Am I drinking too much?

[fiziwizzle]

I hope this isn't too contentious. I have taken most of the pregnancy advice with a pinch of salt as I reason, I'm not ill, I'm pregnant (re exercising etc) and also, women have been doing this for thousands of years without avoiding soft cheese/pate/shellfish. So I'm eating nuts, soft boiled eggs and pate and I'm also having a few drinks a week.

I know that a glass of wine (175ml) contains 2 units and so does a pint of beer, and I have either a glass of wine or a pint of beer on 3 - 4 occasions per week. This is more than my MW recommended (1 to 2 units, once to twice per week) but I reason, if 2 units are OK on one day, why are they not OK on the next?

My drink is always with a meal, and on the odd occasion I have had two glasses of wine over a long meal (a few hours).

I think (I hope!) that I'm being sensible here, not sticking rigidly to guidelines but using my common sense. I'm 15+3 and this is my first, so I have no past experience to guide me. I just sometimes lie awake and worry that I may be harming the baby - even though, in my view, the advice about abstaining in pregnancy is scaremongering, and the body is designed to protect the baby above all else.

I suppose I'm asking for someone to put my mind at rest.... Or I may be in for a telling off!

[MrsTrue]

Yes, I think this is too much. Remember your liver is under more pressure when pregnant as it has to work for you and your baby and it needs multiple 'days off' to recover and rebuild between drinking. If you want to continue drinking I'd cut down and make sure you give yourself a good break between drinks.

Remember liver issues in pregnancy can be VERY serious in pregnancy and harm both you and your baby. Also alcohol drinks have got a lot stronger in the last few decades!

[again2020]

Hi Op, I'm late to the party but I had to comment as I was someone who missed drinking in pregnancy and I did drink, not as much/regularly as you suggest but there were some occasions I definitely had too much.
It was 2017 and a year of moving house and hen dos/ weddings for me and I had 2 large glasses of wine in a beer garden on one occasion when we got our moving in date, a cocktail on a hen do, a glass of prosecco at a wedding and half a beer most weeks. I even got one or two comments as people (in laws) thought I was drinking too much 🙈
I'm now of the persuasion that 1 or 2 units once a week is fine, but not more than that. I look back now and feel a bit ashamed of what I drank. My DD is absolutely fine, very bright. But if I had my chance again I'd go for alcohol free beers and wines. They have come a long way even in the last few years.
My favorites are: brewdog punk af or hazy af beer, and erdinger alcohol free.
Eisberg alcohol free wine is nice, and Belle and co proscesso is lovely.
I'm sure your baby will be fine and wish you luck with the rest of your pregnancy.

[Honeymint]

Although I wouldn’t do it myself, I found the section on alcohol in ‘Expecting Better’ very interesting. Apparently more recent studies show that drinking a smaller amount in one go means the alcohol is processed by the liver before ever making it to the placenta.
However even by those standards it seems like you’re drinking too much.

I can’t be too judgy myself, at the start of my pregnancy I craved sushi and brie (I made sure to cook the brie thoroughly on a pizza, only ate it on day of purchase and bought a brand I felt safe with).
But whereas a lot of food rules are there to avoid the small chance of food poisoning, alcohol restrictions are there to prevent fetal alcohol syndrome.
Foods on the unsafe list are usually there as a precaution, but alcohol is a poison at the end of the day. One that’s fine for an adult but can affect a baby quite badly.

Like others have said, I can’t reassure you as I personally think you’re drinking too much. I’d discuss this with your midwife if you can.

[JoeyLin]

Can't comment on the amount of alcohol...

but you write 'I just sometimes lie awake and worry that I may be harming the baby'...

From that sentence alone - is it worth it, whether there is some guidance for or against.... if that is how you feel.. I'm sure its possible to live without or cut down even further.

[SconesForTea]

@thetruthisoutthere89 yes I did continue to have a few glasses of wine each week. My daughter is now nearly 12, at senior school and doing very well indeed - she is extremely intelligent and talented in all sorts of ways

[thetruthisoutthere89]

@fiziwizzle wondering if everything was safe and healthy with your baby ? If you continued to have a few wines or so a week ? :)

[SolidGoldBrass]

I do get very tired of foetus worshippers - peole who fuss about every aspect of a pregnant woman's behavioru in case she might have found out a way to enjoy herself or indeed might not want to continue her pregnancy in the first place (much of the more demented stuff comes from people allied with the anti-choice movement in the first place). It;s a particular mindset that is all about controlling women, the people who make the loudest fucking row about pregnant women's behaviour are invariably the least interested in doing anything that might benefit actual existing children, or indeed those foetuses and their mums who would benefit from better-funded maternity care

[Boobz]

Of course eligible to join the thread Renee! Just not able to have a reasoned debate based on fact with me. But then I can have those debates elsewhere and leave the emotion on this thread where, perhaps, it belongs, as the OP did ask for everyone's opinions, not just mine.

