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Guest post: "My daughter's determined streak nearly killed her"

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MumsnetGuestPosts · 07/02/2017 10:31

When your first child becomes a teenager, you expect sullen looks and a resistance to parental requests. You know there will likely be a steady withdrawal to the bedroom and you begin commiserating with fellow parents as your once motivated, happy child morphs into a recluse overnight. Isn't that what all teenagers do?

But when the faddy diets start including internet-sourced laxatives and the time spent alone involves small razors, the jokes soon fade.

The first time my 15-year-old daughter took an overdose, I quickly found out that I was indeed 'good in a crisis'. Stumbling across some empty pill packets discarded on the bathroom floor, I asked her if she had taken them. As she nodded, I knew that this would be a moment permanently etched on my memory.

What causes a bright young girl - a girl with the prospect of a wonderful future and a loving family behind her - to try and take their own life?

It's the question that has kept me awake at night, and the question that well-meaning family and friends ask time and time again. I've accepted though that there isn't an answer, and that mental illness can strike anyone at any time - and it does not discriminate.

On that first occasion, the ambulance never came. I bundled my drowsy and emotional daughter into the car and promised her that I would do everything in my power to ensure that she got the help she needed.

I naively thought that I could keep that promise.

Despite the mental anguish she was experiencing, with no lasting physical damage she was deemed fit to return home the next morning. I was assured that our local CAMHS (Child and Adolescent Mental Health Service) unit would be in touch.

We didn't receive our first CAMHS appointment through the post until two weeks later. The Duty Mental Health Practitioner - the person assigned to work out how serious a child's mental state is - had been given the task of deciding whether she should be bumped up the waiting list. She met with my daughter for 20 minutes, then met my husband and I for a further 20 minutes. Despite the fact that when asked if she would attempt suicide again, my daughter rated herself as a 7/10, she was put back on the waiting list, to see one of only two psychiatrists assigned to the entire borough.

Soon enough we were back in A&E. She had disclosed her utter despair to me in a text, including the date on which she had chosen to end her life. But our GP and the private therapist who had been desperately trying to "keep her safe" for the past 3 months, told me that the best chance of getting any help would be to go to A&E and refuse to leave.

Five days later, our 15-year-old daughter was voluntarily admitted to an adolescent psychiatric unit, 80 miles from home. Thankfully, the CAMHS psychiatrist who had been sent to assess her immediately recognised that my daughter's determined streak, the one that we had always been so fiercely proud of, was going to kill her if something was not done.

After a 5-month stay in an NHS adolescent psychiatric ward, our daughter left with a prescription for the medication that continues to be vital to her wellbeing and a course of intense therapy provided by our local CAMHS unit.

She's doing so much better now. But the physical and mental scars that she is left with will likely haunt us forever.

Place2Be, the charity that first initiated Children’s Mental Health Week, is running a campaign in schools across the country, urging children to be kinder to one another. It's such a simple act, but can be so effective. There are other things that need to happen too. Our society needs to accept that this silent killer is not something to be ashamed of, so that our children realise it's OK to speak out.

Parents must be educated in the early signs, the ones that might ordinarily be dismissed as 'typical teenage behaviour'. And our schools should be forced into taking their students' mental health more seriously than their GCSE grades.


If you’re at all concerned about your child and not sure where to turn, the charity Young Minds offers parents a free, confidential one-hour telephone consultation.

OP posts:
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Jussa1347 · 09/03/2017 08:48

To everyone who has contributed on to this blog I am very grateful as I am currently undertaking a course in CBT brought about by my anger at what I observed from children's behaviour towards each other in Primary school. I'am a HCP with minimal experience of mental health issues. I volunteered within my children's primary school as an altruistic act, I certainly didn't want preferred treatment towards my children and was horrified by the actions on many parents who do then seeing the actions of their odious off spring. As a parent i taught my children about values I observed how under prepared they were to deal with the nasty words from their fellow pupils and their parents especially when they showed an aptitude for a subject. Added to this over worked teachers, demanding heads, the ever changing curriculum, no wonder some teenagers are so overwhelmed. I am a volunteer learning mentor and I provide support for this group, there's no money, the government is not going to provide it so instead of trying to find blame as let's be honest it's a huge issue..... decent parents encourage their children to be kind and work hard..... don't realise the toxic environment created by other kids and their parents...... the disarray of our education system and we have this tragic effect of some teenagers mental health.
Perhaps we could all use our experiences and find an hour a week to help????

