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Bereavement leave – why our bosses need to recognise grief

89 replies

KateMumsnet · 10/01/2014 16:39

Every minute someone in Britain dies, and almost half of us say we’ve been bereaved in the last five years. Yet society’s response before and after a death often falls short, which can make dealing with loss so much more difficult.

All too frequently people who have been bereaved report feeling unsupported. There are sadly countless stories of people who have lost a loved one and who have been treated unsympathetically, including in the workplace.

A new report from the National Council for Palliative Care, published with the Dying Matters Coalition and the National Bereavement Alliance, reveals that significant numbers of bereaved people say they felt let down by their employer.

Almost a third of people who were in a job when someone close to them died, according to a new ComRes survey, did not feel their employer treated them with compassion. Moreover, despite job insecurities and an uncertain economy, more than half of us say we would consider leaving our job if our employer did not provide proper support when someone close to us died.

While some employers have excellent compassionate employment policies and are sympathetic and flexible to staff who have been bereaved, many others appear to be failing to provide the right support. People who are self-employed can also find it hard to access support and may find juggling work and the practical and emotional fallout of the death of a loved one impossible, at least in the short-term.

Since the publication of our report, I’ve heard both heartbreaking and heart-warming stories of people’s treatment from employers after having been bereaved. I was particularly struck by one BBC interviewer, who the moment we went off air told me that her husband who worked elsewhere had not been able to get any time off work to attend her mum’s funeral, causing enormous upset.

The challenge now is to learn from good and bad experiences alike, so that more bereaved people can receive the support they need from their employer, when they need it.

That’s why we are calling for a national review of employment practice relating to bereavement, to improve the way people are treated at work. This review should look at the feasibility of minimum statutory paid bereavement leave - something which doesn’t exist at present.

The introduction of paid time off work for parents following bereavement is something which Lucy Herd - a Mumsnet Blogger who writes over at Jack's Rainbow - has been passionately campaigning for, since her young son Jack died in August 2010.

Whatever the outcome of Lucy’s campaign and our calls for a national review, there’s no excuse for employers not to go ahead immediately with ensuring they have an updated bereavement policy. To support employers with this, the Dying Matters Coalition, which aims to raise awareness about the importance of talking more openly about dying, death and bereavement, has announced the launch of 'Compassionate employers'.

OP posts:
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SirChenjin · 11/01/2014 18:50

Oh - and when I said mental health services I'm including GPs in that

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VivaLeBeaver · 11/01/2014 18:52

My dad died recently and I signed myself off for a week on the sick. Didnt feel up to going back so went to see my GP hoping for another week to cover the funeral week. GP wrote me off for a further six weeks. To be honest I did need it. Only went back last week and I was still teary and upset. My immediate boss has been fine but I think my more senior boss isn't very impressed that I was off for so long.

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MrsDeVere · 11/01/2014 19:06

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NumptyNameChange · 11/01/2014 19:42

mrsdv you can't have read my posts - i didn't say grief was a mental illness and thoroughly explained that mental health is more than the absence of illness. i'm afraid we're on straw man territory now.

viva i'm glad your doctor was helpful - i'm sure the vast majority would be and if they weren't you could see someone else in the surgery.

so bereavement should equal 6months to a years leave without having to see a doctor on full pay then? is that just for death of a child or are we including death of any family member here? i had two bereavements in two years at one stage - should my employer have paid me for two years? or in the event of being unfit to work for 2 years is that not what our welfare system is for.

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NumptyNameChange · 11/01/2014 19:43

i'm not saying it's saying a simple matter btw - merely that i think it is adequately covered within the system of being signed off work unless you misunderstand what mental health means and insist on thinking it has to equate to mental illness.

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MrsDeVere · 11/01/2014 19:55

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mateysmum · 11/01/2014 20:03

My father died over 20 yrs ago when I was working for a largish company. They let me take 2 weeks paid without question and the MD who I had worked for briefly sent me a lovely personal letter which have kept to this day. My parents lived some distance from where I worked and this gave me the chance to support my mum and get myself together. I wouldn't have been much use at work. It left me with an enduring good memory of that company at what was an awful period.

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NumptyNameChange · 11/01/2014 20:09

i don't think i have been rude at all. i have articulated my viewpoint. i really don't see how i've been rude.

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Jinglebellsforthebetter · 11/01/2014 20:11

God, it seems I was "lucky" to have 2 weeks when my mum died (another city with a six hour round trip). Two weeks seems like the bare minimum to. Organise a funeral, death certificates, see lawyers, contact estate agents etc. My Dad's death SadSad will involve much more paperwork than Mum's as he is the surviving partner. I hope my employers are sympathetic...........

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SirChenjin · 11/01/2014 20:16

You're really not articulating your viewpoint very well at all Numpty and obviously haven't read all the other posts properly. Or maybe you have but stand by your opinions regardless - in which case we'll have to agree to differ on this issue.

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MrsDeVere · 11/01/2014 20:19

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NumptyNameChange · 11/01/2014 20:32

mrsdv it just seems odd that rather than discuss what was said you resort to 'you're rude'. i've generally known you to be a rather more reasoned poster. if you feel i have been rude report me.

