What’s the problem?

[Sunisshining12]

Hi all. I have 2 DC - age 2 1/2 & 6mo. Married 9 years. Own home, both work.

I love the idea of a large family. DH is very laid back & goes with the flow. He said he would like 3 or 4.

Whenever I mention this to my family (eg I said I’ll save the baby clothes for the ‘next baby’) they say ‘are you mad’ and negative, derogatory things like ‘i wouldn't if I were you’. My mum always comments on people who have smaller age gaps too but no idea why as she is 1 of 4. My Sister seems to have the opinion that having 3 or more is trampy!

The usual is ‘you just about cope now’. My eldest does have additional needs so I do see some sense.

I’m 34, 35 in the new year. I worry about trying for a third (and can’t even imagine a fourth) because of their reactions. They seem to think it’s a bad idea & can’t understand why I would want more.

DH & I of course will do what is best for us. I try to ignore comments but they play on my mind. When I get into a discussion they back off and say obviously it’s your life do as you please.

Does anyone else get the impression that others think having 3+ isn’t good? What is it that i’m missing?

[lovebeingmum9]

Hi we have 3 beautiful children (age 7,5 and 2) with our 4th due in December....me and hubby have been married 10yrs and couldn't be happier with the family we've created! we love our children and they love us,we don't have an endless money tree unfortunately (but money doesnt make happiness) hubby works hard to financially support us while I'm a stay at home mum and keep house and everything/everyone ticking....we live within our means but still have time and money for fun! having a larger family is hectic,busy and noisy but also caring,loving and fun! we get told "you've got your hands full" and our reply is "yes but our hearts even fuller" ❤

[Cantrip]

I’ve quite enjoyed the look of complete shock on people’s faces when I told them I’m expecting this time.
Husband and I met at university, have been together 23 years, and have 4 children aged 15, 13, 11 & 9. Bonus baby number 5 is due in 2020.
We don’t have money to burn (only took the children abroad for the first time last year), but then have never claimed any benefits either (no working tax credit, no child benefit).
People will always look at other people’s families and pass judgement - you just need to do what you believe is right for YOUR family x

[Lou2120]

Wow such negative views on having more than 2 children! My plan was to only have 2 but guess what my copper coil didnt do it job properly. Things arent always so simple. But I'm married all my children have the same father we have a house 2 eco cars we can afford them even with me giving up work for a few years!

I do think after reading this thread people seem to look down on people with more than 2 children. However sometimes things arent as they seem and people shouldn't be so judgemental!

[Threnody]

I'm not convinced about the figure of 58.6 tonnes a year - the article states that that is the saving based on averaging figures for developed countries, but the study from which it took its data was based on US, Japan, not the UK. It also worked out its figures using per capita emissions - that is, the emissions of each country divided by its population, which does not take into account the emissions caused by differing amounts of industry, or the true emissions actually caused by an individual, or the different lifestyles of an individual.

I really think we need to look to industry to reduce carbon emissions by an real amount - 2/3 of man made global warming emissions are apparently made by just 90 companies. BASF published their emissions as 16.956 million tons of CO2 in 2018.

[5zeds]

I love the “oh my god they had to share, and have hand me downs” vibe running simultaneously with the “think of the environment” vibe.

I have five, some with additional needs, one who won’t be leaving home and living independently. It is harder work than two, but no more than I would imagine two with a stressful job is. It is more expensive but no more than high cost hobbies or holidays. People on MN are dicks about larger families. They trot out all sorts of half thought out ideas about WHY you might choose to do it. Women who choose to work long hours and have careers that take up the majority of their lives are not subjected to this sort of unpleasantness.
It’s a choice. Primarily a woman’s choice and anyone who feels the need to put you down because of your reproductive choices needs to ask themselves WHY they think that’s ok.

[Sunisshining12]

@dirtyrottenscoundrel how interesting & bizarre how the postcodes change perception! Around here, 3+ is not tasteful for whatever reason. It may be because like others have said, larger families do sometimes rely on benefits etc. NOT ALL just the stereotype before anyone jumps down my throat! I think that’s why my Mum is against it.