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Scampy52 · 19/02/2017 14:15

I have just found a group on Facebook it's a closed group. They are campaigning for effective change with CAMHS. I would suggest many of us join and do what we can. Let's start applying the pressure.

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Scampy52 · 19/02/2017 12:36

Thanks to this thread, I think NHS England needs to have sight. They are going through some form of Transformation for YP with MH.
Things are moving for me and dd now but this required me to write to the top bods. Unfortunately a lot of parents may not have that knowledge of where to turn plus it is a struggle.
One thing I can suggest foe patents/ carers is to ask for a carers assessment you might not be eligible but under the Children and Families Act and Care Act social services it's needs to be assessed. This triggers other support that might be available. If you have carers advocacy in your local area get them on board.
Keep a thread like this going so advice and support can be given.

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suzanneinsideout · 19/02/2017 11:25

Scampy52 - Our stories sound very similar and I have to say, our experience of the psychiatric unit not having a therapist for the entire 5 month stay, was a particular stress. We were continually told that therapy is the thing that will get her better, although there was no therapist available! I'm sad for anyone who has had to go through a similar journey, it's crippling for everyone involved and yes, recovery definitely needs to involve family. Have you been offered Family Therapy through CAMHS at all? Sounds like you don't have any care plan in place which is absolutely unacceptable. They are supposed to give a clear plan before discharge. I can only recommend that you hammer on their door, day and night. It takes shouting to be hear by CAMHS sadly. I really feel for you but would highly recommend setting up a Facebook support group in your area, I am part of one and it has been invaluable to know I am not alone in this. Keep going. It's a tough journey :(

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Hagarswife · 17/02/2017 20:40

Yes it happened to my son , diagnosed schizophrenia ... we didn't even know he was smoking skunk .
We're non smokers and never took drugs , totally ignorant.
He's been ill for about nine years and has been off meds for a year .. it's such a struggle and every time he starts a volountary job it's comes with the promise of a job to follow , but the job never appeares .
Nobody seems to want to help once they hit thirty your on your own.

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Scampy52 · 12/02/2017 09:17

I am going through a crisis now with my dd. Hers is more psychosis. She was admitted to a YP treatment unit miles away. So travelling miles twice a week was exhausting but knew I had to has part of my dd recovery. The unit she was placed does not have a good reputation which from evidence could see why. Not enough staff or experienced. To have a child in one of these units cost a fortune and I believe whoever commissions these services need to be more involved to oversee services. My daughter saw a therapist twice out of her 6 week stay. Given wrong meds on home leave. Once her discharge was imminent did we hear from the unit no. Her Care Co-ordinator left after a week without informing us. No care plan since her discharge last week in place. All I hear about is education and agree with one of the threads. Teachers and the school can only do so much but the emphasis appears to be on the school to pick up the pieces after a crisis. CAHMS appear to be in a terrible state. Google the number of deaths if young people and yet nobody addressing that funds cannot be cut from this group again. CAHMS are in crisis and I'm sick of listening to them telling my dd and myself this is the situation. I also hear about how many times do you think dd will be able attend school it's like they see the school has a safety net.
No they need to look at services necessary for Young People with Mental Health needs nationally and get the young people carers/parents involved more instead of paying commissioner's loads to write a strategy paper leave and get another to do the same. The need to see what they can provide locally like they do for young people with LD. Specialist Schools if mainstream do not work, a lot of these young people are gifted but cannot go back to mainstream. Assessments not just health but social care to look at proper aftercare. Why are the placing young people so far my daughter is 13 years. At least have stay over quarters on sight. Family involvement less to good recovery.
I really want set up a group in my area because a lot of young people parents carers need support it can be an isolating situation to be in. My support was meeting other parents in the car park at the unit.

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nakedscientist · 11/02/2017 14:18

OP I do hope your sad story has a happy ending, as it seems it does.

Jiggly: "We are in an era where our teenagers are experiencing unprecedented levels of stress and anxiety."

Really? More than in in the Cold War era (death by imminent nuclear war) or in World War 2 where you may be killed by a bomb in the night or worse? Or indeed World War 1?
I think we are in an era where we can diagnose and help people more than ever before and since we can, we should with all our might. But, we live in a golden era.

