Should school do more to support Oxbridge candidates?

[lurchersforlife]

DS is in Y13 and applied unsuccessfully to Cambridge. He got the rejection and his finalised mock results during the same week, all culminating in a pretty unpleasant parents' evening this week. To be honest, I think he has been let down by the school. He had mocks at the time the interviews were taking place- why?? He didn't need the marks for UCAS and has only just got the finalised grades back, weeks after he actually sat them. He could have done the bloody things after the interview surely? He didn't do brilliantly in his mocks but I think he had so much on at the time.

He also had very little support, but I appreciate the school doesn't send many students there so there isn't the expertise. That isn't their fault, but things like organising the timetable of key events absolutely is. Now they are saying he may well not meet his targets and is not fulfilling his potential - which was high so he is doing fine but not as well as he could be if they put a bit of thought into their organisation! Anyone else have experience of this? It's so frustrating.

[titchy]

It's difficult to know whether this is poor of the school or not. They can't change mocks just to suit one kid, equally there's no point him doing mocks after everyone else - and mocks are generally a good thing for all students. On balance I don't think the school was wrong.

Equally, and while I'm sorry he didn't get an offer. Ox and Cam are very very very intensive - gently, if he couldn't manage a mock and an interview in the same week, he wouldn't do well in that environment.

Draw a line, and move on. Does he have another offer?

[Octavia64]

A lot of students apply to oxbridge.

The vast majority of them don't get an offer.

Very few schools offer significant support for oxbridge candidates.

As a pp said it is a very pressurised environment and if an interview and mocks in the same week is a problem it's not the place for him.

[Hellocatshome]

But if you want them to change mocks to accommodate those doing oxbridge interviews, what about them moving mocks to suit those going for job/apprenticeship interviews?

[RampantIvy]

He did very well to even get an interview. I hope he can put this behind him and show them what he is capable of.

[leafingaround]

@lurchersforlife I am going to agree with the other posters, Ds was also an Oxbridge reject 3 years ago after interview and now has friends there. It is an incredibly heavy work load and I agree that if he struggled to juggle aspects of year 13 and felt unsupported then Oxbridge might have done him a favour. Ds2 decided it wasn't worth all the extra effort of entry exams and interviews so didn't apply.

I know it feels completely shit when it is something your child wants and they get a no. Somewhere on the higher education board there is a current students of Oxbridge thread and it may open your eyes to the sheer volume of work they have to do. There was also a parent on here who said the lie is how hard it is to get in when it truth it is how hard it is to stay there once you do get in.

[trickortrickier]

I do think this is a bit of an overreaction even if understandable. Everything about applying to Oxbridge is time-tabled well in advance as is dates and times of mocks. Planning and organising are skills young people need to develop as they transition into adulthood. The more self- sufficient they are the less spoon feeding they need and the more resilient they become. The drive and motivation has to come from the student not the school.

[Hatty65]

The date of Mocks will have been on the school timetable for at least a year! And they can't re-arrange them around one student who has an interview. What support should the school have given him? The interview process for Oxbridge is really intense, but most state schools would have no expertise in preparing students for it. How would they? If he's not currently meeting his targets he wouldn't have got in, anyway. He would still have to achieve the grades they require to take up any offered place.

I've had students predicted (and achieved) 4 A*s who didn't get into Oxbridge, even though we thought they'd be a good candidate. There are apparently roughly 23,000 applicants for about 3,000 places.

[Neriah]

He couldn't manage mocks and an interview? He wouldn't hack Oxbridge.

[cansu]

If he is to cope in university and with life he needs to cope with mocks and his interview. You sound utterly bonkers to be blaming the school. He didn't get in because they didn't think he would make the grade. By the way the university won't be holding a parents' evening for you to moan he isn't fulfilling his potential.

[lurchersforlife]

Oh well, thanks all! I just feel there's been very little acknowledgement of special circumstances. I get what people are saying about him needing to cope with interviews and mocks at the same time, but I don't understand them being before Christmas and then not getting the grades until last week! It seems they took their sweet time with the marking while putting enormous pressure on the kids at an already pressured time for some. Then their marking timelines mean the kids get all the bad (or good I suppose for some) news all at once.

He does have other offers and I'm sure he will be fine, but it seems like he has quite a hill to climb now to get his first choice which, if the mocks had been after Christmas like in other schools, would not have been the case.

[HippoStraw]

I understand that you are upset but I think you are wrong on this one. They happen before Christmas because that is often better. It means Christmas can be somewhat enjoyed by students. It gives staff time to mark them over Christmas if they wish. It allows time for another set of mocks of they are deemed to be useful.
As for ‘taking their sweet time’! A level papers take hours and hours to mark. Then we moderate. Alongside doing GCSE mocks usually, and teaching all day.
Plus, these are not ‘special circumstances’, as in, unusual. Plenty of courses have interviews. Art, nursing, teaching, pharmacy, medicine, plus more at certain universities. They can’t all be scheduled around mocks.

[NancyJoan]

The thing is, your son had his interview before Christmas, but other kids might have had other interviews in the last few weeks. Interviews for medicine are still happing this month; Warwick, for example, is interviewing for Eng Lit at the moment; students applying for courses that need auditions have been doing so for the last couple of months. The mocks can’t be scheduled to suit all those eventualities.

