Ukraine surrogacy "trade"

[Douberry]

news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-surrogate-trade-exposed-as-pandemic-leaves-51-babies-stranded-in-kiev-hotel-11988587

I'm sorry but this has made me want to weep. Such a bad situation on so many levels. I really welcome anyone to challenge the notion that commercial surrogacy is truly abhorrent

[WokeUpSmeltTheCoffee]

ProdigalKittens I do so agree with your post

The horror is in the total lack of acknowledgement of these poor babies as human beings, as people.
It is exactly as you say that they are treated as animatronic dolls.

They are presented exactly like dolls in a shop. All in identical cots, swaddled identically in matching outfits. You can see how the carers will go robotically along the line and administer each one their calibrated dose of formula milk and change their nappies on a schedule then pop the dummy back. The corporate video is in itself just so disturbing and brings home how these tiny humans are just commodities changing hands for a price.

Surrogacy is normalised now as just an absolutely fine way for gay men in particular to become parents. A couple of my acquaintance just did exactly that and I felt as though it would be homophobic of me to feel that was wrong and no way could I express any contrary view.

But it is wrong
Even if the conditions for their surrogate or for Tom and Lance's were much nicer
Baby humans should not to be made to order, bought and sold in a business transaction like a pet
Women's wombs should not be for rent and commercial exploitation.

[FannyCann]

In total, around 100 babies are stranded in reproduction clinics across the country, according to Denisova, who visited the center. If borders in Ukraine remain closed, about 1,000 children could be stranded, she said in a Thursday briefing, citing BioTexCom estimates.

Wow. 1000 babies stranded. But our Law Commissioners shamefully want to make it easier for UK citizens to import babies they have bought overseas, as part of their proposals for new surrogacy laws in the UK.
They should be prosecuted for people trafficking imo.

[OhHolyJesus]

It also could have been this thread.

Lots on this, there is obviously many of us who are outraged.

Babies stranded in Ukraine http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/amiibeingunreasonable/3910223-Babies-stranded-in-Ukraine

[OhHolyJesus]

Just found this fab letter from Nordic Model Now. They are so on it, it was dated yesterday!

There is a template letter at the bottom of this link to send to MPs.

I'll be sending this to my MP.

nordicmodelnow.org/2020/05/15/ask-your-mp-to-take-action-on-the-law-commissions-surrogacy-proposals/

[WokeUpSmeltTheCoffee]

Is there an official way to object to the law commission proposals?

Making it easier can only encourage this kind of horror.

All the press coverage I have seen of Tom and Lance's baby by an American surrogate is resoundingly positive and anyone who has any qualms is decried as homophobic.
Apparently gay men have just as much right to have a child that is biologically theirs as anyone else.
Despite this not being actually biologically possible without the involvement of at least one and apparently usually 2 women (one for the egg and one for the womb- less emotionally and legally complicated to separate this apparently)

Biology doesn't seem to matter a whole lot in many arenas these days
Biology is no barrier if a man feels it is his right to do something.

[FannyCann]

Thanks @OhHolyJesus

It looks a great letter. I'm going to copy in Mat Hancock as the Health Minister. The NHS should not be funding a trade in babies.

[WokeUpSmeltTheCoffee]

Ah ha cross post
I will send the letter

[ScrimpshawTheSecond]

I don't think this article's been posted in this thread, sorry if I've missed it.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8319275/46-babies-destined-parents-Britain-stranded-Ukrainian-hotel.html#comments

FWIW, the overwhelming majority of comments agree that this is 'baby farming' and shouldn't happen.

[FannyCann]

WokeUpSmeltTheCoffee

I can't remember which thread I posted this on. I get sick of the old trope that it's homophobic to deny gay men the babies they want. What about the misogyny of not caring what women go through to produce those babies? I recently got this newsletter with details of another American surrogate mother who died in 2017. These deaths are closely guarded secrets, most contracts include a NDA and no one dares talk about them.

"Crystal Wilhite was a surrogate in my surrogacy therapy group hosted by the Center for Surrogate Parenting (CPS). She passed away in February 2017 from complications after going into preterm labor for a surrogate pregnancy. Following a blood transfusion, she received after bleeding, she was discharged from the hospital earlier than she wanted, as she was still not feeling 100%, and then died at home from an embolism or blood clot.
I have to speak about this anonymously because I learned about Crystal’s death and the circumstances surrounding it at one of the CPS group therapy meetings, and from emails sent around by CPS to all of us surrogates used by them. CPS made it very clear that we were not allowed to publicly speak about Crystal’s death, and so I fear that CSPone of the biggest surrogate agencies in California will sue me if I speak publicly and identify myself.”

In Memory of Lost Moms

https://us7.campaign-archive.com/?e=63ad6d7206&u=854a02957234313d134e9865d&id=7c0dc77e2e

[OhHolyJesus]

Christ Scrimp "a centre for human reproduction".

I do think BioTexCom sounds like a company that would create cyborgs but that claim shows how proud they are of what they do.

I'm encouraged that this has spread so far and will bring light to something that so often is shown in the media as being a lovely, generous gift from an angel of a surrogate mother. It's really not like that most of the time when you look at it on a global scale and the exploitation of women and babies is off the charts.

