to school) when DD was 2. I came out of it convinced not only that it was not the place for her, but that they were really not people I would want in charge of much more than hamsters. There are some good ideas in Steiner's writing (along with a ton of horseshit), but everything he said had to be followed to the letter, like a cult. And the gnomes, oh the bloody gnomes...

[SkinittingFluffyBunnyBonnets]

That's so right onesandwich I wanted something non-traditional....other countries have alternaive schools and also Montessori is available right through!

What do we have? Steiner, private, homeschooling and the State!

Still, I sense a change-a-coming1 A glance at the thread currently in the Primary Educaton section of MN is showing people are not happy...many disussing home-ed and the faact that it is becoming more common. It shows a NEED for some smaller schools....schools with a more creative bent and a less full-on approach in the early years.

The gnomes were one of our most shocking discoveries too! When DD picked up a wooden bowl full of the faceless little horrors and her face was filled with fear....that really did put the kibosh on it for us!

[MarshaBrady]

A friend uses it. She is really into it. Can't understand why she hasn't mentioned the faceless gnomes . How odd!

[SkinittingFluffyBunnyBonnets]

Uses what MarshaBrady?

[MarshaBrady]

Sends children to Steiner.

[WhiteBumOfTheMountain]

Oh right! (it's me...SkinittingFluffyBunny...name changed now Easter is done) Maybe she doesn't want to scare you! They're pretty scary..

[Abr1de]

'One could argue that perhaps the school did not appeal to other cultures...but come on...ALL of them? Did it only appeal to the white families'


Most Asian and African families I know want academically rigorous schools. They wouldn't be impressed with gnomes and not using black paint or pens.

[MarshaBrady]

They sound terrifying , at a school.

She does love the whole thing, the community, the other parents, sends me emails miles long with poetry, quotes and semi-religious stuff written in fourteen different fonts.

So different to the threads I read on here, I just want to say but what about the gnomes? But I can't!

[WhiteBumOfTheMountain]

You should Marsha! You should say when one of them has been naughty "Ah...but it was the gnomes really wasn't it?!"

There has been talk of little folk in the forest getting up to naughty stuff and then putting the blame on the kids!

It's all to do with kids "still living half with the fairies...in the other world" until their milk teeth drop out.

[suburbophobe]

Too true, but then again, not many "minorities" at the Montessori (MonteSorry ) primary school my son went to either, but stood him in good stead in the long run (independance and all that)

Friend of mine who also had a mixed race child actually got a place at the Steiner school, because they had a 99% intake of blue-eyed, blonde children - not UK

(Wonder tho, how the Steiner school/anthroposophical (sp) philosophy deals with vaccinations etc if you want that for your child?)

At the end of the day, there are so many factors playing a role (have met adults from both educations who are positive/negative about them)

By the way, I have a friend in Norway, and their kids don't go to school till 7 years of age

[suburbophobe]

After all, the longer you leave your kids "away with the faeries", the better, no?

[mathanxiety]

No, the art has to be uniform. Colours and forms are felt to represent very specific developmental stages.

My DD2 did a wet on wet watercolour class once with a steiner teacher before I knew anything about steiner. The class was in a hall and not connected to a steiner school, though the teacher was really keen on having us take a serious look at her school for DD2 and I later realised that she fit many pf the physically desireable characteristics of anthroposophy. But her artwork wasn't 'right' at all and it greatly puzzled the teacher. DD2's paintings looked lovely and dreamy to me, no swirls, or shapes, just clouds of pastel colour -- apparently this was 'wrong' and she should have created shapes. But she was never told that shapes were desired and she herself felt that she was falling short, but could never figure out why. In the end it was upsetting and very mysterious for her and it made me feel that I had exposed her to something that had made her conscious of herself in a negative way.

[onesandwichshort]

Apparently the faceless dolls are so that the child can project their own emotions on to them. DD has been given two of them, I swear neither have ever, ever been played with.

And the gnome thing, while very funny,also exemplifies for me the whole absurdity of the Steiner outlook. He said that children should learn about folklore and traditions - which is a good thing. But because Steiner was German, all they teach is German folklore and traditions, in all its gnometastic glory. Not only does it show how utterly literally they take his writings (worrying, given how much racism there is in them), but it also spectacularly misses the point - because children here aren't learning about their own folklore and traditions. But you couldn't ever explain that to them...

[GapsAGoodUn]

I have mixed feelings about this as my dd did go to a Steiner 'influenced' kindergarten for a year and loved it. it was just right for her at that moment in her development and the woman who was in charge was a really strong but warm character.

Unfortunately, circumstances forced it to close - I felt sad but philosophical about it and dd (now nearly 8) is now in a mainstream school and doing v.nicely.

The woman who ran it was militantly only 'Steiner inspired' as a result of all the bollocks anthroposophy. Yes there were a lot of gnomes but that fitted in with all our walks around nature (ok, so I've always told my children that acorn cups are fairies soup bowls ).

Would I have been brave enough to continue through Primary level? Probably, on balance, no. It helped my daughter through some tough adjustments though and for that I'll always be grateful to that woman.

[cinnamonbun]

Ok, well I'm definitely not putting my child in a Steiner school. The whole gnome thing has made me laugh though