The mock results have no bearing on his actual grades, he’s now got 100 days to pull his finger out and make sure he works hard and is exam-ready in May.

[Crackoncrackerjack]

He can always take a year out and reapply if he gets the grades

[Zoomerang]

Oxbridge timing isn’t set in stone - the interviews happen over a couple of months, and then the offers (or rejections) dribble in. There’s no set timetable that school could work around. You’re being my very unfair to them.

[Walkaround]

Well, I think mocks in December of year 13 are stupidly early, unless they like to overdose on mock exams at the school and are planning yet more mock exams between now and the real thing, but other than that, don’t think the school did anything wrong. If a school is going to set them that early in year 13 (after presumably having not so very long ago done year 12 mocks to help with UCAS predictions and references), they have to expect some children won’t take them particularly seriously, as it’s a very long way off the real thing. Maybe they do it deliberately to maximise the number of children who don’t do as well as they ought to, to shock them into working harder in the Spring term!

[Walkaround]

@Zoomerang

Oxbridge timing isn’t set in stone - the interviews happen over a couple of months, and then the offers (or rejections) dribble in. There’s no set timetable that school could work around. You’re being my very unfair to them.

That’s wrong. Oxbridge timings are very specific - UCAS application in by a set deadline date in October, assessment tests for subjects that require them in October, interviews in December, and all offers for Oxford received on the same day in early January, with Cambridge offer day around a couple of weeks later in January than Oxford.

[Hercisback]

I think you're looking for someone else/something else to blame for the rejection. Sometimes our kids just aren't going to get into everything they apply for, that's life.

The school sounds perfectly normal in its approach to mocks and results. They take ages to mark and moderate.

Interview dates aren't fixed, so schools can't schedule around them.

[DelphiniumBlue]

Tbh, I think it’s the kids who are not on track for Oxbridge who warrant more support from schools. Limited funding necessitates hard choices.
Oxbridge candidates should be capable of organising their own time.

[notknowledgeable]

@lurchersforlife

Oh well, thanks all! I just feel there's been very little acknowledgement of special circumstances. I get what people are saying about him needing to cope with interviews and mocks at the same time, but I don't understand them being before Christmas and then not getting the grades until last week! It seems they took their sweet time with the marking while putting enormous pressure on the kids at an already pressured time for some. Then their marking timelines mean the kids get all the bad (or good I suppose for some) news all at once.

He does have other offers and I'm sure he will be fine, but it seems like he has quite a hill to climb now to get his first choice which, if the mocks had been after Christmas like in other schools, would not have been the case.

It was 4 weeks since Christmas

How is 4 weeks "taking their sweet time"?

It is a massive task, involving hours of standardisation, hours of moderation, hors of meetings and probably several weekends dedicated to marking by each of the teachers involved.

Your son failed in his application, sorry about his disappointment - if it is truly for him he can apply again next year with his actual grades.

You seem to be casting around pretty desperately for people to pin the blame on - and it is totally unjustified in my opinion.

[lifeturnsonadime]

OP in the kindest possible way I think you're barking up the wrong tree here.

My DS applied to Oxford, was interviewed but was unsuccessful this year. He also had his mocks the same week as the interviews.

He did fine in 2 of them but one which is content/ memory heavy he didn't have so much time as the interview was the afternoon before. He just emailed his teacher to explain the situation and she said it wasn't a problem if he slipped in that mock slightly as she knows he's on top of things generally. He did slip a grade from the summer year 12 mocks but it's no big deal.

As others have said other universities also have interviews. Medics & Vets and teachers etc can have up to 5 interviews.

It's up to our YP to manage themselves through this process, I'm not sure what exactly you expected the school to do here! ?

[lifeturnsonadime]

Oh and I think pre-christmas mocks are much better in general, they can have a good, much needed, rest then over the break.

[2chocolateoranges]

@Neriah

He couldn't manage mocks and an interview? He wouldn't hack Oxbridge.

Totally agree. University is intense full stop. My youngest had to sit her 2 nd year exams during the time her gran was receiving palliative care and died. No compassion for that, she just had to get on with it. Not her best grades but she still passed.

in general, university is all about juggling 6 subjects, labs, presentations, normal life and usually part times jobs all at once.

[Pacifybull]

I think you are being unreasonable. My nephews and nieces had to sit, between them, their A levels and university finals when their dad had just suddenly died a week or so earlier.

[Lightsabre]

OP you may want to look at/join this thread for sympathy/support

Redirected from Oxford and Cambridge 2024 www.mumsnet.com/Talk/higher_education/4982835-redirected-from-oxford-and-cambridge-2024

[Oblomov23]

Your anger seems misdirected. Ds's school is superb at backing Oxbridge candidates and their support, planning, pastoral care, meetings, talking about interviews, interview technique, practice interviews with parents who are CEO's etc, is superb. (Ds1 didn't apply to Oxbridge but many of his friends did and their parents said the school were superb, and nearly all got their place). But at the save time the school expects the children to put in the donkey work. His mocks weren't that great? He didn't get the marks for UCAS? That's down to him, surely?