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Brexit

What the what?

37 replies

Blue4ever · 06/07/2016 12:40

Had coffee with an old friend yesterday. Hadn't seen her in months, and I was quite cheery considering, and feeling better about this country. Said friend was very pleased to have voted Leave and have won.

But (wait for it)

  • she didn't know what a free trade agreement was;
  • she didn't know that some parts of the U.K. Are receiving subsidies, investment in scientific research, regeneration, etc
  • she thought that the Remain side lost because of all the lies they said during the campaign;
  • she is expecting non British Europeans to be deported, at least those who don't work, and when I said that deportation would probably not happen she said that there would be uprising in this country when leave voters would realise that Europens would stay here.


What the what? I don't know how I managed to keep a straight face...
OP posts:
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Poptart27 · 10/07/2016 08:16

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WingsToFly · 09/07/2016 18:59

The whole referendum and aftermath seems to have exposed a widespread dumbing down across the board. Also many have been shocked out of political apathy by the result imo. Apathy due to not feeling your vote counts or voice can be heard.

From this pov we've all had a shake up and the process has really made people stop and think and question the issues and find where they are wrt values, as well as deal with quite primal fears about food and shelter and change.

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ThroughThickAndThin01 · 09/07/2016 18:41

Don't let it make you too sour kirin it sounds as though it just might.

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kirinm · 09/07/2016 18:23

I don't mind sneering at leavers. They've fucked the country and don't give a shit. Racist enablers. I'll sneer all I want.

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Grassgreendashhabi · 09/07/2016 18:19

I keep popping back and forward to this thread and again it seems very clear that some and I do mean some remainers think that voters regret their decisions or were mislead.

And in turn that they (being remain) are obviously more intellectual and up with politics than the rest.

However all I see is scaremongering and the blind devotion to EU.

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Poptart27 · 09/07/2016 17:45

And just think the brexit vote might have handed another total cluster fuck to the world. Have you seen how the nutters and racists in the states have jumped on the back of it.

Ha.
The rest of the world could give a crap about the UK leaving the EU. The "nutters" you so lovingly refer to are actually (rightly) upset about REAL problems, like police shooting innocent black people and in turn, people shooting police at random for no reason. Nothing to do with the EU.

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MangosteenSoda · 09/07/2016 17:44

*interested in finding anything out

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MangosteenSoda · 09/07/2016 17:42

The EU is not a dictatorship.

On a totally anecdotal level, the people I know who voted leave are much less well informed about the EU, how it functions, what falls under EU remit and what is the responsibility of the UK government than the people I know who voted remain. Moreover, most - not all but a significant majority - aren't really interesting in finding anything out. They are not that interested or bothered about what's going on now, politically or economically, and are complaining that all the news is still talking about this stuff. I've heard plenty of distasteful comments about foreigners from people I would never have expected to say that kind of stuff.

It has definitely taught me that making such massive decisions by giving the public a binary choice is a big mistake.

The leave voters I refer to above all have extremely valid concerns about jobs, services etc, but they are overwhelmingly issues which are the government's responsibility. The leave vote seems to mean something different for everyone. It's like a magic panacea to cure the evils of your choice. Most of which bear no resemblance to anything which is actually going to happen.

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Poptart27 · 09/07/2016 17:42

Dictatorship? This country is about to get a PM elected by an almost vanishingly small percentage of the population. How's that for a lack of democracy?

You can thank your ever truth telling Remainer Cameron for that. This country wouldn't be in complete disarray if he had followed through with his promise of continuing to lead this country. Instead, he jumped ship, loads of remainers voters freaked out, causing protests and markets to dip and dive. Reactions were, and still are, completely OTT and this is not helping the future of our country.

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Joysmum · 09/07/2016 16:47

It's funny because I've spoken to many remain voters who didn't have a clue how the EU worked and yet voted to stay in.

So you believe remain voters knew more about the EU so chose to stay in? Hardly!

Those banging on about lack of understanding from the leave voters continue to ignore the remain voters who lack understanding (of which there are many) because they agreed to remain in so it isn't relevant Hmm

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Lighteningirll · 09/07/2016 15:20

Oh well argument over your totally unbiased version of your friend has me convinced

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RageAgainstTheTagine · 09/07/2016 11:11

Brown got into power the same way, didn't hear the left complaining then. This is the representative democracy that we have voted specifically for, it's about as democratic as you get!

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TheElementsSong · 09/07/2016 10:46

You're friend voted you out of a dictatorship.