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julania · 11/02/2017 07:46

I know it was your daughter and have some idea of what you went through. Only in my case it was my husband. 3 years ago he had a nervous breakdown and was self harming, burning his legs with his cigarette, and one day he presented me with a cut throat razor and asked me to hide it because he was thinking of using it! Our GP was great but the local mental health team was useless, they were only interested if he was actually trying to commit suicide, he was only thinking about it. Mental health is horrible to watch when it's some you love, my heart goes out to you xx

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gemmagemma16 · 11/02/2017 00:06

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gamerchick · 08/02/2017 22:41

I know I sound cold and a bit tight lipped. I genuinely don't mean to be, I have written and deleted a lot more posts than I've actually posted on this thread.

I've spent more hours in different a&es than I can count, it's not a magic bullet. It's not the years, it's the attempts that count.

Look, you are in a position of seeing recovery and being able to catch your breath to the point you can look around and seek out blame. Your child started down the throat to the bowels of hell and was winched out before she got there and festered. Be an advocate, spread your story I wouldn't have the energy for it.

I do really wish you and your family well. It's nice to hear a success story and I hope you can now plan a future rather than just tread water.

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suzanneinsideout · 08/02/2017 16:57

Gamerchick I will always be thankful that my daughter did get a bed but if you read my post, you will see that we took her to A&E as advised by our GP. I am thankful that we have a very good GP who knew the system and took our situation seriously, I know not everyone in the NHS system is like that. I am thrilled that my daughter got some help but I don't agree that she got it 'early on' - 2 years of anxiety is utterly crippling for anyone who has actually experienced it themselves. I am saddened that you know people in such dire situations, all the more reason to campaign. I did not let up until we got the help we needed. The system unfortunately is very badly organised and you do not get help unless you 'shout'. I also remind myself daily that we are VERY fortunate to be where we are today and that my daughter is still here, our story could have been very different. I do however think that our stories need to be shared and that awareness needs to be raised as to the state of our mental health service. Just my opinion obviously, you're entitled to yours.

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gamerchick · 08/02/2017 16:51

No that's not what I'm saying. Everyone deserves help. I just wanted to know how you got it so fast with so few attempts.

The young lady I care for had to actually heart stop beating die with attempts in TRIPLE figures before she got a bed. We were relieved when it was 'just' an overdose. Elsewhere on this site there's a mother who's child wants to kill someone else and he cant get a bed anywhere.

You have been fortunate. Your child HAS had the help early on.

Perspective.

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suzanneinsideout · 08/02/2017 16:44

Doyouthinkso I think to say that I'm 'lashing out at an easy target' is a bit extreme. If you read my original post, I wrote one very short sentence about our education system needing to take into account our children's mental wellbeing. I think that perhaps being a teacher, you just focused on that. As I said before (and in my original post) I believe that there are a number of things that could be improved upon in order to better this current situation regarding mental illness in children and adolescents, as our children spent such a large amount of time in the classroom, i think it would be very silly to assume that schools do not play any part at all. Of course home life and personality need to be considered, as well as the lack of funding in our healthcare system. Our society's general reluctance to talk about mental illness cannot go by unnoticed either. As I said, no one thing is to blame here and in fact maybe none of it is but I think we need to consider a better way forward.

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suzanneinsideout · 08/02/2017 16:32

Hi Gamerchick, in answer to your question 'how did we get funding a bed and intense therapy' - my daughter had been on the CAMHS waiting list for 6 months. CAMHS had agreed that she was suffering from anxiety and an eating disorder but did not have room to give her any support or therapy. Sadly the wait led her to developing depression and therefore one suicide attempt and a committed plan to kill herself, 3 weeks later. Thank goodness she did get a bed or she would not be here today. We had to wait in general hospital for 5 days in order to get that but beds are available in these psychiatric units (the unit she was in was never full in the whole 5 months) the system is just very badly organised. I guess one of my points is that the bed cost the NHS £1000 per week which could have been saved had the help been there much earlier on in her illness. I am not sure what you are referring to with your comment - do you think one suicide attempt and another planned suicide does not warrant any help? I beg to differ on that one!