I hear what you’re saying about the environment. Of course. But obviously there are a lot of factors other than people having an extra child. I actually know a lot of smaller families (eg 1 or 2) who are extremely wasteful with food & don’t share clothes etc which is really sad

[Babdoc]

Every extra child you have adds 58 tons of carbon emissions per year.
It’s the single worst thing you can do for the planet.
For the PPs who say it’s no one else’s business - you are wrong.
It is not only everyone’s business, it is our very survival as a species that may be at stake, if global warming reaches tipping point.

[flapjackfairy]

I have 3 birth children , the eldest has Aspergers. We then decided to go into fostering and my mum was v unenthusiastic saying we wouldn't cope etc etc. We did cope and then decided to foster a child with complex needs and she started again saying it was selfish and not fair to our birth kids etc.
Anyway that child has been with us 12 yrs now and is utterly loved by all of them who are desperate for us to adopt him ( legal complexities have prevented that so far ).
Then 4 yrs ago we fostered a baby with extremely complex needs who is now adopted and again loved and cherished. My mum said nothing this time just rolled her eyes! .
So we have 5 kids ranging in age from 30 to 5 and are mid 50s. So having a third is no big deal and nobody else's business but your own ( unless you expect them to help raise them ) so if it is what you want ignore all other opinions . You know yourself and your family best. X

[drspouse]

We have two, and the older one also has SEN. It wasn't all that obvious when DC2 came along but I don't think it would have occurred to us not to for that reason.
However we were approached about a birth sibling (my two are adopted) and we said no precisely because we couldn't see it being good for either of our DCs.
So it's not the environmental cost but I have always - from a young child in the 70s - known that having more children is bad for the environment. I'm not sure why this is suddenly news.

[SnuggyBuggy]

It's not a nice thing to say but all the big families I've known have just seemed really dysfunctional. I'm not trying to say it's inevitable, I'm guessing it's either because a lot of dysfunctional people have more kids without really thinking about it or a family keeps having boys or girls and really wants the other sex. I'm guessing a stable couple actually thinking about how they would provide for a larger family could make it work.

What are your resources and what sort of upbringing do you hope to give your kids? What sort of car do you have or want? How big is your house?

[dirtyrottenscoundrel]

Think Jacob Rees- Mogg.

[dirtyrottenscoundrel]

I live in a fairly wealthy area where having 5 or 6 children is seen as bit of a status symbol - flaunting their wealth if you like.

[Winchking]

I've got 3 children (girl aged 4 just started school, boy aged 3 at nursery 3 days/week, and another boy aged 3 weeks), and I wouldnt change it for the world! We had lots of comments when we announced we were expecting number 3, mostly people saying we were crazy as 2 is hard enough, we'd need a bigger car, and/or asking why we were doing it again when we already had a girl and a boy. I'd also been very conscious that hubby and I are knocking on a bit (both 41 now). But we just couldn't shake the desire for another one so went for it anyway. The older 2 have a great relationship (mostly!) and touch wood are very keen on their young brother. Of course while he's still a baby he can't grab their toys/try to get involved in their games so he's no trouble to them atm. I find the age gap works well (again, so far... it's early days!) as I can spend extra quality time with baby for 3 days while others at work/school/nursery, then focus activities on my other son for the 2 days he's not at nursery, and on my daughter for the afternoons after school finishes and before son gets home from nursery. Sure, it'll be chaos at times, but for us it's happy, welcome chaos! People will always have opinions, but it's what works for you that counts.

[Hundredacrewoods]

I don't think one or two extra children here or there will matter too much from an environmental perspective.

@Threnody Multiply this attitude by 7 billion people and you have the reason why the world’s predicted population in 2100 is 11.2 billion

[Soontobe60]

Shocking comments about university only being for the well off!
Statistically, people with degrees tend to have better jobs, btpetter living standards. Just because a couple of you have done well without having gone to Uni doesn't mean that everyone who didn't go does well.

