difference between French and British way of correcting homework

[iamnotaprincess]

Niece is staying with us who is being educated at a French school. She showed me her school books, FULL of red marks to correct anything from spelling, grammar, etc.

My own ds' school books instead have stickers, smily faces, the teacher does not correct all the errors.

Who is doing it right?

Am not from the UK, so all new to me....

Both kids are 7.

[Sassyfrassy]

I mark to the learning objective, so if the focus of the lesson was on spelling or grammar, then that's what I would mark. Depending on what I think the child is ready for, or what the top priority is, I would also mark one or two other things. Marking all the errors in a piece of writing doesn't work as there will be too much usually to take in. If instead I focus for example on the use of speech marks, then once that has been mastered, we can move on to something else.

[MathsMadMummy]

I read the other thread on this as well. I agree it has to be a correction worth making - constructive, I suppose.

[saintlydamemrsturnip]

DS2 (now year 3) has weekly dictations - I think they started in year 2. He's turning into a pedant and has been known to correct my grammar. I went to primary school in the 70's so was taught to throw paint creatively.

[MathsMadMummy]

I guess it really depends on age but who's to say what age?

I mean, it would be dreadful to mark a yrR/1 child for their spelling as they are generally in a particular stage of learning to spell, where they are using phonetic rules but not necessarily the right one (can't remember what this stage is called but it's mentioned in this book)

it would be damaging to correct everything at this stage certainly, because it's a really important process in learning to write. I remember a thread where OP's DD had written 'while' as 'wighl' - what a clever thing to do! she knew that 'igh' made the same sound in high, night etc.

I'm waffling. anyway an older child should be corrected more. my DSD has trouble spelling and I can't help feeling that now age 12 she's got the impression that she can 'get away with it' so to speak. difficult to find the balance though as she's easily demotivated.

[ViveLaFrak]

This is where it's important to remember that French children don't formally read or write until they're in CP, which is around 6 years old. In maternelle there's a lot of focus on fine motor skills, mark making and shape recognition etc but they're in the equivalent of Year 2 before they're expected to actually pick up a pen and write words. So, whilst I agree the age makes a difference, a child in the equivalent of R/Y1 just wouldn't have those corrections. The process is very controlled, you build up the skills by learning the correct way to form the letters and copy them until it's well ingrained, then you move on to simple dictees with no tricky tenses or punctuation and then you build on those skills etc.

Also French is quite a phonetic language so it's relatively easy to guess at the spelling (as long as you learn your verb conjuations!). More so than in English I find...

[cazzybabs]

edam - I teach a specific spelling lesson

I practise spelling and phonic work everyday (as per literacy hour). But I do not correct every spelling.

Most of my class have spelling ages above their chronological age.

Grammar is different - they have specific writing targets which mostly are grammar based. Most of them are focused on full stops and capital letters STILL...

[RockinSockBunnies]

I wish they had the French system here. Every single parents' meeting that I go to, I highlight the lack of correction in DD's work and get the same old answer that they don't want to demoralise the children or stifle their creativity.

Fine, except that no-one will understand their creative writing if it's full of spelling and grammar mistakes.

I'm totally anal about spelling and grammar, point out mistakees in leaflets, posters, signs etc (to the joy of shopkeepers....)

So, I do wish that the English state system was structured, repetitive and focused on right/wrong answers (as it was in my English private prep school).

[Bonsoir]

My DD is at a French school and is already used to being marked with that red pen!

I ensure that her creativity is encouraged outside school since I know that school will not be nurturing creativity.

It is, IMO, very important indeed to learn how to write, spell, form letters, do sums etc correctly and how a child is expected to learn those things if their errors are not explained to them is quite beyond me!

[IndigoBell]

Rock - why do you care about your child's spelling? Your child will soon do all their work on a computer and will always be able to use a spell checker / grammar checker.

If however you do care - why don't you teach them to spell yourself?

I'm not at all saying it's not important. Just that it's not as important as being able to get your thoughts on to paper.

