Travelling on Brexit day - would you?

[Leapyearlover]

Planning a trip (by air) to Italy on 31st Oct staying 3 days - madness?

[Ohflippineck]

In my wildest 3am dreams, the EU offers an amnesty immediately after we leave and grants citizenship of an EU country of our choice for a limited period to people who voted to remain.
I know, of course it won’t happen. But wonder how many leavers would join the remainer ranks when the shit hits the fan and the implications of what they’ve done finally dawn on them.
Supermarkets planning rationing. Christ on a bike, “we” did this to ourselves.

[whyamidoingthis]

@Peregrina - Or the Brexiters have been running to get Irish passports

I really, really begrudge them. Ian Paisley Jnr has been encouraging his constituents to get Irish passports which, considering his party's attitude towards Ireland, is a bit rich.

[Peregrina]

Or the Brexiters have been running to get Irish or German passports (in the case of Farage for his children). Or they have been rushing to move their money out of the UK. The blatant hypocrites. Why aren't they backing Brexit and being satisfied with UK citizenship, if that is what they think is wonderful?

[whyamidoingthis]

@berlinbabylon - I clarified up above. I'm only blaming a subset. Those who voted for brexit/pro-brexit parties and those who could have voted but didn't.

[berlinbabylon]

Oh and a lot of people who voted Tory - and for Brexit - are no longer resident in the UK. And a lot of people who would have voted against Brexit were denied a vote. By the Tory government of the time.

[berlinbabylon]

it was the citizens of the UK who voted for brexit and it was the citizens of the UK who voted each and every person in your government into Westminster, so I'm afraid the individuals who make up the nation need to accept some responsibility

I fail to see why I should take responsibility when I have never voted Tory in a general election in my life - and I voted to remain in the EU.

I have zero responsibility for this mess.

[Dongdingdong]

Unless I really had no other option then no - sorry OP.

On the other hand, so few people will be travelling that it might actually be really quiet and chaos free!

[whyamidoingthis]

@ListeningQuietly - You also have rather a few young people who will be most affected and were under 18 in 2016

Yes, I know. They would not be included in the numbers who didn't vote as they weren't registered. I think it's terrible the way they have been screwed over.

[ListeningQuietly]

So almost 28% of the registered electorate didn't vote. Some, for whatever reason, were unable, or not allowed, to vote. However, a larger number of those chose not to vote. You also have people who chose not to be on the electoral register. I believe they are also culpable.
You also have rather a few young people who will be most affected and were under 18 in 2016

[whyamidoingthis]

@Mistigri - I think you're absolutely right not to travel in november. However, I don't share your optimism. Feeling in the EU is not particularly positive towards the UK. There would need to be a very concrete reason to grant another extension. I think it would only be given if a GE is called or a new referendum announced.

I know a vonc is planned for september but I'm not sure there are sufficient numbers in parliament to support a national unity caretaker government. Johnson could, I think, push the GE out so brexit still happens. As it stands, he needs to ask for an extension. I can't see him doing that.

[Mistigri]

I did think though that many UK citizens living in the EU had a vote? Was that not the case?

Many/most didn't due to the 15 year rule + postal votes arriving too late.

As a general point, anyone travelling in a party with non-U.K. citizens around Brexit time (or with U.K. citizens who may need to return to homes in the EU after 31/10) needs to think carefully about whether travel is essential.

I personally think Brexit is unlikely to happen on 31/10. However, even a small risk of not being able to travel home to my children is enough for me to refuse to do any business travel in November.

[whyamidoingthis]

@ListeningQuietly - 52% of those who voted were for Brexit
which is under 25% of the UK population

That is true. However, I think people who chose not to vote are also to blame for the result. By choosing not to vote, you are effectively saying: "I'm willing to go with what the majority vote for".

So almost 28% of the registered electorate didn't vote. Some, for whatever reason, were unable, or not allowed, to vote. However, a larger number of those chose not to vote. You also have people who chose not to be on the electoral register. I believe they are also culpable.

[whyamidoingthis]

@Mistigri - The EU citizens are not going to be impacted by understaffing at non-EU queues, which was the subject of the original post on travel problems. The rest is just more of the shitstorm that brexit will cause to citizens of other countries.

I did think though that many UK citizens living in the EU had a vote? Was that not the case?

[ListeningQuietly]

52% of the UK population voted for brexit
WRONG
52% of those who voted were for Brexit
which is under 25% of the UK population

[Mistigri]

As for who is to blame for possible travel problems ...

The people likely to face the worst problems (concerns about whether they will be able to return home at all after 31/10) are people who by and large did not have a vote in the referendum - EU27 citizens in the U.K., and U.K. citizens in the EU27.

