Daddy's Willy

[RogueRebel]

Please direct me if there is a better place to post this.

I have two DD's 2&4 who have been having contact with dad for less than a year over night Eow until a few weekends ago when my oldest said she didn't want to see daddy anymore at his house. I won't go into too much detail as have posted before.

Yesterday we were at Grams' house for Sunday lunch and the DC were playing with Dolls they had for presents, their 11yr old cousin brought her dolls and many accessories. including a boy doll with a winkey.

My oldest mentioned it later when we were in the car saying make sure we haven't brought cousins doll with the Willy, I asked her what she said again as I wasn't sure I heard right because its either a winkey or tackle in our house. she told me all boys have Willy's. I asked her who told her it because the wording was different to our families. she told me daddy told her and she's seen his because he always let's her watch him wee.

Is this weird? am I ment to be worried as much as I am?
I know he's their dad but still I would expect him to keep these things private!

[SnoopyLovesYou]

Well done on stopping contact. Alarm bells were ringing for me with the 3 in the bed scenario. Solid Gold Brass is right. Trust your instincts. You are the responsible person in the family. Don't let him undermine you. Good luck.

[SolidGoldBrass]

This is a hugely abusive man who is abusing the DC. Well done for stopping contact; now you have to take the assistance of the HCPs, amass all the evidence and keep him well away from you all. Good luck.

[AnotherStitchInTime]

I think you were right to stop contact given the history. At 4 she is old enough to express her feelings and they should be taken into account especially as contact is having such a bad effect on her wellbeing. The comment about her needing to be there to protect her sister stands out to me too. Why does she need to protect her if her dad is there? What does she need to protect her from?

I did see my dad having a wee, in the bath (if I needed a wee) and getting changed at the swimming pool at that age. It was not an issue. We did not share a bed unless I was sick and I was in with both parents. When he and my mum separated we were older so me and db had our own room and beds. Once I was 8/9 or so and became more body conscious I didn't see him naked anymore.

My DH does not let my 4 or 16 month old see his genitals in the bath or in the toilet, he is very wary about letting them think it is ok for them to see adult male genitals because there was abuse in his family. They see me naked and on the toilet though. Dd1 knows about willies from seeing young boys toilet training or changing whilst out.

[RogueRebel]

Contact has been stopped. I've just got off the phone to the HV and she said it wouldn't normally be a concern however with the history of this coupled with the DD1 expressing she does not want to return to his house it should all be made a log of and see where it goes after councillors have visited with the DC. We are going to try and re established visitation at the contact centre

[AmyFarrahFowlerCooper]

"Daddy always lets me watch" would have alarm bells ringing for me. As a child I did see my dad wee as we were quite a relaxed family about nakedness but it was if we were playing in the bath (we'd play for ages) and he'd nip in and out and we would barely notice what he was doing. We certainly wouldn't be interested enough to "watch". The way she says that combined with your other posts and the fact that all these other people are concerned would worry me a lot. It comes across like he's taking them into the toilet every time he goes for a wee and there's no reason to do that at all. Has contact been stopped?

[RogueRebel]

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/lone_parents/1794975-should-I-stop-contact

I thought I'd better link the Original post with all background information Hopefully it works.

Being from a one parent family myself I never saw my father or his willy at all so have no experience, But I do have a very close relationship with my grandad Dad to me and all other siblings since forever and I have never seen his or been present when he was in the toilet. Maybe our family are prudes but I cant think of a time when Ive seen my mum naked or in the toilet either.

My DC do try to follow me to the bathroom sometimes but it is preventable, For the last 4 years I have managed to stop both children from coming in while I change tampons, so I don't see why he can not do the same.

[HoldingHigh]

If only recently showing an interest in your DDs life I'd imagine they'd feel a lot of different type of emotions and given their ages don't know how to express and explain what and how they're feeling. OP, has his contact gone straight overnight or was there a build up progressing to it?

If it's been a straight overnight one then I'd imagine it's very hard for them after having no relationship with someone to suddenly being expected to automatically have this sudden bond.

