Oxbridge 2025

[SnowFairy2000]

Let's start the journey here !!!

[Cubic]

Thanks for starting the thread. Ds wants to take physics at Oxford.

[Fluffycloudsfloatinginthesky]

Hello on the new thread. My DD is undecided between applying for English at Oxford or HSPS at Cambridge. Not sure if the better acceptance rate for English will swing it that way!

[DorotheaDiamond]

Ye gods it feels early!!! Dd looking at psychology- currently prefers C but I want her to have another really good look at O.

[periodiclabel]

I think it's way too early but hey ho!

I have one dc who is at O, one who failed to get into O, one may be applying next year for a very obscure subject with very low acceptance rates, but needs to find out a bit more.

I've been on these mumsnet threads before and they always are far more heated than you could ever guess. They tend to go the same way - they start nicely, people claim they aren't that bothered - they know it's a long shot. Some useful advice is offered.

At some point a bitter row erupts usually about state v private, people with children already at Oxbridge or (worse) who went there 25 years ago give (imho) sometimes good but sometimes very dubious advice. Then there's another row when people do and don't get interviews about the unfairness of the process towards state applicants/private applicants/foreign applicants/middle classes/posh/working class.

More upset and rows during/after the interviews and then huge upset/usually reasonably discreet delight when the offers finally come in in January. Always followed by an argument about whether the admissions people are uniquely skilled at pickign the 'right' candidates (usually the line of parents of successful applicants) versus those arguing it's largely luck if you get a place or not. Everyone gets much more invested than they claimed and even truly believed they would. I'm sure I will, even though I should know better by now.

Oxbridge's admissions process is designed to make those two universities seem special and different but there are many other great unis out there. Bear that in mind and make sure your child is very aware of this and keen on their other options. Make sure you are too. It's a trope on here but you will have more fun and free time at another university (at least that's certainly 100% what I've witnessed with dcs' peers) and your life chances will not be damaged in any way, although you and your child may be upset for a week or two if they don't get in. Life will go on.

[LighthouseCat]

I'll join. DD, who likes to have as much of life planned out as possible, initially was adamant Oxbridge wasn't for her. However, she's now put it on her list (albeit as her second choice 😆). Her subject is highly competitive so chances are very slim I think. Having not gone through this before I'm keen to learn as much as I can about the whole applying to uni process to support her. She's incredibly organised but can feel v anxious at times.

[BiancaBlank]

@periodiclabel I hear you, having also read many of these threads!

Particularly the last bit. One of my twins didn’t get into Oxbridge, the other is at Cambridge now, but the sheer amount of work she has to do has her thinking longingly of Aberystwyth (her back-up choice) quite often. Now they’ve been told they’re expected to spend seven hours a day revising over the holiday (exams in Jan)! DD3 is still waiting to hear if she’s got into Oxford - yes, she’ll be disappointed if she doesn’t, but I think also a bit relieved (me too).

Anyway, not to put the new cohort off! Good luck to you all.

[imip]

Wow - I joined MN 17 years ago when dd1 was born and here I am joining an Oxbridge thread!

Dd doesn’t know where she wants to go or what she even wants to study, but she went v well in her GCSEs despite missing a year for poor mental health (anorexia) and I feel like school will want her to apply and she will go along with that. I am not from England and I hope that by joining I learn more about the process. I am looking for different sorts of info. What the support is like for disabled students etc etc. I know this is stuff I need to physically go and research.

ideally, I would like her in a London uni -near us), but I think she will apply to Oxbridge.

[trickortrickier]

My advice (daughter 2nd Year maths O) is to read the websites thoroughly. All the information you need about preparing, applying and increasing access is on there and there is so much of it. Anything an individual says is largely anecdotal. If your child is at a non selective state school and a bit of an outlier in their cohort and live in a less desirable postcode then take a look at Opportunity Oxford which is an increasing access scheme.