[WokeUpSmeltTheCoffee]

I've just been immersed in reading the content on Nordic Model Now (I am a bit put off by the name. I mean I know what they mean but it still sort of looks like they are campaigning for Swedish fashion models)

Name notwithstanding the name thing the articles are really excellent and highlight all the issues and the harm to women and children especially the issue of women making an 'altruistic choice' in this patriarchal society where women are socially conditioned to please and men have all the power.

[LisaSimpsonsbff]

I honestly think that that BioTexCom video is like something from a dystopian film, and I would have found it far-fetched in that context. What is really upsetting is that that is them putting the best possible light on it - I would guess the baby/babysitter ratio is actually much worse and that they dragged them all in for the video.

Also, presumably the company is taking a massive financial hit - I assume they're charging the commissioning parents for the 'babysitting' (and again, will some just refuse to pay and accept they won't be getting the baby?) but presumably they're not getting any new commissions at the moment so their money is drying up. They'll have more and more babies as they're more and more desperate to save money, which is a pretty dire situation.

[QuestaVecchiaCasa]

Don't know if this has been mentioned yet but the Government has recently introduced rules about puppy farming in the UK which actually seem stricter than those in the Ukraine.
www.gov.uk/government/news/lucys-law-spells-the-beginning-of-the-end-for-puppy-farming

I feel sorry for the involuntarily infertile however, I think to protect women and children around the world, it should be illegal to commission a baby.

[SoftDay]

Here's the relevant report in The Irish Times today. The references to the commissioning parents as "clients" is disturbing, as is the reference to an expected upsurge in the number of those clients.

www.irishtimes.com/news/health/irish-families-struggle-to-travel-to-ukraine-for-birth-of-babies-via-surrogacy-1.4254753

[OhHolyJesus]

It's great to see this getting coverage Soft but the expected increase is disturbing.


Ms Hickey does not expect the Covid-19 pandemic will negatively impact on the demand for overseas surrogacy services. “I think it’s actually spurred more couples on to say this is something we want to pursue. Couples are saying once the travel ban is lifted we’ll do this.”

No mention of the children's commissioner commenting on this and possible (and I would Saul likely) review of the surrogacy industry in Ukraine.

"There is currently no Irish legislation around assisted human reproduction, and under Irish law the surrogate mother is considered the legal mother of the child. The Government has approved the drafting of a Bill on assisted human reproduction, which is scheduled to be passed in 2021."

We need to keep a close eye on this.

[FannyCann]

Yes, another country drafting a new bill.
Needs a close watch OhHolyJesus

[FannyCann]

Scheduled to be passed in 2021 - so they aren't expecting any opposition....
I wonder how far along the line they are with drawing up the bill. Even here the Law Commission have found its a longer job than they expected and put their time scale back to 2022.

[FannyCann]

I may have missed it but the plight of unclaimed babies in Ukraine seems to have dropped out of the news recently. I wonder if BioTexCom realised that what they thought was a reassuring video was actually a massive own goal, and have since shut down on news?
Are commissioning parents able to travel now? Are babies being collected? How many are there and how old are the oldest I wonder?

A colleague on maternity leave sent a clip of her four month old baby in the bath. So sweet. Lots of happy smiles and chuckles, kicking and splashing and interacting with her parents. Some of these babies must be a similar age if they haven't been collected yet. I wonder how they are developing....

[WeetabixBananaHipsterFFS]

Update from New York Times, 10th June Ukraine’s Backlog of Babies Born to Surrogates Begins to Ease

Just saw this and wanted to update the thread before bed.

[DuDuDuLangaLangaBingBong]

Wow. I missed this when it was posted.

Looks like a battery farm for humans. Truly disgusting.

[FannyCann]

Thanks for the update WeetabixBananaHipsterFFS


"With permissive legislation, high-quality private maternity hospitals and an abundance of poor women, Ukraine has in recent years become the leading country providing surrogacy services to foreigners"

An abundance of poor women - always a useful resource when there is exploitation to be done.

How many of the people raging against our colonial past, people who wouldn't dream of eating a battery farmed egg, think it's fine to farm poor women in the Ukraine I wonder?

[pachyderm]

It's amazing, isn't it Fannycann? The same women are fine with legalising prostitution even though the "profession" is dominated by women from impoverished countries too, it's almost like the same coincidence!

I have grown more disillusioned with Irish "feminism" and see it as simply middle class women seeking parity with middle class men in their careers. They do not give two shits for vulnerable women.

[FannyCann]

More from Ukraine. Every paragraph a new horror so I hardly know where to begin.


www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jun/15/the-stranded-babies-of-kyiv-and-the-women-who-give-birth-for-money

[FannyCann]

Sending pregnant surrogate mothers abroad to give birth to facilitate passports and visas = PEOPLE TRAFFICKING.

I'm so ashamed of the law Commission in the UK seeking to make it easier for baby buyers so called intended parents to obtain passport d visas to bring their purchases back to the UK.
This is state sponsored people trafficking.

Surrogacy tourism should be a criminal offence.

[DidoLamenting]

She agreed to carry a baby for an Italian couple, and within two months it turned out she had four living embryos in her womb. The biological family decided to keep only one and the rest were removed surgically

It doesn't need any further comment does it?