I'm a middle child of 5. I hated it! I was lonely, had to share everything, had loads of hand me down clothes from my older sisters, whilst my younger brother got new stuff. My parents had no time for us individually. I honestly believed I was adopted! Ended up leaving home at 16.
I have 2 children with a ten year gap! My now adult children are very close to each other, and to me. (And both went to Uni, had all the loans they were entitled to but we still had to fork out around 10k in additional support for them in total).
My sister had five, all very close in age. They are not very close to each other. My eldest had two, and my brothers had one and none respectively.
Every family is different. What works for one won't work for another. I do worry about the impact in society having more children has, such as costs of education, health care, support in old age, housing along with the environmental imprint each person makes on the planet.

[Angelika321]

I have 4. The eldest has SEND. We decided a sibling would be good for both us and our eldest. After no 2 we didn't want the burden of care to be on one child after we passed away so we had no 3. No 4 was a surprise. But I wouldn't change anything.

We have a big enough house and car and can go abroad so it hasn't impacted our quality of life.

I have given up work recently so that I can spend more time with the children as they're mostly school aged now.

[Sunisshining12]

@Crazymummyto3 thanks for your comments. I’m really interested to know how you find it with your eldest having additional needs too. What age are yours? I think we sound similar. We have a big enough house for no sharing, would have to make cutbacks of course but would still enjoy holidays, meals etc but less often.

[Crazymummyto3]

Sorry, that should have read that our house is big enough so that our children wouldn't have to share

[Crazymummyto3]

People will always have an opinion whether you have no children, two, three or ten. I've got to an age now where I don't care what other people's opinions are, all that matters is that i know that we are making our decisions for the right reasons. Originally we only planned on having two. Our eldest has additional needs too. Our third baby was a bit of a surprise but she's changed the dynamics of our family in the most amazing ways. I have one sibling and we don't speak any more which is so sad, I see the bond that our three have and it's one of the best feelings and hopefully something that they will keep all through life. Yes we've had to make cutbacks, but we still have days out, meals out, holidays and we just do them differently now but we don't miss out at all. We have a 7 seater car and our house is big enough so mine would have to share and we are currently ttc number 4. I am very well aware that we will get lots of negative comments but I don't care, it's our decision and doesn't matter to anyone else!

[Fucket]

The think is with university loans, if they don’t pay them back by a certain time they get cancelled. So I would rather save up some money towards a deposit on a house, or car, or van for work, etc. I really want them to think about whether they really want to go to university and their career instead of blindly going to university to do a ‘whatever’ degree. I know so many who went and it was an absolute waste of money.

[Sunisshining12]

Great comments thank you! I haven’t even considered University costs. I went & it was a waste of time. My DH didn’t & is very successful now leaving school with no qualifications. I understand for the middle/upper classes it’s really important. As is private education. Who knows what this Country will be like in 18 years!

Those with 3/4 - do they get along now, especially those who are older? I like the thought of my eldest especially having family around her when we’ve gone.

[dirtyrottenscoundrel]

Hi op.
Oh things worked out extremely well. It was hard I can’t lie, but so very worth it.
No regrets whatsoever - apart from not having a 5th!

[Threnody]

I have 3. My Mum was a bit taken aback about it (I have no idea why, as she was one of three, and my father is one of seven. It is one of the things on the cons list of whether to have a fourth). I love having three. They do fight, yes, and it's a bit hectic juggling school for one, and the other two, who are starting nursery soon, and I'm sure it will get worse when they're older. But they love each other, and it's lovely when they are playing nicely together.
I don't think one or two extra children here or there will matter too much from an environmental perspective. Luckily we can afford 3 (and probably 4 if we decide to). I haven't planned for university as who know what the situation will be in 14 years - but we'll work it out. We'll be able to save a bit once the younger ones are out of nursery, which takes my salary.
It's absolutely none of anyone else's business how many children you have as long as you can look after them, and keep them fed, warm, safe, happy and loved. People judge you no matter what you do.

[Fucket]

Unlikely, since you don’t get CB at all now if one of you earns over £60k.

Well that’s kind of the point I was making. Middle classes don’t rely on benefits and the CB cut off is at 2 children.

[CroissantsAtDawn]

That's sad stucknoue

I was chatting to a mum in the park who had 4 in 4 years (including twins). She said the baby/toddler years were the easiest. Just a conveyor belt of nappies/feeding/dressing etc.

Once they were all in school and needing help with homework/taking to activities/eating loads more/being bullied etc. - that's when she started really struggling.