If he is still abusive with you then I'd cut phone contact completely. Maybe communicate about your DD via text or email. You'd also have evidence to show if he sends any abusive that way. Send a text or email letting him know that your DD doesn't want to go overnight at the minute and suggest day time only contact for the time being until she is comfortable with staying overnight again.

I can't really say much on the willy issue. If he was a consistant figure in her life then I'd have to agree that it's perfectly normal. Given their ages they'd also have been inquisitive. Maybe it wasn't that he as you put 'let her watch' it could have been she walked in on him having a wee and asked questions while he was doing his business?

[SolidGoldBrass]

I'm amazed so many people think this is 'normal' when the OP has stated that this is an abusive man and that the little girl is distressed and upset and doesn't want to see him.

OP, stop contact. Let the nasty bastard take you to court. It sounds like you have HCPs on your side already - and you can't get in to trouble for insisting that contact is supervised. Good luck.

[BlackeyedSusan]

looking again, the always lets me watch, rather than discouraging them and telling them it is private...

actually, I do not think I am doing a good job of reading tonight! sorry

[BlackeyedSusan]

if he takes them out and they all need a wee... i would assume they all go in the disabled and children are bloody nosy. at least ds is. and loud. and has no sense of what is appropriate to say.

difficult in the circumstances to not feel like it is weird though.

the bed sharing could be that they need comfort. [hopeful]

it must be so difficult to work out what is going on and what you need to do about it. if it were not for the fact that you get a break from the girls, how would you feel about them going to see him?

[RogueRebel]

I have been keeping a diary of all events, and I called the health visitor myself back in march after noticing behavioral changes after coming back from visits over night. I've followed advice to the letter and have stopped contact, but I wasn't told by DD1 she didn't want to go because she was worried until after making herself sick the Friday before she would of been due contact, she was sick again on the Saturday night but. was fine in herself through the day, so wasnt a stomach bug, she didn't say she felt sick it just came out of nowhere and she said she was worried. Since then she has expressed she doesn't want to see him at his house several times and to several people, family members and nursery workers, and everyday more snippets of information are coming to light randomly when we are talking at the dinner table or doing something else when she is relaxed.

The comment she said about Her and daddy breaking up, the nursery worker and I found very strange because I've not used it nor has anyone else that I am aware. This coupled with the Willy comment,
it was the wording that made me think more of it "Daddy always let's me watch" it just comes across a bit weird.

I've not been able to get hold of SS or health visitor today though have left a message. The domestic abuse organization called to check on me and offer advice and they too were concerned about the Willy comment.

I posted here to get view from lone parents whose exs haven't be active throughout their children's lives. There is a 17 year age gap between me and ex which I've never really thought much of until professionals have started to question certain comments by children. but now I think my brain is working over time and I'm more than a tad paranoid.

It's because of her age that I can't just get her to tell me what's going on, she's said her and daddy have secrets but I I'm sure this was referring to him letting them have fizzy drinks (something we had both been adamant we would not give our children, ex even more so as he said he'd visited the cocacola factory in Malta and had seen the amount of surgar going in) he's now changed his tune to "I don't see them they deserve a treat" I wouldn't think coke was a treat, I thought he was just trying to buy the kids love though. Because my DD1 would tell me and say daddy's been naughty again he gave us too much coke I'm feeling sick, she has on numerous times been sick after visits.

[TheUnstoppableWindmill]

Hang on- the health visitor has told you to stop contact and call social services and the nursery staff are concerned? Listen to the real life people and do what they recommend!

[babyhammock]

Given the history of being abusive and the lack of contact with the girls, no it isn't appropriate or normal. At the minute he hasn't been actively playing the role of 'dad' at all and has therefore not built up the kind of relationship where this would happen naturally. He may be their father , but he is more of a stranger to them in reality.

He probably has the type of abusive mentality where he thinks he is entitled to do and act as he pleases/wants without a thought for what is either appropriate or wanted by his children. He sounds like he is completely unable to respect their boundaries or put their needs before his own. This will permeate through all his actions and this is probably why your dd isn't happy. Things like that are hard to verbalise when you're an adult let alone when you're just a child.

