Post-grad Brookers, over here! We will Brook No Argument that all Mini-Brookers sleep 12 hours a night and behave angelically during the day

[TooImmatureTurtleDoves]

Over here!

[DreamingOfPeace]

Fb group? What fb group? How do I join?!

[TooImmatureTurtleDoves]

Biscuits, I'm not FB friends with your sister - I try to keep work people off my FB! DH is, but I don't think she would be able to see you - I would have to friend her before that would happen. And FB is blocked at work, and anyway, we don't work in the same building any more, so it's not like she could accidentally look over my shoulder and spot you.

Ow, I think I'm getting a stye - my eyelid is all sore. I Googled it and all the advice says do not attempt to burst them or pull out the eyelash you think might be infected. I really want to yank the eyelash out so it drains it!

Dream, you are not a bad mother at all! Stop thinking that! You are doing a brilliant job and coping marvellously. You've had a really rough ride - more reflux, colic, poo bugs and everything than anyone else, coupled with the fact that you have two who don't sleep at the same time!

[Biscuitsandtoffeeapples]

I'm fb friends with her though too so she would be able to see my friends etc iyswim? And fb frequently tells me that one of my friends has posted on someone else's wall or photo or whatever when I don't know the other person. I just prefer to err on the side of caution

Agree with what Too says Dream. I have no doubt that your boys will get all the stuff the same as everyone else does. The one thing I've learned from ds1 is that by probably 3 yo you really can't tell who sat first, walked first etc. in your job you see the children who have developmental issues but I bet that is never 'caused' by a lack of tummy time or whatever? And you say you spend one each day with them trying to do sitting etc - even a few minutes. I rarely do anything like that . The absolutely huge majority of children will develop to learn to sit / roll / stand / walk etc in their own time. And it's not your fault that they have been poorly / suffering with the various challenges that have been thrown your way. and thus have only had limited opportunities for tummy time etc. it's no one's fault, just one of those things and everything will come in due course. One of my friends has a baby with similar issues to yours, with huge colic issues, possible cmpi etc and the fact of the matter is that he just can't do the lying down stuff because he is just uncomfortable in a lying position and far prefers to be upright. But they will all get there so just keep that in mind. I know it's hard though when it is your job to look at stuff like that. I suspect my own ignorance allows me to pass stuff by in a haze though

[TooImmatureGhostiesAndGhoulies]

Oh yes, duh! Of course you would be friends with her! Totally forgot about that. I'm in a secret FB group atm - I wonder if my friends get suggestions about people in that group? Must ask someone. Still, I think so long as we just both join the group but don't friend each other we should be able to see the group things but not out you. Does that make sense?

Yy to the developmental stuff, Dream/Biscuits. Of my three little siblings, DB, the eldest, walked earliest at about 10 months or thereabouts. My third sister walked at about 11 months, and my second sister walked at a year. However, now at the age of 8, my second sister is the cleverest - best attention span, picks things up easily, remembers everything you tell her, can play most board games better than DB, who is 10. So it really won't matter in a few years time how fast babies do things - it's got no bearing on their intelligence or athleticism later in life!

[hawthers]

Grr more arseyness from DH related to DS1's prematurity and preachool. Totally doing my head in.

[scarletfingernail]

Does DH not want DS1 to go?

[Biscuitsandtoffeeapples]

Hawthers what's the prob? Does he fall into a different year / term for funding because of being born sooner?

I think you're right Too if we are in the secret society group but not 'friends' we should be fine.

[hawthers]

Diff year issues and he just started and had our first bday party today and the difference between children has got to DH. Can't expand more now, will update later

[hawthers]

Secret group, what secret group?

[Biscuitsandtoffeeapples]

There is a fb group Hawthers where we can reveal our true identities .

I believe there are a mix of TTCers, PSEPPs and sleep deprived new mummies

[scarletfingernail]

Apparently there's a secret Facebook group for Brookers which was set up a while ago, but most of us post grads didn't know about it as we don't visit the conception and ante-natal threads that much. Rubber's on it though and myself and Scream I think are now joining and hopefully Dream too. If you're interested PM FluffyJawsOfDoom a link to your FB page and she'll add you on. As Rubber said you only put on what you're comfortable with and you don't have to "friend" anyone if you don't wish to.

[scarletfingernail]

Cross posts Biscuits

[musicalmrs]

I'm part of the group too. Actually, I've just tried it, and think I might be able to add members too..? Rubber, can you? (I haven't actually tried, as I obviously don't want to add any non-MNers...). Just thought you might want another in in case Fluffy is mid sneeze ;) I announced Iz's birth on there before MN, as MN was down (typical)...

Like Rubber, I've friended quite a few people on there. (Rubber, Iz has also had a raspberry blowing day!).

Dream, you are a fantastic mother. I know plenty of poeple who don't do a thing with their babies, and they develop ok. I know you worry about it, but remember you only see the worst cases (if I remember rightly?). You do as much as you humanly can with your two AND DD, and you're absolutely fantastic at it!

