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Flooding

9 replies

dubsie · 22/10/2023 10:33

The whole country is in chaos because of widespread flooding....small streams have become rivers bursting banks and flooding homes. Farms are under water and infrastructure is all but closed.

The government response has been nothing leaving everything to cash strapped local authorities to deal with this disaster.

The government is more interested in dealing with election problems rather than dealing with a national emergency. The army should be out as a minimum

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DangerPigeon · 24/10/2023 09:07

Local authorities have a range of options and people to call in when they need to, including the army. It's their call but they can if situations require it.

What you should be more cross about is the century of development in really inappropriate locations, which is still going on, and the miniscule medium to long term assistance to people living in properties affected.

There are so many housing estates, rows of houses, public buildings and amenities flooding or at serious risk of flooding, and no plan for moving our populations to safer areas as the climate changes.

The elderly lady that died in Chesterfield this week drowned in her own home because she couldn't use the stairs and the floodwaters were too widespread and strong for rescuers. Her son had flood proofed the house as it had flooded before but the water came higher than they expected.

In aging population with a changing climate, more of us will drown in our own homes. That's what you should be worried and cross about. That and the government are utterly not doing enough to reduce our contribution to climate change.

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dubsie · 25/10/2023 09:25

I live in a town that was declared a major incident. Peoples homes and businesses have been left with thousands in damages. Some of these people won't have insurance because it's often extortionate if your home has been flooded before. I know a pensioner who's home has been flooded right up to the downstairs ceiling....her flood barrier is just above the doorstep.....hopeless. The lady has no money and I installed a new heating system for her two years ago for free because she was living in utter poverty. Her home is not habitable and I can't afford to help her this time because like her I'm also facing huge repair bills. There are 200 hundred homes in varying degrees of ruin where I live.

I saw how quickly the waters engulfed my street and I don't believe you can flood proof an area against that. One moment it was dry the next there was a river pushing cars down the road.

You are right about built up areas but it tends not to be new buildings that suffer....it's established housing estates where I live. The problem is run off, how quickly the water ends up in streams and rivers...if you can increase the lag then you reduce the chances of a stream turning into a raging torrent. But that requires planning and regulations.... something we don't have anymore because we need roads and homes and that all comes with drains and concrete all of which is very effective at taking water away

The government is in silence, not a word from Rishi or his chums, while people assess the damage to their lives this bunch are totally fixated with staying in power

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AlaskaThunderfuckHiiiiiiiii · 25/10/2023 09:28

They need to ban the building of homes on flood plains, they are called this for reason, too much concrete and not enough places for water to escape, drains are not cleared enough and rivers are not allowed to be dredged

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dubsie · 25/10/2023 09:37

The big problem is how quickly the water drains away....we need more fields and areas that can hold flood water and slowly disperse into rivers.

The problem is how is that achieved, it's not simple because as you have seen these storms are becoming more extreme. We have more homes, more roads and ultimately less natural world. This is global warming and we can't escape the reality that we are not immune to the effects of it.

Twice this year's I've seen rain that heavy it's overwhelmed the guttering on my house....I've not seen that in twenty years of living here. I installed it so I know the volume of water it can take away and it amazes me how much water fell in such a short period of time.

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DangerPigeon · 27/10/2023 16:47

Very sorry it's affected your town so badly. And I agree with you completely, there's a big problem we have in this country and many others in that we can't simply retrofit food defences on existing housing and other building stock. What's ideally needed to cope with future intensive rainfall is managed urban retreat/relocation and allowance for living alongside water, but no-one will make those brave politician decisions. And it'll lead to a growth of flooding poverty as you describe.

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dubsie · 28/10/2023 10:01

I don't think the environment agency has the budget it needs, I don't think the water companies have invested enough and I don't think we've thought about the impact of housing and retail development. On top of that we now have a government which thanks to austerity has left local authorities unable to offer any help. I highly suspect more local authorities will now be pushed into bankruptcy because of the impact of this

I've never known a government so detached from people in my life. They have rubbished climate science, deregulated building control and left thousands left fending for themselves. It's pretty astonishing.

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dubsie · 06/01/2024 10:23

Finally the issue of flooding is now in the national headlines and the fact the government has done nothing to help the thousands that have been affected.

It's a national scandal, where is the government response other than flying visits from cabinet ministers now it's hit the headlines.

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IbizaToTheNorfolkBroads · 06/01/2024 10:56

I'm a flood risk engineer and have worked for the Environment Agency for decades. We have powers (not responsibilities) to manage flood risk from main rivers (these are legally designated, can be tiny streams, but pretty much all the "big" rivers) in England. In that time, our ability to delivery flood risk management works and flood defences schemes has got harder and harder:

1 we are statutory consultees for developments in flood zones, but we can only advise or object, we have very little power of veto on flood zone development.

2 the economic tests to identify if a scheme is suitable for public funding are based on benefit/cost. Costs have escalated, benefits have not. The ratio a new flood defence scheme needs to reach to be eligible for public funding hasn't changed. It's harder and harder to get funding. The flood incidents of this autumn/winter will probably result in an injection of recovery funding, but no lt the wholesake change in how we are funded in the first place, to allow us to carry out more reliability centered work. Rather than "fix on fail".

3 - similar to 2, for maintenance works.

4- there is no single ownership or responsibility for floodwaters, but water will go where it flows, it doesn't know or care whether the rainwater runoff or watercourse it floods from, is in the ownership of the local authority, water company, environment agency, drainage board, private ownership, canal and river trust or anyone else. This hotchpotch makes it very tricky to achieve a long term consistent, strategic approach to anything. Especially the mix or public/private ownership.

5 - I have dozens of plans on my virtual bookshelf that will never be built because they won't trigger funding.

6 - although were meant to be strategic, our funding regime forces us down a "fix on fail" route, which is excessively costly, and no good to anyone. Some of the defences I know well are a few centuries old, but are like Triggers Broom in terms of how much is original. We have a very aged asset portfolio which is decaying fast!

7 - Climate change and rising water levels are real. We used to deal with 1 or 2 major incidents a decade in my area. Now we're on pretty much one a year nationwide.

8 - climate change , and increased "ordinary" water levels puts more pressure on existing assets than they were designed for.

9 - Not EA assets but - similarly to 8 - road/public drainage is designed for certain flow volumes. We are routinely getting higher flows, which surcharges the drainage system and causes flooding. Drainage also needs to be maintained, cleared, desilted. My local authority has declared itself bankrupt - the centre of my village(low spot) has been underwater for weeks because the drains are full of silt.

10 - we have a massive retention problem since lockdown, with the private sector paying so much more for the engineers, scientists and managers we need. We've lost so much expertise as well as working with about 35% vacancies, in roles that were identified as essential key roles in lockdown.

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dubsie · 06/01/2024 11:54

Thanks for the post interesting to hear from a professional and very alarming but also predictable outcome from a government that has modelled the environment agency around it's political ideology. They have now done the same with the health protection agency which will leave the UK completely unprepared for the next pandemic.

It's the same government that has rubbishes climate change findings while knowing full well that the outcomes will present future harm to those least able to protect themselves.

I love in a flood zone and I've not seen this level of flooding exceeding our flood defences leaving ground water levels very high for months

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