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stephj25 · 08/02/2017 10:37

I can completely relate to this. Not the mothers side but the daughter's side.

I'm 32 years old now with 2 kids and I can't bear to think how my mum felt when she found out I self harmed. Or the day I sliced my wrist with a razor.

My feelings at the time were all over the place. I decided people were better off without me and that my death would blow over after a few days. I was taller than most and had size 9 feet at the age of 14. I was bullied, i was abused. I didn't understand why ppl hated me.
It took years for me to overcome and I still suffer from depression and anxiety now on occasion. However, I am very open with people now and can talk about anything. I am also a perinatal befriender and breastfeeding support volunteer. My children are my life and I would do anything for them.
If anyone wants to ask me anything. I'm here x

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suzanneinsideout · 08/02/2017 10:00

Windingingit thank you for sharing your story. I think that my daughter could very much relate to your feelings 15 years ago. I have one daughter who shares a lot and this particular child doesn't - it's part of her make up. But we are getting help to encourage her to talk and us as a family to talk more. I do agree with you that this is a small element though - our kids such a vast percentage of their day at school that education does need looking at. I'm not blaming teachers at all, it's our education system and the pressure that goes along side it. Not all mental health issues can be solved but I think we can certainly help some not get to the point that they do by reforming education, increasing funds to mental health and opening up dialogue and taking away stigma. I'm so glad that you've come out the other side and appreciate you sharing your story.

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suzanneinsideout · 08/02/2017 09:56

ShamelessSatsumaAddict thank you for sharing your story. Sadly secondary schools have had all their funding for counsellor etc cut so dramatically that they cannot keep up with the load in terms of the current mental health crisis that we are experiencing in this age group. It seems so short sighted of the government to do this and leaves teachers feeling totally out of their depth, as a number of other posters have mentioned. My daughter had a mentor at school which helped but she was no counsellor sadly and then she left (after 2 months) and wasn't replaced. It's very short-sighted of the government I feel. I am glad that you are better and that yours is a success story. I hope that my daughter will one day be able to say the same. We support and love her in whatever way possible. Sometimes sadly love is not enough and all areas need to be tackled I feel. Thank you for commenting.

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suzanneinsideout · 08/02/2017 08:32

Thank you Calmonthesurfacebut for taking the time to comment on here. I feel for you in this situation - when your child says they don't want to live any more, it's like a dagger to the heart isn't it? I think the positive thing here is that your daughter is talking to you (my didn't wasn't able to talk and still isn't someone who expresses herself easily). Keep the dialogue open and listen to her rather than constantly try to give solutions - us mum's are good at that! I would talk more in depth with the school. Could thy arrange for her to have a mentor at school? Hopefully someone who she feels able to share with. A large percentage of our children's time is spent in school so it's important they feel that they have an ally there and feel safe. Sorry I can't help further. I hope things improve for her.

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diamondsforapril · 08/02/2017 07:39

Jiggly I will have a look. The consensus amongst these sources seems to be that mental health problems are not on the rise but rather that they are being better diagnosed. A little like crime: if everyone reported crimes it might give the impression crime rates were rocketing through the roof but in fact they would be fairly stable.

I certainly am not dismissing Suzanne's point but I also think we have to bear in mind Suzanne speaks about one school and moreover one teacher in that school.

I think it's reasonably well asserted that high performing girls tend to be the ones vulnerable to eating disorders certainly and perhaps other mental health problems.

I feel there are valid points raised but just the same there is a definite boundary blurring here between serious mental health diagnoses - eating disorders, personality disorders, depression and anxiety (which if untreated can be crippling for a persons ability to function) schizophrenia and the like - all of which are serious, all of which can prove fatal, and all of which require specialist and professional help - and any kind of emotional difficulty a child may go through. The two aren't the same thing. A child who feels stressed about her SATs should certainly be reassured and comforted by her teacher but to assert this means she is suffering from 'anxiety' is an example of the boundary blurring.

I share an earlier concern. Teachers are not counsellors and we are not doctors. That's not intended dismissively - the opposite, in fact. If we take the first line of the doctors oath and 'first do no harm' - it IS possible to do immense harm through ignorance. Helping a child with an actual mental health issue needs to be done via a mental health professional.