Quiet day today. Found something that helped Iz with her teething though - will share in case others haven't heard of it! We were given one of those mesh feeding things (a mesh bag, with a handle on the top, so you can put in food and it can be sucked to death I think). I've found a breastmilk ice cube, slightly crushed, inside that worked wonders to keep her quiet for a while - she sucked and chomped on it, and really enjoyed it! She doesn't like cold teethers, and I think it's because of the cold handle bit to hold - but this worked a treat.

Right, better get to bed as I have a student tomorrow morning, followed by a day with the in laws... my step MIL always has some inappropriate comments to be made. I'm betting tomorrow they'll be about me still BFing (due to the dairy issues in our families, holding onto that for as long as possible, trying to avoid the introduction of formula just in case - until she's a little older at least), and about the fact we've not started weaning her yet...

Will have to think of a halloween name.

Hope all brookers still hiding under a pile of washing manage to escape soon - managed to sort and iron all of mine last night. Need to do another load tomorrow though. Why is washing so relentless?

[DreamingOfPeace]

too, I'm well aware of that, I tell parents that too sometimes :) . thanks for the encouragement. I'm slightly jittery though as DD looks slightly dyspraxic to me, her cousin definitely has coordination problems and had globally delayed development- wasn't even pulling to stand aged 2 never mind walking- and Dh's brother as a child and both his children ( the one with global delayed development and his little sister) had/have speech delays. His brothers nickname at uni was still 'mumbles'! To be fair, the delayed cousin who's now 7 has caught up well in most areas, and is doing well academically I'm gobsmacked he caught up so much but is markedly behind with running etc and school is a cruel place!! So I am aware, but trying not to worry, that DD is not great with lots of some motor planning/ coordination things and is not speaking at 25 months. Well, she can say mummy, daddy, no, more, baa, bubbles and wierdly, 'I want some more' but no attempts at/parroting other words etc. Dh's bloody family's duff genes of course, the delay issues are from his side!!!! . And i don't care if she's first or last to do things as long as she's healthy and happy. And I bet if I didn't see kids worrying/ withdrawing from physical things as they realize they're not as good as their peers, usually around age 7-8 I bet I would be able to dismiss my concerns more easily. Hopefully they'll come to nothing anyway, she's only little...

Would you want him to be in the year he should have been in if he'd been born at term hawthers? Does your Dh think he needs extra catching up time?!

Love the festive name biscuits btw. I'd like a toffee apple now, or one of the ones dunked in chocolate then hundreds and thousands, mmmm And not relevant to this conversation at all really but i do see children with issues caused by no tummy time/ floor time/ opportunity to develop, sadly. We see issues caused by neglect/severe neglect- I've seen a 2 year old who used to be left to spend 20 hours a day in her cot :( . She was a Looked After child with a lovely foster carer when I met her and her brother though. Does put my boys 'neglect' into perspective, but then we all strive to do the best for our children, not the minimum, no?!

[DreamingOfPeace]

Gah, x post with a million people...

[Biscuitsandtoffeeapples]

Oh of course we all want to do the best Dream - I certainly didn't mean in any way shape or form that you were neglecting the DTs or were doing the minimum - quite the opposite in fact. It's sad that there are such neglected children though - makes me very

Also, talking wise, ds1 probably didn't have even as many words as your dd at 24-25 months. Certainly only the odd word here and there and by 3 was completely the same as his little friends. With full sentences etc. And I don't really consider him to have been overly 'delayed' / didn't think he was masses behind even at 24/25 months.

[Biscuitsandtoffeeapples]

Also, what is dyspraxic?

[TooImmatureGhostiesAndGhoulies]

Sorry Dream, didn't mean to teach you to suck eggs! I forgot that you would know all about development issues - doh! 20 hours a day in a cot is horrible. I don't mean to belittle your concerns or tell you your job, but didn't you say that your DD crawled and walked early? Doesn't that make dyspraxia less likely? Of course, I had to Google dyspraxia to remember what it was, so my opinion is not exactly informed.

Hawthers, what happened?

[ScreamIfYouWantToGoFaster]

Is it wrong that I'm glad I'm not the only one who didn't know about the FB group?! I don't feel so Johnny-no-mates anymore!

I think Fluffy must be mid-sneeze though! I PM'd my FB link to her this morning, and she added me as a friend on FB, but has since vanished and not actually invited me to the group. I suspect this sudden disappearance indicates exciting events are afoot! No Brooking super hard for her and her DD!!

Interesting (and in some places very sad - 20 hours in a cot?! :( ) chat about development ladies. I'm a ridiculous worrier, and I know I get fixated on tiny unimportant things. My family all started walking between 7 months and 9 months - that's all my Aunts and Uncles as well as myself and my siblings. However DH's family are much slower in that arena. So it's perfectly reasonable that DD might naturally start walking at 10+ months, but I know that my family and I will start stressing out if she gets to month 10 and isn't walking. I'm already trying to force myself to stop stressing about it IN ADVANCE. I'd like to add that I'm fully aware how ridiculous and unreasonable my expectations are, and I promise I don't inflict them on DD in any way.