No one could write a novel if they spent all their energy focusing on spelling and grammar. That comes after many many rewrites and edits.

If a child can spell the 300 most frequently used words correctly, which is 75% of the words we use, their work will be perfectly readable.

So it seems perfectly reasonable to me to teach spelling separately from writing. And to not demotivate with loads of corrections.

[Bonsoir]

"No one could write a novel if they spent all their energy focusing on spelling and grammar. That comes after many many rewrites and edits."

I used to earn my living writing long, creative documents (not novels, but similar process). Very little editing or rewriting was ever necessary - thank goodness, or I wouldn't have earned much!

Getting spelling and grammar right first time round is absolutely essential.

[IndigoBell]

Bonsoir - Wow! You are absolutely the first creative writer I have every heard saying that getting spelling and grammar right first time is a good thing. It is absolutely irrelevant whether it's right first thing - or after a session with a spell checker.

I don't know how many revisions (probably about 20) I had to do on my book - but it certainly became better with every revision.

[cazzybabs]

So none of you can spell or have good grammar...

it comes with practise and experience

[ViveLaFrak]

I think there's a difference between writing, say, a novel where it doesn't matter how many times you have to rewrite and writing a document where you're on a very tight deadline and there simply isn't the time for rewriting. If all your energy is going on spelling and grammar then clearly that deficiency is impeding communication! Good spelling and grammar, or good enough spelling and grammar, should be effortless and that only comes with a lot of practice and correction.

It's also, IMO, dangerous to rely on spell-checkers etc. Last time I checked GCSEs, A-levels and most university exams weren't done using a computer and not only are there points available for spelling, punctuation and grammar but at university level grammatical or orthographical errors could completely change the meaning of a phrase.

Getting thoughts onto paper is a skill which either comes naturally or needs to be learned. A knowledge of grammar needs to be acquired regardless of the facility with which one can articulate/write thoughts.

Now I'm sure the spelling/grammar/whatever of my posts on MN could be improved, but 99% of the time people can understand what I'm trying to put across because it's being done in sufficiently standard English. If my posts weren't in standard English people would probably have to work a lot harder to decipher them, which takes time and effort, which in some industries quite literally is money.

[RockinSockBunnies]

I care because a PC's spelling and grammar check doesn't pick up an awful lot of errors.
And, sometimes, just sometimes, people actually hand-write things (invites, birthay cards, thank you cards....)

DP is terrible at spelling - I re-did his CV for him, and the spell checker hadn't noted that reading the January addition of a magazine might not help him get a job, whereas if they'd searched an architectural magazine's January edition it might have helped.

[MathsMadMummy]

they won't always sort it out though tribunalgoer, my DSD is a prime example. fantastic at writing stories, very creative but will not get far with it as it stands because of her poor writing skills however I'm following MN advice and may get her a dictaphone so she can get her creative ideas out, and then focus on writing it down with a bit more accuracy.

also correction is about context too I suppose. as you can see my grammar/punctuation is pants on MN, but it's enough to understand what I'm saying (hopefully!) - I don't need to be grammatically perfect on a message board. but throughout my academic career I've been able to produce grammatically perfect essays, and when I'm a teacher one day I'll be able to teach my charges properly (unlike a lot of my DSDs' teachers). that's where it counts.

[cazzybabs]

isn't practise the verb?

willing to be wrong.....

[MathsMadMummy]

practise is the verb - scream
practice is the noun - ice cream

that's how we learnt it in school

however looking at the sentence 'it comes with practise and experience' I actually can't figure out whether it's supposed to be the verb or the noun!

guess it's too long since I wrote an essay!

[cazzybabs]

clearly this is why I don't correct every spelling.... I think it is supposed to be the verb...you need to practise to get better

[ViveLaFrak]

It's the noun in that phrase.

It comes with experience (noun).
It comes with ice-cream and experience (noun + noun).
It comes with practice and experience (noun + noun).

If you try to substitute the verb it doesn't work.

It comes with scream and experience.

The verb would be used like this:

Practise using grammar and it will come naturally.

[MathsMadMummy]

brilliant