Nursery staffer suspended for manhandling my DD

[birdofthenorth]

DD1 is 13 months, has been in nursery part-time for 5 weeks.

Yesterday I picked her up from nursery as normal, staff all smiles, went home & took the dogs to the park. DH came home & we all went out for a nice pub tea to celebrate me getting through my first month back at work (& first pay day for months!). Then I got a call from the Deputy Manager at the nursery to inform me a staff member has been suspended over an "incident" involving my daughter. Heart in mouth while I pray please don't let it be violent, or God forbid, sexual. Turns out another member of staff was walking past the CCTV screens they have in the entrance hall showing all rooms when she caught this staffer "throwing DD onto a beanbag with what we consider unacceptable force". DD had been throwing sand or something apparently, they think said staffer was engaging in an inappropriate attempt at discipline (she is 13 mo, FFS).

The woman who caught her in the act intervened to ensure DD was ok & remove her from this person's care. The management then reviewed the footage and suspended her. They didn't tell me when I picked DD up because the staff member was still in the building.

They didn't tell me who it was (probably appropriate although I am not into vigilantism) but have asked me to come in first thing Mon am to see the footage myself & discuss it further.

As far as they are aware at this stage it was an isolated incident but they are investigating further to see if she has behaved this way before, with DD or others.

I am trying not to over-reacting but have felt a but sick since learning this & slept badly last night. Just keep imagining the incident (am sure it is now worse in my mind than it was in actual fact). DH has postponed a work trip so he can come with me on Mon am.

I haven't massively enjoyed my return to work, have missed DD, and worried about how she was settling in. Yesterday was actually the first morning she didn't cry on dropping her off so I was starting to feel better- now I just feel my trust has been broken and I am suddenly acutely aware I have left her with strangers.

Also -what if it has happened before?

What if it is not deemed a sackable offence & I have to leave DD with this person again? Even if I see the footage and don't feel what she did was terrible, it would be very odd to leave DD with her & for me to have to interest with her as normal after she has been through a suspension process in relation to DD (which must be a pretty awful thing for the staff member involved, assuming what they caught was a rare moment of frustration not a typical moment from an uncaring cow).

DD appears to be fine physically & emotionally.

I haven't told parents or ILs yet as they will almost certainly overreact & tell us to remove her from the nursery (MIL in particular would be distraught & would probably tell me to give up work immediately!).

Any advice? Anyone known this happen elsewhere?

[ChippingInToThePumpkinLantern]

Birds - sorry I didn't come back to your thread, it fell off of my 'Threads I'm On' ! How are things going now? Are you pregnant??

[Fishpants]

I would also want to see the footage as surely the video cameras are there for parental reassurance? Seems a bit odd that they would not then show you something potentially distressing and want to keep it only to show you bits of DD playing happily

I also agree with the other poster who said language is very subjective - one person's toss could be another person's hurl.

THAT being said, I do agree with your decision to keep her in the nursery, as the higher-ups, other staff, and policies seem very intact and in keeping with great child protection procedures. It would bother me intensely not to be able to see the video, however. If anonymity is their only concern, surely they can edit it in 2 minutes to block out the worker's face.

[SeenButNotHeard]

Thanks for the update OP - hope you didn't feel pressured into posting

It really does sound like the nursery have done well - I think I would want to know the outcome of any SSD investigation and reassurances that the video was going to be kept.

I think the only thing that could be gained from seeing the footage would be if you wanted to press for criminal prosectution (if the incident warranted it) or civil damages.
Out of interest though - does your contract with the nursery state that you are able to view video footage?

[birdofthenorth]

That's what I feel, Bagel. The nursery seem to be extremely honest with me, didn't squirm at any of our questions, said we could talk to Social Services or the police at any time if we felt it necessary.

It is awful that it happen but I'm going to try not to torment myself any further now I think.

UNLESS for any reason they struggle to get rid of the offending staff member as easily as they think they will be able to... but from the sounds of things she knows she was caught red-handed (and there is evidence) so she hasn't been fighting her corner so far.

[bagelmonkey]

What would be gained by watching the footage?
Social services are involved, so the nursery aren't trying to brush this under the carpet. I would only watch it if I felt I needed to for peace of mind, but it doesn't sound like this is the case.