Thanks for the push along advice Dream! Trying to steer my parents away from noisy gifts (a baby piano toy?! Noooooooooo!!!) and towards useful ones instead, for Autumn's naming ceremony.

[ScreamIfYouWantToGoFaster]

p.s. Can the name changers stil see everyone's MN photos? Does MN automatically update our MN mates lists?

[Biscuitsandtea]

Good thought Scream - just checked and indeed it doesn't let me see them unless I change back.

Think I'll stick as and

[Biscuitsandtea]

Wow Scream that is really early to start walking isn't it! Ds1 was 15 months so I'm not expecting anything for ages yet. A is already sitting really well though isn't she. E can maybe sit for a few seconds but no way I could leave him sat without being right there to catch him iyswim, he's that wobbly. And he's 7 mths next week. Again though that's just the same as DS1.

I suppose it is probably a blessing and a curse to know as much as Dream does in a way - must be great, and I should think v interesting, to know so much about how all the development stuff works, and what leads to what etc, but then again you're aware of just so many more potential issues. Other than rolling, sitting, standing, walking, ie the major developmental landmarks, I really know nothing about any other 'indicators'. I know at ds1's two and a half year HV check, it seemed like something ridiculously simple that they were looking for. It was something like being able to pass something from one hand to the other. Obviously though he could already walk by then and I suspect they would have checked for that too, or raised a flag if he couldn't walk and it hadn't been referred yet. But they don't even refer them for not walking until something like 18 months I think (is that right?). I remember being worried at the HV check though that they would ask ds1 to do something that I knew he could do but wouldn't feel inclined to do on the day, but in the end it was (a) something so simple and (b) they just let him play with some crayons or something in a tin and sort of covertly noticed whether he could do it. So it was all quite easily done. But I remember thinking at the time that it was quite a low marker they were looking for, which must have been some sort of minimum standard and showed the huge range in 'normal'.

I'm feeling a bit cross with DH tonight. Ds2 seems to be going through a bit of a separation anxiety sort of phase and is currently settling for me better than anyone else. On Friday night, with it being the weekend, DH offered to get up with him but when he did, DS2 went ballistic just wouldn't settle. As soon as I came through and took him he just snuggled down on me (which I think understandably made DH feel a bit ). But now all last night I've had to be the one that gets up because DH just says 'well he won't settle for me'. Now this may be partly true but:

(a) surely if he settles better for me it's just because he's used to me. DH is unavoidably not here much in the week so surely this is an opportunity to try and get ds2 used to him? At least he could have tried this in the day perhaps?

(b) ds2 has been v v unsettled yesterday and today. So this coupled with dh's 'hands off' approach has meant that basically I've had to deal with a crying baby A LOT; and all overnight. Now he may settle better for me but he hasn't even then been going back to sleep. Surely DH could have done something to help me out with a bit of sleep? As of tonight he'll be back at work and it will be all my job anyway so I feel a bit like my one opportunity for a bit of nighttime help has been squandered .

I'm not suggesting for one moment that I would want to distress ds2 any more than he already seems to be but I feel as though maybe in the day especially DH could have used the time to try and reassure ds2 a bit more. DS2 only feels safe with me through 'experience' and DH will only get there by similarly 'being there' for him. And inevitably that will take longer when he's not here really much in the week.

Anyway, while I do see that it's hard for DH to know that he loves ds2 so much but doesn't seem to 'cut the mustard' for settling, it's just made me feel a bit cross with him just snoring away all night while I've been up and down all night with my poor wee man who has been really struggling to sleep

I have to say too though that I do find it a little bit nice that he is starting to be a bit preferential over who he is with. Not so much that he prefers me over DH or anyone elsr, just it is nice that he knows me and feels reassured just by my presence. I really hate that feeling of helplessness when they cry when they're so tiny and you can't just magically make things better. Especially once I've been used to DS1 where a cuddle with mummy or daddy actually makes it all better, or a kiss when he's hurt himself etc so it's nice to start to feel that with ds2.

Also what was interesting today when ds2 has been quite keen on my presence within his immediate vicinity is that he also calms nicely for ds1. For example when we were going out, he got kinda cross when we put him in the car seat but ds1 came and sat by him and he calmed down. It was v cute and I guess ds1 is almost as much of a familiar face / presence as I am so I find it really cute that he is calmed by ds1 even by just sitting by the car seat talking to him. Although how I can get ds1 to get up and settle him in the night, I'm not quite sure.....

Just hope he hurries up and figures out that Daddy is there for him too

[Biscuitsandtea]

new thread is here

[sipper]

Hi ScreamIfYouWantToGoFaster
I somehow landed on this thread when I was looking for something else, so apologies for gate crashing and for being a few months late (!). I've just been looking at a mat called Cosyplay - seems really good - might be worth a look?