[PhotoDad]

I'll jump in here too. DS is thinking of applying to Cambridge for NatSci(P). DD is in her second year at Cambridge School of Art (which is part of Anglia Ruskin) so it's possible that they would overlap briefly (if she does a Master's) but would probably have very different experiences of the city!

I'm a teacher and have seen many top-notch candidates fail to get in to Oxbridge, so I know just how much luck is involved. DS will have a realistic list (and might be happier somewhere he can continue with his niche sport in any event?)

[JesusWeptLady]

My DD is thinking of applying, my DS also (they're in the same year) but I think her chances are probably better than his, who knows. DH went to Oxford and one of my siblings went to Cambs. I refused to apply despite pressure from one parent. I knew I didn't have the "banter", if others know what I mean. But I would be thrilled beyond belief if either of my two got an offer.

[coffeerevelsrule]

I have a DS who has decided to apply. One of his grandparents went to O and he goes to a decent but unremarkable comp where he got the best GCSE results of his cohort but there was a reasonable minority who got very similar grades to him. I don't think he fits the criteria for any of the outreach stuff. He wants to do a humanities subject, perhaps combined with mfl.

I am very aware that there are more amazing applicants than places for them and am trying to get him excited about other possibilities by visiting potential cities etc But I do think he has his heart set on it, not helped by a couple of his teachers very much 'bigging him up.' School sends maybe a couple of students each year.

I'm hoping this thread will be a bit of an outlet so I can keep a calm head and sense of perspective when discussing it with ds!

[Fluffycloudsfloatinginthesky]

@coffeerevelsrule sounds pretty much same position my DD is in. She went on the Y11 Oxford visit but the Y12 one is based on her January mocks so she's pretty nervous i think she won't make the cut this year (they take top 'x' scoring pupils.

Given her assessment scores so far I would be surprised if she didn't but you never know.

She hasn't met any of the criteria for the outreach stuff she's applied for so far. Her school has 1 maybe 2 go a year.

We are in a super selective grammar area so many of the high performers move there at sixth form but she didn't want to. Her school helped her get amazing gcse results and she's happy there. She has heard anecdotally from a few people at the nearest girls grammar that they are not actually that happy there and it has issues. One of her friends left there to come to her school.

[piisnot3]

I have no skin in the game (nobody applying for another few years) but as someone who attended one of the oxbridge institutions as well as other UK (RG) unis I would like to offer a few perspectives:
Higher education is one of the only areas where the UK really is "world-beating". It has 17 of the top 100 unis globally (as measured by QS rankings). Only the US has more. In terms of geographical concentration, only the north-east US (i.e. New York / Boston) has a comparable concentration of top institutions. If any of the top 20 UK universities were transplanted randomly to another country it would likely be the top institution in the country (or in many cases, the entire continent).
The stranglehold that oxbridge has on the British psyche is unhealthy. The school that one of my children attends has just appointed a new head. He is not even qualified as a teacher, and is conspicuously underqualified for the position to which he has been appointed. But he does have an oxbridge degree. He should not have been appointed, but "pale, stale male with an oxbridge degree" is apparently what the the board of governors was looking for.. The head that he is replacing, who underperformed for years in post, was cut from the same cloth. So sure, oxbridge may further careers, but at what cost to society?
Teaching was not notably better at the oxbridge institution than at the other Russell group uni I attended. Snobbery, however, was in a whole different class. My oxbridge college director of studies was one of only 2 or 3 people I've encountered in over 20 years of living on mainland Britain who was openly discriminatory to people from my country of origin (or, as he put it sneeringly, "you people").
I did hear on a few occasions (10+ years ago) from hiring managers that they "only wanted to see oxbridge CV's". They were, without exception, assholes that nobody in their right mind would ever want to work for, and the most universally loathed colleague I ever worked with had gone from Westminster school to Cambridge.
Students considering applying to oxbridge should not lose sight of the fact that there are 15-20 other world class unis in the UK, where they can get a very good degree and perhaps have a more rounded life experience and a lot more fun.

