DD suddenly doesn't want to take her Oxbridge place

[brentlondon]

She has always really wanted a place at Oxbridge. Now that she took a gap year and applied she accepted an unconditional to Oxford.

She received a long reading list the other day. She's suddenly "freaking out" about what she's signed herself up for and the amount of work she'll have to do.

Even though the course isn't the same or as good in my opinion she thinks she should've taken her place at Bristol; a city which she loves and has lots of friends in.

I think she's just realised how much work she has. Surely Oxbridge students have fun too, right?

It's as if now she has proved herself she's realised what she really wants is a fun few years. Shall I advise her to think it over until August and then if she's still completely certain then to contact Bristol through clearing. (her course was in clearing for the last few years)

It would be such a shame as we all think the Oxbridge environment would suit her.

Anyone else's child turned a wobbly?

[Carriemac]

DD did not read anything on her reading List for first year at Oxford, she has just got a 2.1in first year so did not hinder her ,
It’s definitely the cheapest place to attend, I have 3 Dcs in uni and she spends hardly anything compared to Her siblings . Not an insane workload and loads of support, the pastoral care has been exceptional at her college

[alreadytaken]

well I havent had a child at either Oxford or Bristol - but I do know that many students get a wobble about university. It's a big step for any young person and they all tend to be nervous.

My suggestion is that she asks on the Student Room about what the reading list for Bristol looks like. It may be just as bad. She may also be able to get information from current Oxford students on her course about what is expected. If she joins the Oxford Facebook freshers page (I assume there is one) she'll likely see other people also having some concerns about the reading list.

If you can afford it maybe take her to visit both cities again, they may help.

[another20]

www.bristol.ac.uk/study/undergraduate/apply/admissions-statements/

Someone just posted this link on a thread I have running regarding Bristol. It is v helpful - your daughter can look up her specific subject to find out if they will take her into 2nd year at Bristol having completed a year at Oxford.

[Xenia]

I've 2 children at Bristol and we have relatives who were at Oxbridge. I thnk she would be silly to turn down the Oxford place . Also the amount of work will depend on the subject - my non oxbridge two are doing an art and a science and the work level for their subjects is very different; they are both very happy but it's much more work for the BSc. One of mine was next to a current oxford student at a formal dinner his year and he said that student had a lot more essays (although they are within a shorter term).

On pre-reading I did loads for my law degree and most people didn't do much. I am sure people just vary in what they do. I think she should chat to a few others who are starting this Autumn on facebook, perhaps do another Oxford visit and then make up her mind.

[another20]

If she is experiencing panic then she shouldn’t be making any decisions in that headspin. There are two things you can do to help her out of panic mode so that she can think straight....this applies to any situation in life when panic rises.

First is she needs to depersonalise the feelings of panic - she needs to understand that many people feel this way and it is OK to feel this way.

Then she needs to plan an escape route as a key driver in panic is the feeling of being trapped. So she could research changing universities and be clear that this was viable and when the deadlines were.

Once she has done this the panic will subside, she will feel more back in control and be in a much better place to make her decision.

[Zebrasinpyjamas]

Could she arrange another visit to her college to remind her why she liked it previously? I went to both Oxford and another well respected university. The work loads were not even comparable between the two. However lots of friends and fun to get had at both as long as you are in the right place for your personality.

[smerlin]

Also agreed about the impact on jobs in the future. Having Oxford on CV definitely not enough to get you the job but almost always gets you the interview ime at least.

[smerlin]

The terms are only just over 8 weeks so it is two months of hard work and weekly deadlines but then a break. Depends if you can cope with that sort of regime really.

There is plenty of going out and socialising but it is definitely work hard and party hard rather than one or the other.

Second pp who said you are free of part time work. I remember vividly receiving the welcome pack with clear instructions you were not to work in term time and they didn't advise it in the holidays (reading lists in advance of holidays so you can do reading then to spread the workload)

The quality of instruction and individual attention is outstanding, or at least in my subject it was, and I had a very different experience from friends at other good universities - in a good way!

[FASH84]

Some of the experiences here are about course not uni. I went to a very prestigious RG Uni (not Oxbridge), my housemate and very close friend did NatSci her workload was insane, she did get a first, just and did her MSc at Oxford, my workload was probably 30-40 hours a week including lectures, seminars, tutorials, reading and essays. There were some points in the year however where I also was working 10-12 hour days, I still found time for lots of extra curricular, some of which has been very relevant to my career, and plenty of socialising.

[DairyisClosed]

Oxbridge students party the hardest of all Imo. They manage by not taking much/any part time work. She'll be fine. Lots of stupid people make it through oxbridge with good grades and not an unreasonable amount of effort.