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mateysmum · 11/01/2014 20:40

I wonder whether the lack of sympathy and practical help for bereaved employees is partly because these days many people sail through life with little experience of close bereavement. Until you've been there, you simply can't know how utterly disabling it can be; mentally and physically. It is therefore easy to push it aside as something that should be "got over" the day after the funeral. The amount of admin involved if you are an executor can also be massive and stressful. I just don't think employers appreciate it and I'm sure in certain professions bereavement could have safety implications if it affects performance.

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SirChenjin · 11/01/2014 21:02

I don't think being rude is grounds for reporting in the way that a personal attack is - but you are coming across as rather forceful in your views Numpty. Given the topic of the thread and the emotions and grief that go along with it, perhaps you might consider treading more gently? Smile

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morethanpotatoprints · 11/01/2014 21:04

As families become more complicated I think bereavement leave should be adjusted accordingly.
My ds1 has a friend at work whose uncle died suddenly. He was given no time off and wasn't going to be allowed time off for the funeral.
His uncle had in fact raised him as a father would, but no allowance was made for this as it wasn't an immediate member of his family.
I was so upset for the poor young man Sad

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MrsDeVere · 11/01/2014 21:06

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MrsDeVere · 11/01/2014 21:07

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thornrose · 11/01/2014 21:38

so bereavement should equal 6months to a years leave without having to see a doctor on full pay then? is that just for death of a child or are we including death of any family member?

Do you have any idea how flippant that sounds Numpty?

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FanFuckingTastic · 11/01/2014 21:39

I've found your posts confusing Numpty, not at all sure exactly what it is you are saying. And it's a fairly delicate subject for most people, being as forceful with your opinions could be seen as being rude, I say that as a person with HFA who has had to learn what rudeness is. Sometimes changing how you say things will make them a little more respectful of others.

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shabbs · 12/01/2014 02:37

Mrs D......I know that you already understand what I am going to post......but for anybody who doesn't I would just like to say the following......

Two of my four sons have died.

I had twins in 1981....one of my twin boys had serious heart problems. When he was 7 months old he died. Early one morning. He just couldn't carry on. 10 years later my DS3 was knocked down and killed by a prick driving a lorry. He was 7 years old.

After our twin boy died we struggled so much to keep putting one foot in front of the other and actually breathing.

When DS3 was killed our entire world collapsed around our ears. We were buying our council house, we were both working and doing the best we could do. DS3's funeral was on the Friday and the following Monday I HAD to go back to work. My DH had a total breakdown and was made redundant about 3 weeks after the funeral.

On my first day back at work (I worked in a cafe) the first order I took (to be delivered) was to the company whose driver had killed my son!! I glanced down the list and saw the drivers name who had crushed him to death. I did the order, while sobbing, and I carried on working at that cafe for the next few weeks. Eventually the cafe closed and I too was out of work.

Within 2 months of not being able to pay our full mortgage our home was re-possessed.

WE HAVE NEVER FULLY EMOTIONALLY OR FINANCIALLY RECOVERED! Oh yes we go from day to day with stupid pin on smiles.....we care for our surviving two sons and our grandson.

THERE IS NO DEATH SO SAD AS THAT OF A CHILD (no matter how old that child is) Our sons deaths almost destroyed us.

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SirChenjin · 12/01/2014 08:30

Oh Shabbs - words are not enough Sad Sad. I am so, so sorry.

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blahe · 12/01/2014 08:40

Good ole NHS employee here too.

My Dad was given 6 weeks to live. I went into work fully expecting to work etc but it just "hit" me as I walked in the door. Spoke to my manager who told me that I "should be working" - nothing offered i.e annual leave, unpaid leave etc. Other colleagues encouraged me to go home as I really wasn't safe to work and the GP signed me off sick.

On my return to work two managers completely blanked me and would turn away from me as I had dared to take sick leave (that is how I have always been treated when not seen to be "playing nicely"). After a month they are now speaking to me again. I was also put on a discipline for having to much sick leave in the year due to having an operation and for this.

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SirChenjin · 12/01/2014 08:44

Sounds very familiar...that wonderful "managers' discretion' used by the organisation when they want to absolve themselves of responsibility - which means that your bereavement experience is completely shaped by your line manager, who may be a reasonable, compassionate human being - or not Sad

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MadeOfStarDust · 12/01/2014 09:13

It is hard, but business decisions have to be made too - how long should bereavement leave be? anyone want to set up a table.... how long for a child, a mum, an aunt, a brother.... would the table also factor in how long it takes to get to the place of death and whether you were arranging a funeral or not? or whether you had been particularly close to them in life....

It is a compromise between the needs of workers and employers... more paid time off = less profit = less wages for all etc.....

annual leave is not just for holidays, it is meant to cover the unforseen too... compassionate leave is there for the first days, the shock.. the day for the funeral etc..

sick leave is there to cover the "I just cannot go back to work, it is affecting me deeply" days...

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MrsDeVere · 12/01/2014 09:30

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