[JesusWeptLady]

@piisnot3 I'm wondering if you personally, had a particularly unhappy time at Oxford? (I ask this genuinely and not with any snide side agenda.) We are from the UK but live in the US long term and I'd say your assessment of UK versus US colleges is not far from the truth at all (which is why both kids are applying to the UK). But by dismissing the West coast entirely, you do miss out on Stanford.

[PhotoDad]

I do tend to agree with a lot of what @piisnot3 has said. The flip side of the coin is that some people have an amazing experience there. One of the problems is that it can depend a lot on who your tutor/director of studies is, and the feel of the college; because groups are so very small, they have disproportionate effect on the students.

I completely agree that there are plenty of world-class universities in the UK. I would be very happy for DS to end up at any of them, and am incredibly proud of (art-school) DD for taking a route which is so very different to mine. The best reason for going to Oxbridge (in my opinion) is for the courses; some of them are unique in the UK HE sector. (As it happens, I went to Oxford and then to Cambridge, in order to study courses which literally didn't exist anywhere else at the time, and still don't.)

It's very much 'horses for courses.'

[piisnot3]

@PhotoDad yes, agree with that. though other unis also offer unique courses/resources. So if your thing is Anglo-Saxon and Norse then Cambridge may be best, whereas if oceanography is your thing then Southampton offers something unique.

@JesusWeptLady I probably had a fairly typical experience in a course that was known for being particularly intense, did not like the ethos in the department, and decided to do my PhD elsewhere. Yes, there are several fine institutions on west coast US but California alone has an area nearly twice the size of the UK. So in terms of geographical concentration the UK (more specifically, England and southern Scotland) and north-east US are unique in having 14+ institutions in the global top 100 all within a few hours by car/train. Nowhere else has more than 5. Comparison with the US is instructive. If someone in the US was attending Cornell/Yale/Columbia we'd assume they were happy with their success, not that they had a massive chip on their shoulder because they're not at Harvard/Princeton. Whereas in the UK, if someone is attending Imperial/UCL/Edinburgh (comparably ranked to Cornell/Yale/Columbia) there is a widespread assumption that they must have tried and failed to get into oxbridge and are thus forevermore tainted by mediocrity.

[JesusWeptLady]

@piisnot3
The population of California is under 40 Million people whereas the population of the UK is nearly 70 million people. I don't think the size of the state versus the size of the UK is a good comparison. But I do take your other points and do agree with most of what you say.

[mondaytosunday]

@piisnot3 fair point. I'm English with a child applying to Cambridge now, but I grew up in Boston with a sister who went to Cornell and another Bryan Mawr then Brown, and my father taught at Harvard Medical, so I've seen it from the US side. Harvard is seen as the jewel in the crown though - I have a friend who said she wouldn't get a job as a lawyer in Boston as she didn't go to Harvard law...
But yes the assumption is if you're at Durham (etc) you're an Oxbridge reject, which is often true, and that is where my daughter will most likely go if she doesn't get an offer (or Bath). We all know in our heads how slim the chances are, and that it is often inexplicable why this applicant got in when that one didn't, but Oxbridge still has this magical aura. But should my daughter get an offer I will tell her to think long and hard about the pressure of going there - I don't believe it would negatively affect her success long term going elsewhere, and the journey may be less arduous.

[Bluearrivabus]

Anyone with any experience of MFL at Cambridge? Dd in yr 12, got pretty much full marks in GCSE French & Spanish, started well at Alevel so think it may be a possibility. How much does it vary to other unis, in terms of workload, vibe etc? Is the entry process onerous? I went to a standard RG in the 90s, not sure how much difference there is between them and Oxbridge - think she is a bit worried it might be full of ‘weirdos’ (she is a very ‘regular’ teen at local state, albeit selective)

Her school have an Oxbridge club you can join if you’re interested in going but she’s only just started thinking about it and lacks a bit of confidence so doesn’t want to ask her teachers etc yet if they think it’s a good idea. I’m clueless- can anyone advise?!