[fabuloso]

I went to Oxford and am happy with my choice BUT the workload nearly broke me (NB though, am now suspecting may have adult ADHD? - I found the constant deadlines very stressful, but doesn't mean all students will).

I typically had 1-2 essays a week (History). Would have to master the whole of a huge topic (say Women's Rights) in a week. Or in English I think it could be like Dickens in a week or whatever.

It is relentless but you do get long holidays.

It taught me how to think, the tuition was personal, and I came out feeling intellectually equal to anyone.

On the other hand, I had less fun. I remember a friend at Birmingham telling me she had 2 essays a term. I had that per week. Clearly there is less time for fun.

My dd listened to my experiences and decided not to consider Oxford as she wanted more fun and less stress. I wish she'd tried for Oxford as I'm still glad I went. But I can see where she's coming from.

[BasiliskStare]

She will have what looks like a scary amount of work ( prior to actually being there ) at any good university I think. I cannot speak about gap years as Ds did not take one. I do think it's a wobble. The only difference as far as I can see is that Oxford has shorter terms - so to that extent less pressured being at a 10 or 12 week term university ( or indeed just a different sort of pressure ) DS is there ( Oxford ) and goes out and sees friends , does EC stuff and plays sport ( well - plays squash - you would never call him a preternaturally talented sportman - but no - he has fun during term time. Maybe there is a bit more work / reading to do in holidays but surely to do with the short terms. The one thing I would say is that going to a university "because your friends are there " is not necessarily the right idea. Most people make new friends. A good friend of mine has just had this with her daughter who wanted to go to X university " because her friends were there" - not necessarily the right choice for her. Well I wish your DD well whatever she decides - her choices are pretty good whichever way round.

[quartermooninatencenttown]

Most important thing is for her to decide and to feel that she wasn’t pressured either way ( sorry not suggesting you are) I went to a uni at 18 suggested by school hated it left after a year made a completely independent decision to go somewhere else and had the best time. Wasn’t considered such a good uni but I never looked back.

[muttleydosomething]

Oxford is no different to any other study environment in that you can decide how much time you devote to coursework and how much to social activities. It is a big university with lots of opportunities to do things other than your chosen subject. There will always be people at Oxford who really need that First, but as it's only a prerequisite for an academic career, the majority will be trying out other things and having a good time. I didn't work hard at all in my first year there, despite having a reading list that seemed to prescribe the whole of Victorian and modern literature while learning Anglo-Saxon.

I would definitely choose Oxford over Bristol myself. Presumably she will opt for a job suited for a person with real intellectual clout so she can make progress, and she will find it so much easier to impress employers with an Oxford degree under her belt. With other universities, no matter how good, you have to work more to show you have that little bit extra, and that is stressful and keeps on being stressful in this world where applying for jobs and proving our worth is something we have to do over and over again throughout our careers. She'll also meet a huge range of extraordinary people and be able to learn from them. She should be brave and stick with her original gut instinct to go for it.

[HingleMcCringleberry]

I’m not sure employers will be blinkered towards English at Oxford being better than English at Bristol.

I wish this were true. Well, maybe not blinkered, I’m sure any decent employer would give interviews to both candidates, but ears will prick up at the mention of Oxford. I accept that the plural of anecdote isn’t data, but for me it’s been a definite boon having Oxford on my CV - this is partly a product of working in some international companies, where Oxford and Cambridge can carry (undeserved?) weight.

You don’t know where life is going to take you, so if you can give yourself some advantages along the way, and your choice of university isn’t making you miserable, I’d go for the top-rated one over where my friends all are - they’re my friends, they’ll still be around in 3 years, and the terms are only 8 weeks long so I can go see them when my term is over (or indeed at the weekend in term-time!)

[shockthemonkey]

That's nice, Ifly -- very helpful I'm sure.

OP, she does not need to read everything on the list.

If she's always wanted Oxford, then I would imagine this is a wobbly and will pass.

I would gently reassure her (she didn't get her place at Oxford by accident)... but also remind her that you want her to be happy -- whether that's at Oxford or Bristol hardly matters.

(But Bristol's reading list may well be long too.)

[Etymology23]

DrWhy I’m glad you found pastoral support good. I had a long term illness through uni and struggled trying to fight battles to get the support I needed while I did that - I found generally their solution was to suggest you went home for a year to recover- which works great if you’ve had a terrible virus or something but really isn’t the solution for long term things. I only developed it while at uni, so I couldn’t go into the situations with the knowledge I know now.

[BubblesBuddy]

I think Oxford are already offering a foundation course for some students - their version of a contextual offer. I believe I saw some interiewed on tv. I think there are likely to be some weaker students at Bristol due to the size of the university vs Oxford but DDs friend who went on a contextual offer for medicine got on just fine. Students on DDs course floundered with top grades at A level. There isn’t any rule as to who will cope and who won’t. No weaker student made any difference to DD at all and in MFL you end up with the ab initio students joining the A level students in y2 anyway. Some are still behind but everyone copes. It’s a mild irritation but not worth worrying about.