[GoldenGreen]

I don't know if I would want to see the tape or not but I would be very reassured by the way the nursery have handled this (assuming she will now be sacked!). They have taken it very seriously and told you as much as they can.

Congratulations on the pregnancy.

[VivaLeBeaver]

I would want to see the tape as well. Its all in the language - one person's toss is another person's hurl. I've tossed my daughter into a beanbag before now when she was very young as part of a game, if it had been similar then I don't think the other nursery worker would have been so concerned. I'd be worried about the amount of force used. Not that it really makes any difference now, your dd is ok, the worker sounds like she's going to be sacked but I'd still want to know.

Congrats on the pregnancy btw.

[essexmumma]

I think you need to seek legal advice because what if they are playing this down?

I really feel for you having only returned to work recently myself and even though DC know all the buttons to press it is never ok to pin a young child down. It makes me feel sick that this could happen. This is worse than Imagined. I don't think I could leave my DD there ever again TBH.

[birdofthenorth]

YaMa they are in the process of trying to sack her. They will have to got through an official discilpinary hearing but have assured me they believe there is no other acceptable outcome. I think they suspect she will resign rather than go through the motions in an attempt to cling to her job.

Penguins -it was worse than I imagined in that this seems to occur over a number of minutes rather than one rash action... but better than I feared in the sense that it wasn't that she been hurled violently across the room in a rage - it was clearly a misguided form of dicipline. The bit where she tried to pin her down is the most sinister I think -though I can imagine poor DD thinking the whole thing was a game.

I will sleep better knowing the entire staff think this was unacceptable and that everyone is unanimous that she should not be allowed to return.

[YaMaYaMa]

I would want to see the footage as well. Are you entitled to see it at all? Has the nursery nurse been sacked? Sorry this has happened, your poor dd and poor you.

[differentnameforthis]

Wow..your poor dd having to go through that. I am pleased that the nursery are taking it very seriously & I do hope that the girl isn't allowed to return.

Congratulations on your BFP!

[Purplebuns]

Congratulations, that does sound like a really good nursery. I hope they do dismiss her for your peace of mind, never mind the rest and Dd being happy to toddle off is a great sign :)

[bagelmonkey]

Glad it all seems to be working out well. Sounds like a good nursery.
And congratulations!

[birdofthenorth]

DH & I met wth nursery manager on Mon am. Turned out their legal department had advised they couldn't actually show us the footage (I suspect because it would identify the staff member & they don't want us to go round with baseball bats) so instead they gave us a much clearer blow by blow description of what happened.

Basically the other staff member left for a few minutes to make up their afternoon snacks -ratios still in tack as there were only three babies there, this being a Friday afternoon. DD threw some sand out of the sandpit so the staffer picked her up, lobbed her on a been bag a few yards from the other babies, DD crawled off, she lobbed her back; DD crawled off again, she lobbed her back; DD crawled off again, she pinned her down with her hand on her chest... at which point the staff member watching downstairs on the video camera leapt upstairs to intervene. Basically inappropriate disciline for a 13 month old but perhaps not as terrifying as it was in my mind's eye.

I believe the staff member was removed from the baby room there and then, but remained in the building while the IT support were summoned to rewind the video footage & the manager who was off-site was summoned back.

Sounds like the person involved knew she had behaved inappropriately straight away and didn't question the suspension. Evidently she had phoned in sick earlier in the week, turned up late on the day in question, and had an attitude problem recently, which I suspect was why they glanced at the video cameras when she was left alone. The staffer has apparently since been posting on Facebook about 're-evaluating her life' so perhaps realises childcare is not for her (not sure it was appropriate of them to mention this to me -but there you go).

The manager was extremely concerned about the whole situation, had met with the owner over the weekend, and was keen to stress that they had never had any incidents of this nature in the course of the nursery's 8 year history (they had dealt with inter-staff bullying once, she volunteered, but never serious child protection concerns).

Social services were informed on Friday and will be kept in touch following the result of the staff member's disciplinary -but it sounds like the nursery have a firm view that the incident, especially the pinning down, which lasted a couple of minutes, was severe enough to warrant permanent dismissal.

