Can anyone help me with this dispute with the farmer?

[Enid]

dh and I complained to the farmer when he planted maize in the field next to our house at 4am. It made a racket, woke us all up (2 days after dd3 was born) and went on for 2 hours (no way you could sleep through it).

they have written to us saying basically we can lump it as they are 'allowed' to farm at any time of day or night.

its a new farmer and the one before never did this - we don't mind them starting early (6am ish) but 4am is just unbelievably anti social we think. Its a tiny farm and a small field but being run by a consultancy who has a lot of other fields to manage. Dh pointed out that they could have done the fields that werent near houses first and they have rejected that out of hand, basically saying they can do what they like. Its a real shame as we had a great relationship with the tenant farmer before - he rung us when he was going to spray/harvest so we could keep the pets/kids inside.

Can they? How can I word the reply?

[Passionflower]

Have been lurking a bit.

TBH if you know them well enough I'd really invite the wife around for a cuppa and talk to her about it. Chances are that her hubby is a stressed bunny atm as someone else has mentioned and she may be able to get him to be a bit more considerate without escalating the situation.

I really, really wouldn't want to let this turn into a feud if I were you.

[nannyme]

Oh come on enid, I didn't think I was that harsh - just offering a different pov.

I had this loads when we lived in our farmhouse but didn't own the fields. I must say though that the tractor bothered me least.

The cows mooing was what kept me awake but waking up to them was lovely, although our baby was 6 weeks old not 2 days.

I appreciate you have other stuff taking your sleep and energy but I tend to feel for farmers in general as I have known so many having a struggle.

I can't say that this farmer that is peeing you off is in the same position but just thought you might view things more sympathetically if I added my comments to the debate.

I don't think you are wrong or out of order but I can kind of see where the farmer might have been coming from too. Note: might.

[sharklet]

Enid, sorry to hear this has bugged you. My folks went the legal route with thier troublesome neigbours. Who were well behaved until the legal notice period had expired, then they did the saem again - then if my folks want to go through it again they can but they have to start from scratch wih it.

Be really careful. It might be best to try to soothe the situation somehow. What they did was shit and they should have thought about residents. After all farmers are part of the local community and a lot depend in some ways in local support for various things. The guy sounds like an arse. If i were you I'd work on the wife and see what happens.

Hope you don't get disturbed agian. How is little one doing?

[meowmix]

I can't quite see how he'd claim back subsidy from you.... sounds like he's a stressed bunny and not thinking things through. best bet is to talk to environmental health I think.

or put sugar in their tank...

[beckybrastraps]

Was it just that one time?

[Freckle]

Farmers don't have any special rights with regard to when they can work or the noise they make. This constitutes statutory nuisance and as such is actionable.

Having said that, who wants to go to court about this sort of thing unless it is an ongoing continual problem? Environmental health will investigate and will speak to the farmer if you want. The fact that they could have worked another field further away from residential housing but chose not to speaks volumes.

[robinpud]

I can appreciate how this is just not what you want to be dealing with at this time.
Try and keep it in perspective and enjoy the kids.
Keep a record of the early morning wake up calls and speak regularly to environmental health. They will be very helpful.
If you must talk to the guy(s) about it, just say that it is being dealt with by environmental health.
Perhaps in the same way that you have stress points at the moment, these guys are feeling stress too and so are not able to put themselves in your shoes and do the field at a later time. However it would only make things worse in the long term to escalate things unecessarily.

[Enid]

"Many (not all) farmers have it very tough and my personal feeling is that if this type of thing bothers you then living next to an arable field may not be the best decision. As somebody else said, there is always the town (to paraphrase)!

Being woken by cows mooing, sheep lambing, tractors (er, tractoring?) is one of the pleasant aspects of living within a rural or farming community in my happy experience. "

er yes we have lived here for years and got on with the previous farmer really well

being woken by cows mooing isnt really the same as being woken at 4am by a tractor making a racket 2 days after you have had a baby

its hardly intensively farmd round here - not our problem that the consultancy doing teh farming have taken on too much work

dh works in manufacturing and believe me has it just as hard as farmers and doesn't get any bloody subsidies either - my heart bleeds, not.

[joelalie]

I work for a manufacturing company (yes there are still some about!!). We obviously use fork lifts and there are large lorries coming on and off site all the time. We aren't restricted to certain times but we bend over backwards to accomodate local residents noise-wise - but I beleive that it's a voluntary keeping-the-neighbours-sweet kind of thing rather than a legal obligation. The factory was there before most of the houses so planning contstraints don't apply as they wouldn't with the farmer.