[whyamidoingthis]

@Ohflippineck - point taken. My post was clumsy and broad-brushed.

I was just a bit annoyed at the suggestion by @S1naidSucks that the travellers potentially affected were all innocent when almost 52% of the UK population voted for brexit and a very large percentage voted in pro-brexit parties. So rather than all individuals being responsible, it is the electorate that is responsible, with certain individuals also to blame, depending on how they voted.

At least you got to vote. I'm Irish. A no deal brexit will screw us over royally but we have no control over it at all. Mind you, that's nothing new. We wanted to join Schengen but we didn't as the UK wouldn't join. We were mindful of the potential impact on the GFA so we chose the approach that ensured we didn't threaten it.

[rookiemere]

Thank you Ohflippingheck your response is a much more eloquent and well reasoned version of what I was going to post, and yes as a fellow dog owner I too get the rage when I see dog poo uncollected- particularly if they've gone to the bother of bagging it - just why .

[Ohflippineck]

Oy, whyamidoingthis!

While I feel sorry for individuals, it was the citizens of the UK who voted for brexit and it was the citizens of the UK who voted each and every person in your government into Westminster, so I'm afraid the individuals who make up the nation need to accept some responsibility. Odds are, at least 30-40% of those travellers voted leave and/or voted Tory.”


How very dare you! 😬

I absolutely will not take any responsibility for this f**king insanity!
Your suggestion that this is somehow our collective bad is stupid. I walk my dog. My dog poops, I pick up the poo. The man walking along behind me doesn’t pick up the big pile of crap his enormous hound leaves on the pavement. It is neither my fault nor my responsibility to pick up the mess (though I probably would on the way back anyway if I had a spare bag because people who don’t have dogs shouldn’t have to step in shit). “My MP is an ineffectual non-entity, which I point out to him on a regular basis, and I did not vote for him.

I and the rest of the 48.11 per cent. of people who didn’t buy the snake oil bear no responsibility for the impending disaster. That blood is entirely on the hands of people who voted to leave and I won’t be lumped in with those any more than I will be lumped in with thick Kev and his enormous hound.

[Ohflippineck]

No, go a few days earlier if you can and avoid the aggravation. If you’re a UK citizen with all of the paperwork, you’ll be held up for hours. If you’re not and you don’t, it seems if Ms. Patel is true to her threats, you may not get back at all.

[berlinbabylon]

Although Ed Vaisey was saying today that Tories won't vote against the government in a VONC because they wouldn't get reselected in any resulting election - and more right wing candidates would, so their dilemma is producing a HoC/government which is even more right wing. Sorry this probably belongs on the main thread rather than this one, but it did make me decide to step up my no deal preparations. I am seeing my mum for the weekend so I can help her make plans too, she is not going to be happy if she loses her HRT patches...

[NoWordForFluffy]

The tide is already turning against BoZo. He thought his letter would win him support, but it's totally backfired (if you ignore the government spin).

All of the leaks revealing what no deal looks like are starting to turn even previously supportive newspapers.

When - bloody when, why they voted for this long is beyond me - parliament gets back, there'll be even more anti-government / no deal activity going on. Perhaps people crossing the floor.

There's a long way to go until Oct 31st (that doesn't mean I'm not planning for no deal, just there's a lot of miles to travel yet). Buckle up!

[Peregrina]

Why do you think this Mistigri? Things to me look really black at the moment. We know that Boris Johnson is more interested in himself than anything else, so if there is any whiff of him getting the blame then he will change his tune PDQ.

If Priti Patel's cockeyed ideas about FoM being ended and EU citizens not being able to prove that they are entitled to work here were to be taken literally by employers who needed to check every EU citizen's status on 1st November and every GP surgery and hospital had to check NHS entitlement, I could quickly see it descending into absolute chaos immediately. Imagine just now many hospitals would have to shut their doors if their EU staff stayed at home until their status was clarified.

[whyamidoingthis]

@S1naidSucks - I’m picturing the poor farmers and yard owners not even being able to walk from one end of their fields/yards to the other, across the British border in NI/Ireland, without their bloody passport.

There is a business (can't remember what) on one side of the border with the only way in or out on the other side of the border.

[Mamamia456]

Jasjas1973 - My travel insurance isn't high, but it may be because I haven't been admitted to hospital in the last year because of my condition.

[S1naidSucks]

I’m picturing the poor farmers and yard owners not even being able to walk from one end of their fields/yards to the other, across the British border in NI/Ireland, without their bloody passport. Yes, some land does actually lie on both sides of the border.