[user1469447079]

@trickortrickier If you don't mind me asking, did your daughter attend the Opportunity Oxford residential for maths?

[periodiclabel]

@Bluearrivabus

Anyone with any experience of MFL at Cambridge? Dd in yr 12, got pretty much full marks in GCSE French & Spanish, started well at Alevel so think it may be a possibility. How much does it vary to other unis, in terms of workload, vibe etc? Is the entry process onerous? I went to a standard RG in the 90s, not sure how much difference there is between them and Oxbridge - think she is a bit worried it might be full of ‘weirdos’ (she is a very ‘regular’ teen at local state, albeit selective)

Her school have an Oxbridge club you can join if you’re interested in going but she’s only just started thinking about it and lacks a bit of confidence so doesn’t want to ask her teachers etc yet if they think it’s a good idea. I’m clueless- can anyone advise?!

I did MFL at Cambrdige but a LONG time ago so it may well have changed, your dd needs to check it out to have an idea if it's for her. If she got such great marks she's certainly in a very good place to start. When I did MFL it was a very literature-heavy course, it's not for someone primarily interested in the language, and the workload was huge especially in the final year, because you're writing essays about the literatures of two cultures (so at least two a week), plus doing all the language work - translations, proses (as they were then called), essays in the MFL about literary topics. Speaking part was minimal - I graduated after a year abroad still not speaking either language I studied fluently because there was no pressure to do so, the oral was optional and only the bilingual students did it. There were btw a lot of bilingual students ie ones who'd gone to an international school in Geneva or whatever who you felt you'd never catch up with, though - again - because the speaking side was so minimal it actually didn't make a difference in terms of the degree outcomes.


As I said above I have one dc at O and one not and there's no doubt the one not is doing about a quarter the amount of work but will probably end up with a better class of degree and has a lot more time for fun and extracurriculars. There are many geeks (more so now than back in my day as it's harder to get in) but there are also perfectly normal dc. I've been surprised at how many of my dc at O's friends actively seem to hate it there, but it may well be they would hate anywhere. I think the pandemic has made the whole uni experience a lot more challenging than it used to be.

[Bluearrivabus]

@periodiclabel thank you so much for your reply, that’s very helpful. I’m not sure the heavy-on-the-literature side would be that appealing for her, I think on the whole she’d prefer more of an extension of what they currently do at alevel. It may have changed since our day, of course! She’ll have to do some more research into each course I think to help her make a clearer decision - a lot of the info is quite hard to find! Thank you 👍

[periodiclabel]

@Bluearrivabus

@periodiclabel thank you so much for your reply, that’s very helpful. I’m not sure the heavy-on-the-literature side would be that appealing for her, I think on the whole she’d prefer more of an extension of what they currently do at alevel. It may have changed since our day, of course! She’ll have to do some more research into each course I think to help her make a clearer decision - a lot of the info is quite hard to find! Thank you 👍

It may have changed a bit but I think literature is still a huge component- anyway, check it out and good luck whatever she decides

[mondaytosunday]

Purely just one example but a MFL student showed us around Pembroke and she said she was busy but had time to join societies and get involved in sport. She asked what my DD was interested in and said the course was definitely more intense (HSPS). And I think STEM even more so as more contact hours too.
Don't know what year she was in but presume 2nd. She was a perfectly normal, friendly person! Her co-helper was quite a personality! They seemed to be very good natured and enjoying the day.

[PettsWoodParadise]

Saw this advertised at DD’s college and thought it might be of interest to some on this thread, note the college is an all women’s college:

In Y12 & interested in studying #STEM at #university? Apply for Newnham's free 2-day Cambridge residential on "Drug Discovery" for Women in STEM! https://newn.cam.ac.uk/admissions/access-and-outreach/school-visits/