There's been various studies shown that the best indicator of whether abuse is likely to take place is the non abusive parent's instinct on the matter. Therefore I would trust your feelings and I'd be very wary.

Good luck, it's a really crap situation to be in x

[BellEndTent]

I wouldn't be concerned at all, all sounds normal and open and completely innocent.

[RogueRebel]

This post was simply to find out about children seeing their dads Willy. I understand in a normal relationship it seems to be the norm, However these are two childen who cannot remember their dad from before and who have not spent much time with him in a time frame that is under 12months. so I was after points of view on this aspect from single parents.
If I was to get a new partner I wouldn't deem it the norm for any of my DC to see his Willy at all, after any length of time.

I am however very worried as to why my DD1 is persistent on telling everyone that she doesn't want to see her daddy at his house? There is no explanation she will give me other than say she is worried. Would any parent think it was perfectly normal for a child to decide this after such a short time when it seemed to be going well?

[valiumredhead]

What are you worried about then OP?

[Floralnomad]

I didn't intend it to sound like you want him to have done something but that you've pretty much decided he's up to no good ,sorry if it read badly ,however that's how your posts come across .you haven't linked to your previous issues so I know nothing other than you've written today .

[RogueRebel]

Floralnomad - actually disgusted by your comment, What parent would actually want something to be going on?

I highly doubt it is but as I was advised to stop contact by the heath visitorand told to call social services, have been told by nursery staff they are concerned by what DD1 is saying ive all of a sudden become paranoid.

Which is why I've come on here for advice, hoping to be put at ease, as I said I was sorry to drip feed but it really would be a long post if I explained everything.

I was hoping for more single parents to comment so I could get view points from people in a similar situation.

[RogueRebel]

as I said I've posted before about all issues regarding incidents after contact. I don't know How to link? I've been called into the nursery office several times times regarding comments about ex made by children.
I've actively encouraged the children seeing their dad as its the only time I have not had the children with me 24/7 since they were born. I have only ever managed a few hours a day since I was awarded 2yr funding. before contact started.

I have spoken to their dad in front of them even saying love you with them to try and keep things normal, and have always spoken fondly of him and told them story's, (made excuses why he wasn't seeing them) his choice not too. Contact started off fine and both DD's were enjoying contact and looking forward to going.

So why now has she said she doesn't want to see him? The nursery were concerned that she had told them her and Daddy had broken up(she hasn't mentioned this to me at all)

I don't have a problem with co sleeping both my DD's did it with me (ex actually caused arguments over it because he disagreed) but they both now sleep in their own beds in their own room.

I'm sorry for drip feeding but could write an essay on all issues regarding his and their behaviour. The Heath visitor has expressed concern and was the one who advised me to stop contact.

[valiumredhead]

Still not drill

[valiumredhead]

Lots of children drill bath with their kids at this age. Better to be open about things imo.

[Mhysa]

I hate the fact my exp insists on peeing with the door open I'm just the kind of person who doesn't like private things seen, call me a prude if you like. My ex also still shares a bed with his eldest D (19) and thinks this is fine, I find it odd. He says I'm "wrong in the head" to think its a bit off. Firstly, I trust exp 100% but, I just think, ewww.

I think your a caring mum who is worried about your DCs OP, and given that they don't know there DF that well, I think it's out of place and I think kids just don't need to see that kinda thing.

[Floralnomad]

Also your daughters could well be picking up on your stress about the visits .

[Floralnomad]

You have obvious issues with your ex and it really sounds like you want there to be something untoward going on . My children are much older but TBH nakedness is the norm here and its up to the person who doesn't want to see anything / be seen to cover up ,we also co slept until they were quite a bit older than yours . Would you think it odd for your daughters to sleep with you ? If the answer to that is no then it is exactly the same for your ex .

[phantomhairpuller]

You're drip feeding OP.

That last post reads as though you've decided he's up to no good and you want us all to take your side and tell you what you want to hear.

Sorry if I'm wrong, I appreciate you're worried about your children but that was my first thought when I read most recent post