What really rankles with me is the tone they took with you. An apology for the disturbance would have been perfectly reasonable rather than getting shirty, especially as you know the man. And a promise to at least try to change the times of their working in those fields. Not sure what legal recourse you have though. Have you tried CAB?

[soapbox]

The builders thing is a voluntary code - the considerate neighbour scheme - and is not legally enforceable.

[soapbox]

Sounds like a nightmare Enid. Don't know what to suggest as I suspect tractor in a field nearby wouldn't break the decibels limits (but not sure). If that's the case then environmental health are unlikely to help you.

I'd go down the reciprocal route of walking along to boss man's house every time you are woken at ungodly hours and waking him and his family up very loudly!

In the meantime - maybe sending corres to your solicitor would not be a bad idea!

[Mirage]

Is this the same farmer who upset you by not cutting his hedge?

[VeniVidiVickiQV]

I know that in a built up area you need special permission/licence to carry out work before 7am and after 7pm. I dont know what legislation is in place for rural areas though.

A total PITA in any case.

[nannyme]

Okay so the farmer may not have any special rights but regardless of the rules or law, it isn't like he is playing loud music or having a party. He is earning a living.

Many (not all) farmers have it very tough and my personal feeling is that if this type of thing bothers you then living next to an arable field may not be the best decision. As somebody else said, there is always the town (to paraphrase)!

Being woken by cows mooing, sheep lambing, tractors (er, tractoring?) is one of the pleasant aspects of living within a rural or farming community in my happy experience.

I agree with the letting you know about crop spraying, etc. but don't see how you can complain about the noise of farming.

Sorry enid, that is just my view - I am sure others will/have disagreed and will/have beeen of more help with your letter writing. :)

[twocatsonthebed]

the people you need to get on side are definitely environmental health- I had problems with a school next door (long, long story) but they were fantastic and really took the problem seriously. Perhaps make an appointment with a case officer, and show them the letter too.

It's also worth doing a tiny bit of research on the laws yourself- if you can outdo them in the shirty letter stakes its always quite helpful...

[JanH]

Ooooh no, they can go quite a bit faster than that, Roo!

[Roo77]

I think tractors can only go 20mph. I don't think they do it on purpose, perhaps people could live in the city if they don't like rural life and then everybody would be happy

[JanH]

They didn't have to do that field at 4am though, Nightynight - that was just pointlessly provocative, even if they did have to trundle a couple of miles to do one that wasn't next to somebody's house.

Round here tractor drivers seem to positively enjoy trundling lots of miles at about 20mph to see how long a queue of cars they can build up behind them

[Nightynight]

someone I know is an agricultural contractor, and basically they are working 26 hours a day during their busy seasons, and sitting around at home doing nowt the rest of the time.

Farming is not like other businesses. It is so weather and season dependent that they have to work unsocial hours at particular moments. They always have done, it is not new.

Can see that it is annoying for you, though. The letter you got sounds stupid. And the boss certainly deserved to get woken up at 4.30 if he expected his employees to start at that time.

[Whizzz]

Yes - sounds like nuisance noise to me. Doesn't matter if he's a farmer or a chemical works

\link{http://www.crimereduction.gov.uk/neighbourhoods02.htm\neighbour noise}

look on your council website for how they deal with commercial noise

[NotQuiteCockney]

Only fair to wake them, after they woke you!

I would look into your legal recourse, is there a noise abatement person for The Countryside?

I hope it is all bluster, what a nightmare.

[Enid]

I think you are right NQC

it is all bluster

but letter was really quite intimidating saying that if we complain again and interrupt their work they may lose a subsidy in which case they will claim the money back from us

dh wants to put in our letter that if they send any more vaguely threatenign letters we will pass them directly to our solicitors

mad how quickly it has escalated

I complained directly to the guy driving the tractor at 4am - went into the field, stopped him and sayd look I have just had a baby can you please go away and do this another time

he said no way tought

dh went into field and asked again - he told dh to fuck off

dh went round to owner of field and woke them up (at 4.30) demanded that they tell guy to stop

[plug]

Think I'd invite her round for coffee again pronto and paint large dark circles under your eyes for good measure.

[NotQuiteCockney]

OMG, that is completely mad.

How did you complain about it in the first place?

Is it possible this is all bluster, and they won't do it again anyway? They might not want to officially say "we are sorry, we won't do it again" for fear you might sue them?