Minimum age for children to travel unaccompanied on a three hour train journey.

[user1463153886]

Hi all - new to MN would really appreciate some advice. My children are 13 & 9. Ex husband now says they are old enough to travel alone (3 hours on a train) to see him alternate weekends.
I say no way - national express will not let children under 14 travel unaccompanied. But British Transport police have no such policy.
I fear for their safety- what if they argue & one gets off at a random station? What if a paedophile sits with them? My lists of "what if's?"are endless!!
Anyway - to cut a long story short, he's threatening legal proceedings & I'm scared! He can't make this happen.... Can he? 😢

[AnchorDownDeepBreath]

Red spotted hanky are entitled to create their own rules about who can buy their tickets but it doesn't appear the British transport police have an age limit. Case law suggests a 7 year old was once deemed capable to do a four hour trip with two changes alone.

[AnchorDownDeepBreath]

There's no minimum age: www.btp.police.uk/advice_and_information/travelling_safely/unaccompanied_children.aspx

The BTP will get involved if a child appears to be unaccompanied and in distress, and will then travel with them or remove them from the train and contact a parent.

I don't think age will be enough to defend this if it goes to court, given that a 7 year old was deemed able to travel - although if you can argue that both of your children are immature and not ready to travel alone, you could try. You'd want a solicitors help and I'm not sure it'd do the 13 year olds confidence much good to hear that!

Can you compromise? You travel half way with them and he does the other half? Regular text check ins? You drive them one way and he drives them back?

[navylily]

I'd probably let them after rehearsing the journey with them. I let my two do a one off train trip together including a change when they were 13 and 9 (almost 10) They were fine about it and both had mobiles with them.

I'd be very surprised if siblings argued in a situation like that when they're aware they're being trusted to be grown up and responsible.

If you're really not happy, would it help if you said you'd consider it in a year or two?

The rules from red hanky sound more about preventing children buying tickets without their parents knowledge - ie runaways. There's nothing legal stopping you buy them tickets and put them on a train.

Most trains are far too busy for paedophiles to have much opportunity to do much, but reserving the two adjacent airline style seats would reduce the odds of them having to talk to anyone they weren't comfy with.

[BertrandRussell]

I can quite understand the children being nervous about the journey if they haven't done it before. I can't understand all the parents saying they are too young. Frankly, if I had brought up a NT 13 year old incapable of making a simple train journey and looking after their younger sibling while doing it, I would think I had done something wrong.

This Mumsnet obsession with children not looking after younger siblings is very odd.

[Micah]

My 11 year old has done it several times. An adult has to buy the ticket, but there's no rule against them travelling alone.

[RockMeMomma]

It doesn't matter what the rail company say, you are their mother and you are not happy for your dc to travel alone. Fwiw I wouldn't be happy either. Your ex should prioritise his dc's safety over being greedy with his free time.

[BertrandRussell]

OK. How are a 13 year old and a 9 year old in danger on a train?

[user1463153886]

Thanks everyone - it's really helpful to see different perspectives.
Quite frankly I don't want to drive half way to his house - I work shifts as a full time nurse & can't always guarantee Friday afternoons off.
I know of fathers that drive the length of the country just to watch a in a football match - my ex H doesn't even ask about school reports.
He says he wants to spend more quality time with the children - yet lets them down on weekends, doesn't phone during the week & when he does have them, they generally get dropped off home by 3pm on a Sunday.
I've said they don't need to be home till 7.30 for bed.
Maybe it's the scorned woman in me (she's always in there fighting to get out!) but I just feel he wants it all his own way - but the world doesn't bloody well revolve around him!!

[BertrandRussell]

There is a small but significant risk of them coming to harm being driven on the motorway.

The is zero risk of them coming to harm on a train journey.

[PotteringAlong]

They would be fine. And stop ranting to your 9 year old about their father. That's definitely not fine at all.

[titchy]

Bert we're not talking about physical risk of injury (which obviously isn't zero on a train...) but whether they're emotionally old enough to deal with the journey. The 13 year old should be but the 9 year old may not be able to deal with drunk/abusive passengers, train delays, train cancellations, possible terrorist alerts, someone throwing themselves in front of a train, having to find alternative routes etc etc. A 13 yo would probably feel quite daunted, but having to look after a younger frightened sibling as well is putting too much into her shoulders. I'd say another couple of years before they do this.

Hell an unaccompanied 3 year old would be at no more risk than an adult but I don't suppose anyone would say that was ok.

[AndNowItsSeven]

Age 8 is the cut off for children on there own in a public place.

[AndNowItsSeven]

Their

[Somerville]

My 9 year old wouldn't cope with a long journey on public transport, even with their 11 or 14 year old sibling. And my kids gets on very well most of the time. I would let me 11 and 14 year old do a journey like that together, but only after rehearsed a lot with a parent.

Did you move away from your XH or did he move away from you and the children? That makes a difference, I think.

If you moved then I think you should help find another solution, even if that's you doing half the journeys, for the next two years. Once they're 11 and 15 it will be absolutely fine.

If he moved then I'd say that the younger one wasn't ready and you won't consider it until they're 11 and leave the ball in his court.

[user1463153886]

He was in the army at the time so we lived in army housing.
When we split up I moved back to where we both grew up & where both sets of parents live .
He moved in with the woman he'd been shagging which is 3 hours away.
I don't rant about him in front of the kids that's not fair - they still think he's great (& so they should) youngest heard me talking to a friend about why I think he shouldn't travel without an adult - & I'm sorry that he did, I recognise his insecurities about the journey are because of what he heard me say.
I still think it's unreasonable for him to expect me to drive anywhere or help with any costs towards it. We had to involve CSA & even that doesn't cover school trips, new shoes etc!

[pdsalford]

There's a big difference between a local journey to/from School - usually in familiar areas, but a 3hr journey is a different kettle of fish. Certainly at 13, I'd not have been fazed by the journey at all, but wouldn't have been confident in my 9 year old brother doing a thing I told him to.

[user1463153886]

I agree.. My 13yr old is a sensible sort.
It's the pair of them together I worry about - they argue all the time & do daft things.
Thinking mediation might be a good idea after all.
I just can't see a solution - not until the youngest Is at least 12 anyway.