[skidoodle]

solidgold clap clap clap

[SpawnChorus]

MustHave - oh don't say that about stress! I've been having a stressful pregnancy and I hate the thought that I'm passing on worried vibes to the baby. Maybe I should hit the booze to chill out a bit

[MustHaveaVeryShortMemory]

fiziwizzle: I think its unlikely that the amount of alcohol you are drinking will cause a problem. But if it is worrying you I would cut down!! You are probably doing more harm through stress than alcohol.

I had a few glasses of wine a week (after sickness had gone) throughout pregnancy. I realised that a glass of wine is 125ml and that if the wine is 13% alcohol, one glass is 1.6 units. So its very easy to have more than you thought.

Best of Luck.

[ReneRusso]

Boobz - most human decisions are based on emotion not logic, and most of us will do what feels right for us rather than what is strictly scientific. The OP asked for opinions and those opinions are largely formed from emotions. The scientific facts you give I'm sure are even more useful. My feeling is that 4x a week is a bit much, but that's just a feeling not a scientific fact. Should I not be eligible to join in the thread?

Imagine mumsnet with only rational debate allowed

[Boobz]

The more responses to this I read, the more I realise that this is actually not an argument worth of debate. People make decisions about pregnancy based a lot on emotion, rather than hard evidence, and therefore you can't have a rational debate as there are always those people who will resort to emotional argument rather than a scientific one, and you can't reason with emotion most of the time. I have cited evidence (several pieces of robust research) that 4 glasses of wine a week will not harm your foetus. It won't - hundreds of thousands of pregnancies have born this result (if you excuse the pun)... and yet people will still say "you should abstain from alcohol completely, to not do so is selfish". This response does not make any sense to me when it has no scientific basis. So I cannot argue with those people any more - we shall never agree, and nothing I say will ever change your mind. I could present evidence with millions, rather than hundreds of thousands of pregnancies showing that 4 glasses of wine a week will not cause FAS or any symptoms relating to the spectrum, and people will still come on here and say the OP is drinking to much and risking the foetus.

So what's the point?

[ReneRusso]

I am pregnant with my 3rd child and I am a bit slapdash about peanuts, eggs, pate, soft cheese and all that, but I am a bit more strict about alcohol. I will allow myself one or two units once or twice a week if I get past 12 weeks. But at the moment (7+6) I am not drinking at all. As for the OP, well you probably have enough answers by now, but my view is that yes perhaps it is a bit too much. I also really regret having eaten pate the other day as I subsequently had terrible cramps for 24 hours - may be unrelated, but I wish I hadn't taken the chance. Peanuts though I feel are ok. A doctor friend of mine thinks exposure is more likely to protect the baby from a peanut allergy. Also I find peanuts are a good snack to stave off morning sickness.

[mogend77]

mummyslittleboy

There is no way you can know that what you did was the cause of either of those things.

Eczema/allergies are so incredibly common & there are many things far more likely to cause them than nuts in pregnancy (are you aware that they are changing the guidelines as it is now deemed that exposure to nuts does not increase the risk?). I seriously doubt your consumption of nuts caused that - he was almost certainly predisposed to allergies anyway, genetically, and even if it was environmental factors there are other things that are far more likely to be the causes.

As for your drinking at that level in the very first few weeks of pregnancy, before you found out - well I have never come across any HP who thinks that there is a danger before you find out given that most people know by 5/5 weeks at the latest - unless you find out particularly late. (Also the OP is not talking about having 3-4 drinks every night but that is not my point.)

Guilt (unfounded) in mothers has a habit of finding something to settle on & all mothers look for things to blame themselves for when their children have problems, or when they mc etc. It is rarely the case though, that the thing that the mother settles on was actually to blame. If you hadn't been drinking/eating nuts in early pregnancy, you would just have found something else you did to blame it on. Have you actually had a HP say that these things were your fault? I'd be astonished (and shocked) if you had.

[mummyslittleboy]

Hi

I do think what you are doing is wrong you are not really thinking of your child by carrying on like this I might sound a bit harsh but with DD2 before I found out I was pregnant I had a craving for nuts i stopped when i found out i was pregnant 14 weeks and when she was 3 months old we discovered she had a whole host of allergies and she ended up with severe eczema and ending up having to bandaged because it was weeping so bad she is fine know as she has grown out of it but i felt awful. Then DS wasborn 11 years later again at the beginning before finding out I was pregnant for about 4 weeks had a craving for bottled lager and was drinking 3-4 a night at the time i was under a lot of stress from work so put it down to needing to unwind my DS was born and in March of this year was told he has learning difficulties as well as other problems believe me if I had my chance again I would be sticking to everything they tell you not to do it really IS NOT worth the risk

[diddl]

I just can´t see why if you´re at all concerned, giving upalcoholfor the pregnancy is such a big deal.
Noone can reassure either way, as no one knows!