Feel much better now I am clearer on what occurred. The advice here was extremely helpful, and armed with a clear idea of what I wanted answering when we met with them.

DD still seems fine and tottered off happily this morning, no tears on my departure again today, so all in all, I will be doing my best to forget about it and move on.

Also... the stress of this stopped me obsessing about checking for AF every hour... and now I've just had a faint BFP!! So possibly, just possibly, will get another year off with DD and another DC... so a happy ending, perhaps!

[SeenButNotHeard]

Any update OP?

[RitaMorgan]

Viva - there's no requirement for 2 staff as long as the adult is qualified and CRB checked and correct ratios are maintained. 1 member of staff is often alone with children at nursery, for example toileting/changing nappies, watching sleeping children, taking a small group to do a specific activity.

[StealthPolarBear]

Actually why they didnt tell you then and there would be a big deal for me.
I'd want them to tell me straight away. I'd want to examine DD for injuries without delay. I'd want to ask any questions, face to face, so i could better decide if they were being evasive. And I'd want to know they'd had as little time to 'prepare' as possible.

[StealthPolarBear]

I don't understand why this worker was allowed to carry on working the rest of the day? And why they didn't tell you straight away? The staff member was on the premises??? If they thought she (presumably) was aphysical threat, they should ahve called the police!

If I had reassurance about that, and that the member of staff was gone, I'd be impressed with how they handled it, and happy for my DCs to return.

[VivaLeBeaver]

How come the worker was by herself with the children? I thought there had to be at least two staff?

[Quintessentialist]

I think you should consider telling Ofsted anyway. And tell the nursery that you are informing Ofsted, and may consider involving the police for assault on your daughter. They may suspend, and reinstate said member of staff, unless you show considerable Umph.

When a nursery worker hit my son on the head with a wooden train track garage (BIG in other words) to teach him that it was "not ok to hit", the nursery suspended her, invested in some extra training for her, and she returned to work within a week of the incident. ....

You are RIGHT to feel sick to your stomack. At the moment the nursery is firefighting and going through the motions to placate you. DONT let them placate you with this. You are out for blood. At least you should be.

[babbi]

I am not a fan of nurseries for babies and kids under 2.5 - 3 to be honest, but that is just a personal choice. However I am TOTALLY impressed with the way your nursery is handling this. At this age your child is non verbal and they could have just dealt with this internally (or not)and you would have been none the wiser. I think in your position I would be happy to trust them with your child. No member of staff there will be under any misapprehension that anything but the correct level of care will be tolerated.
Provided that what you see on Monday is as others say, wrong (clearly) but not actual intentional violence, I see no need to change your arrangements. Your DD will be fine.

I am sorry that you have had to deal with this and sincerely hope that this is not as bad as it seems.

As an aside I recently went to firmly grasp my DD's shoulders to make her sit down and calm down but somehow managed to stumble and made her "slip" out of my hands ( hard to describe!) . Anyone looking in the window would have seen what looked like me throwing my 6 year old a couple of feet across the room onto a sofa. I swear that this was not the case.

[RitaMorgan]

HoneyPablo is right, while it would be lovely to imagine no childcare worker would ever make an error of judgement, they are only human. Nursery workers are often working very long hours, with minimal breaks, minimal staff numbers, minimal training/support and for minimum wage. I would be suprised if any childcare worker could honestly say they have never made a mistake or behaved in a way they wished they hadn't - whether that's raising their voice too much, missing an accident, failing to prevent an injury, not changing a nappy quick enough, or even manhandling a child.

Of course, you may watch the footage and decide it's far beyond a minor lapse from a usually good member of staff. But bear in mind that no childcare setting is perfect.

[Greensleeves]

of course you should tell your friend

how would you feel if it were the other way round and she didn't tell you?

if the nursery worker didn't want to be talked about by parents she shouldn't have been manhandling the children

she was caught because someone happened to be walking past the camera screens? I would be insisting that they go through ALL the footage they had to check for other incidents

it's hard enough for parents to leave their children in nursery fgs

[differentnameforthis]

I certainly wouldn't have my dds left with someone capable of that, tbh. If she is reinstated, then yes, I would reconsider my child's childcare.