Furthermore, I think we would all agree the root of mental health problems are complex. To try and claim, as some are, that 'pressure' is the cause misses the point. That same pressure will cause others to thrive and others to be indifferent. Realistically, none of us are going to be able to remove anxiety and stress from adolescence in its entirety.

If this post had pointed out that many of or young people would benefit from frequent reminders to be kind and compassionate I would agree. But in the particular context of mental health, I don't. I have a sibling with severe (if untreated) mental health issues. Believe me, when you get to the point of running naked down a busy dual carriageway shouting that people are after you with samurai swords (Hmm Grin - you HAVE to have a bit of gallows humour at times!) kindness makes not a jeff of difference. What they need is medication and expert treatment and schools are not the first place we should be looking for either of these things.

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JigglyTuff · 07/02/2017 23:25

Really Diamonds? I've found a couple of other places citing the research but only the blog by Tom Bennett disputing it. Have you found other sources?

I agree with what Wingdingingit said completely: "I send my children to school for 6 and half hours a day, I do not see how they interact whilst there, the staff will see that. I feel very strongly that there needs to be more communication between parents and teachers on all aspects of our child's growth and not just on the curriculum set out by the Government.
Talk to each other, talk to everyone, including your children."

Coming back to Suzanne's post, I can only go on what her daughter and she have said about the triggers. If Suzanne's daughter feels that school has had an impact on her mental health, I wouldn't dream of dismissing her assertions out of hand. And yet some posters have - without knowing her, her school or her teachers.

I find that alarming to put it mildly.

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Calmonthesurfacebut · 07/02/2017 23:07

I'm so sorry to hear your story, it sounds like your daughter is getting the help now.

I worry about my daughter, she has Dyspraxia, so struggles with friendships and always feels different, she is 12 now, but has said on two occasions she wishes she were dead. It's so upsetting to hear and we do talk about why and I think it is to teach the girls who are horrible to her a lesson! What can parents do to try and prevent or help before a situation escalates?

It sounds like you did all the right things with support etc., what would you advise parents in situations like mine? We haven't been to the Dr, although did tell school, she hasn't self harmed, but did say when she feels bad she has to pinch other bite herself, but I have never seen marks.

This sounds awful written down!

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Wingdingingit · 07/02/2017 22:47

I took an overdose at the age of 15, 30 years ago. It was down to a combination of pressure at school from one particular area, raging hormones and being in a family that didn't really talk.
I was offered no mental health counselling or otherwise. The school seemed to blame the teacher for going in hard on me. I always felt guilty for the apology she gave me.
I think that this type of mental health issue is more widely reported than it was 30 years ago. I also think there are more resources to help young people who are in this place than there were 30 years ago.
However the fundamental thing that really pushed me over the edge was pressure. Not clever enough, not beautiful enough, not seen. That's how it felt. I felt invisible and wanted to slip off....maybe...maybe I just wanted to be seen.
Everyone who has any influence on the lives of young humans need to remember how fragile their very essence is. We should teach people how to be human first and foremost, it's tough, it's tricky and it is becoming increasingly so the more we put scores and technology in between our relationships.
I send my children to school for 6 and half hours a day, I do not see how they interact whilst there, the staff will see that. I feel very strongly that there needs to be more communication between parents and teachers on all aspects of our child's growth and not just on the curriculum set out by the Government.
Talk to each other,talk to everyone, including your children.

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diamondsforapril · 07/02/2017 21:58

Jiggly

I think a few sources dispute that.

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JigglyTuff · 07/02/2017 21:56

I stand by my post. I don't think education is ever entirely to blame obviously but to say that it can never be a contributory factor and that it's blaming to acknowledge the part it played is really unhelpful.

We are in an era where our teenagers are experiencing unprecedented levels of stress and anxiety. And research has demonstrated that there is a direct correlation between teenage depression and exams: www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/features/teenage-mental-health-crisis-rates-of-depression-have-soared-in-the-past-25-years-a6894676.html. I'm not for a minute saying that families play no role in this - but we need to examine teenage depression in the round. Our young people are in absolute crisis - flinging accusations around helps no one, least of all the victims.

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MichelleTwinMum · 07/02/2017 21:46

I think it is good for all of us as parents to realise that sadly this could happen to any one of our children. There is no particular type of family or child more likely to suffer with mental health issues, it can affect anyone. Thanks for sharing Suzanne. x

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