[somanyboyssolittletime]

Like others, I didn't find out I was pregnant with my first until around 10 weeks and had been drinking during that time. TBH I still haven't forgiven myself and spend lots of time looking for signs of FASD in him, and comparing him to my other 2 children (who I didn't break any of the 'rules' with). It is not a nice feeling to have about someone you adore, when you know that there was no-one to blame but yourself.

I think that I am probably just paranoid, but isn't it simply better to look back and think, I did everything I could for my baby?

I am not saying don't touch a drop, but perhaps just a glass a week would be enough, and something to look forward to!

[SolidGoldBrass]

I think it's very important to realise that being pregnant doesn;t mean your life is over, you are public property and must immediately renounce everything you enjoy or need to do Just In Case. No matter what you do, most of the time it will make no difference to the outcome of your pregnancy: what happens to a foetus has a lot to do with genetics on both sides, and random combinations of factors: no matter how self-sacrificing and obedient you are (giving up alcohol, fat and sugar for three months before you even start having sex, as some of the more demented woman-as-walking-incubator-and-nothing-else propaganda would have it) you can still have a non-healthy baby or a miscarriage. It's perfectly OK to think that being PG is just a part of life, not The Most Important Thing You Will Ever Do and Far More Important than you are...
ONe more time: there is no evidence of foetal damage caused by light or moderate drinking. Foetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder is a misogynist myth (labelling perfectly normal variations in development as all the fault of the evil stupid selfish bitches who didn't lock themselves indoors for 9 months). Very heavy drinking on a regular basis isn't good for you let alone being risky for a foetus.

[mogend77]

FWIW, though clearly it varies depending on what you read, generally 1-4 units a week is considered light drinking, up to 10, or up to 14 depending what you read is considered moderate, 14+ is heavy & 25+ is hazardous/problematic.

The NCT summary of the evidence about drinking in pregnancy state that light (1-4) is not a problem & moderate(4-10) is unlikely to be a problem (ie it has never been demonstrated to be a problem by any evidence).

I don't think it's fair to say that those people who have done their research and concluded that light/moderate drinking is probably safe are "self-justifying" simply because they have shared their decision making process in response to a question.

[SCRUFF1]

p.s, I have becks blue bottled alcohol free beer...really good and very little difference to the real thing. Helps me feel more sociable when with friends having a few drinks!
Alcohol free wine....YUK YUK!!! [GRIN]

[SCRUFF1]

I have similar concerns to fiziwizzle.But think Boobz spoke a lot of sense, backed up with strong sound evidence. I understand the concerns of everyone on this link and see that most of you have expressed yourself in a concerned and sensible way. However for those who completely condemn fiziwizzle,I just wonder how many of you are abstaining from all things 'unhealthy' in pregnancy. Are you taking regular physical excercise, watching and regulating the amount of weight you gain etc? I understand that only posting reassuring messages is not sending the right message out, but equally I find it shocking that you can suggest someone has a 'problem' for having a glass of wine a few times a week!
I go to the gym 2 - 3 times a week,drink lots of water, avoid the foods considered unhealthy in pregnancy and live a very healthy life style. I do however (get ready to shoot me down ladies) have a SMALL measured out glass of wine with my meal most evenings. Does that mean I have a problem? I don't think so. I am avoiding all things unhealthy and consider my one treat a day is of no harm to anyone....especially not my baby. (I am expecting my third baby) My pregnancy book suggests the same thing.I do worry about the health of my baby, and would defy any of those who abstain altogether to say that you do not worry about the health of your baby as a result of things you have done.
I think you need to think very carefully before judging someone, especially someone expecting there 1st child.
Just food for thought,

[SolidGoldBrass]

I did not at any point say that because my DS was fine everyone else's babies will be. I said that NO ONE can predict the outcome of a pregnancy 100% and therefore women should do what they feel is right and not worry about every little thing.
As to all the squealing about pate and cheese, why not have a little think about how many times you've actually caught listeria from eating those things? Would that by any chance be four fifths of fuck all? Again, it's scaremongering over something which is a very small risk (most pate and soft cheese being not actually crawling with listeria) and it's about furthering the assumption that pregnant women are no longer to be allowed to make their minds up about anything but are fair game for silly fingerpointing twats with too much time on their hands and no concept of risk assessment.

[PreciousCargo]

Personally, I "love" a glass of wine but just couldn't enjoy it now I am pregnant. I agree with the above from LittleMissBliss, listen to what your inner voice is telling you. Is it really worth the risk? Imagine how great that glass of champers will taste when you finally toast the birth!