I think with any university, students find their tribe. Doing well at any good university requires hard work and OPs DD could be more suited to Bristol. I’m not sure employers will be blinkered towards English at Oxford being better than English at Bristol. It’s more the way of life at the university that’s different and I would certainly give her a bit of space to decide what to do.

[DrWhy]

Entemology ‘s experience sounds pretty much the same as mine - NatSci is absolutely brutal! My first year I had something like 12 hours a week of lectures, 12-14 of practicals, 4 hours of supervisions - so 30 hours timetabled then each supervision required at least 4 hours of work, so that’s another 16. Plus reading for the lectures and in my case writing up the mess of diagrams that constituted lecture handouts plus my own notes into something coherent! It was definitely more than a normal work week. But - each term was only 8 weeks long, pastoral and mental health support was great and we still found time for fun.

[Abra1de]

Or are you more hung up about being able to boast to all and sundry?

😮

[SocksRock]

I turned down a place at Cambridge to go to Bristol. But it wasn’t because of the workload, the course at Bristol simply better fitted my needs (I wanted to do a gap year in Europe and I needed to be able to take paid employment during term time which at the time wasn’t permitted by Cambridge). I still had to work my backside off though, the course was very rigorous, just focussed on a different area to the Cambridge one.

[HingleMcCringleberry]

Whenever I read about a science student's experience of Oxbridge, I want to kill myself. Etymology that honestly sounds horrific. My experience was closer to Lorelai's, with two essays a week to get through, and some light language work.

Oxbridge students have plenty of fun - my course was structured so that 3 out of the 4 summers I was there, I had no exams. Heavenly.

brentlondon, if it is something she has always wanted, then I'm with the other posters who have recommended just being there for her and talking to her. October is a long way off, so there is plenty of time to re-acclimatise to an academic setting, after a year or more of working/travelling/whateverring. She'll work out what's best for her in the end.

Speaking only for myself, she's done the hard work and got the place, why not at least see what it's all about? If she doesn't like it, leave after the first term; plenty of people do.

[Needmoresleep]

I am not objecting to the Bristol policy. But an individual student might consider:

1. the extent to which their subject has expanded in recent years. In some subjects expansion has been quite marked with suggestions of growing pains.
   

1. will contextual offers impact on the base level for technical skills, eg for English that might be prior ability to/experience of structuring essays, analysis and arguments.
   

1. how are those who are admitted, then supported. Observation is that some will find the first term or two hard going, and possibly become disheartened. The Sutton Trust's report on contextualisaiton, confirms that many at Bristol are simply mainstreamed, and one of its overall recommendations is that Universities provide more support.
   

What impact that might have on other high ability students, and their aspirations. In some subjects students on contextual offers will catch up quite fast, not least it appears that there is little evidence that as a group they will be of lower ability than the rest of their cohort. Or for some courses it makes relatively little difference what grades other students enter on. Or perhaps a student's aspirations will be equally well served by a degree from Bristol as from Oxford, or they feel more comfortable towards the top of the cohort. Equally though some strong students will be wary that Bristol will be less able to cover the same ground as, say, London. (DS received an offer from Bristol but was put off by the fact that in his year they were taking a lot more students and had reduced entry requirements. In retrospect this was the right decision as the subsequent steps he has taken have relied on him having a high level of maths. Ditto we know of someone studying a humanity who transferred to London after their first year. Conversly we know someone sitting on a Cambridge offer who feels Bristol will suit her better. She is very bright, but not that into her subject. A slightly less frenetic pace will allow her to engage more in University life.)

[BubblesBuddy]

The fact Bristol do this bottom 40% list is encouraging in my view. I cannot see any Private schools on it. Some private schools do educate lower achievers though. The listed schools are not all in deprived areas. The list is nuanced towards type of school or college too. For example the secondary modern schools that serve Gerrards Cross, The Chalfonts and Amersham in Bucks are on it. Hardly deprived areas but these are not the grammar schools and clearly have a middle/lower achieving cohort of pupils to reduce results overall. So it’s fair they are on the list, despite middle class children attending them.

Regarding the op’s concerns, young people can have serious wobbles about Oxford. We have the T shirt in our house! However, there is time to talk it through and come to the best conclusion for your DD. Outcomes won’t necessarily vary from one university to the other. A lot of the future will be down to her personality, ability to get the experience for a job and go for it - Oxford or Bristol won’t harm career prospects.

[PreemptiveFartSquats]

@Needmoresleep - interesting (and bizzare). Thanks.