Well, I shall endeavour to be very grateful. Would this be the dictatorship that we're in no hurry at all to Leave? That we're currently saying "Ner ner ner ner you can't make us Leave" to? And to which, apparently, we're going to tell what we want during negotiations and they're going to give us an awesome deal because BMWs? This must be a new definition of dictatorship of which I was hitherto unaware Grin.

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Frazzled2207 · 09/07/2016 10:08

Sorry, was sidetracked. But there's no doubt that some brexiters voted for brexit without really understanding the implications. But I also know some brexiters bright enough to see through the brexit camp's lies and still, genuinely, felt it was a good idea (we've agreed to disagree).

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Frazzled2207 · 09/07/2016 10:04

I'm with you op. It's a despicable state of affairs.
Quite aside from the economic catastrophe, the country is now facing near political meltdown too. And of course Boris and DC have washed their hands of it
Sad

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Grassgreendashhabi · 09/07/2016 09:48

Wow talk about stereotype!

Not all leavers are racist

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lovelyupnorth · 09/07/2016 09:34

I do love people spouting bollocks about bollocks. Dicatorship - did you miss the euro elections every time then and I guess you got to vote for the queen and House of Lords. The eu is no more a dictatorship than the UK.

Let's just hope it's not the cluster fuck it looks like it is now.

And just think the brexit vote might have handed another total cluster fuck to the world. Have you seen how the nutters and racists in the states have jumped on the back of it.

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Grassgreendashhabi · 09/07/2016 09:24

Here we go again.

Let's make out that leavers are uneducated.

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ToastDemon · 09/07/2016 09:06

Dictatorship? This country is about to get a PM elected by an almost vanishingly small percentage of the population. How's that for a lack of democracy?

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Poptart27 · 09/07/2016 08:48

Oh good. Another "leavers bashing" thread. Where all those who voted leave are thick as pig shite and everyone who voted remain are so clever. Where all the remain politicians were transparent and the leavers were liars. Because we all know politicians always tell the truth.

You're friend voted you out of a dictatorship. Thank her. She did you a HUGE favor.

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NoahVale · 09/07/2016 08:38

agree it shouldnt have been put to the public.
how ridiculous.

on the news last night they were asking people on the street, Teresa May or Andrea Leadsom.
why were they asking? It is Not some sort of X factor. People on the street have no choice, and nor should they in times of such importance.

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Roonerspism · 09/07/2016 08:35

I don't disagree sanity in some respects

however i think Cameron had to respond to the Eurosceptics on both sides.

When you think about it - the implications of being in the EU are huge but we last had a referendum in 1975 and that was for people to enter into a trading arrangement.

I also don't dismiss the elderly vote and neither do I think the less intellectual are unable to consider things.

I do, however, agree that both sides were dreadful leading up to the referendum

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SanityClause · 09/07/2016 08:25

Rooner, I have seen reasoned arguments for both sides.

But the votes based on ridiculous falsehoods, like the ones the OP outlines, make me more and more sure the referendum was a very bad way for a country to make such a complex and important decision.

But then, apparently we voted for a referendum. Except, I didn't. But my vote on whether to have a referendum didn't count. Only my actual vote in the referendum counted.

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Roonerspism · 09/07/2016 07:43

I love these threads.

Sneering at your friend obviously makes you feel better.

Do you think she would have voted differently had she understood some of these things properly let's leave the deportation issue to one side for the sake of argument although you may want to re-think friendships with such people)

For example - sovereignty. In the so-called "thick" friend's eyes, she probably thinks "bit weird this EU lark means that the country where I live no longer makes up many rules. See - even my tampon costs more. Bit shite that"

Or, perhaps, "this EU has lots of different countries and everyone can live where we want. Most people speak English and lots of these EU countries are a bit poor right now. There isn't much housing round here. But because of the rules stuff, we can't say no right now to these people. It's maybe ok right now. But i am worried that this will get worse as that Cameron prick admitted he can't change it. Maybe free movement causes problems but everyone tells me it's good"

Or muses said thicko - "the EU is meant to help its citizens. But it's really weird, right, because them Greek people are being right royally shafted and even committing suicide. I don't know what a Eurozone is but I think it means Germany decides economic conditions for that Greece place. See now, everyone tells me, the thick friend, that this Eurozone thing is good. But I like Greek people and nearly half their young are out of work"

Shall I continue? Thick friend "all them clever expert people tells me that we need this EU. And that my country will stop working if we don't. There are lots of clever people in London. Lots of money. But they forgot to tell me the banks were a bunch of shiteheads. They didn't warn me the last time the money in the world went haywire. And these experts thought it was a good idea for our banks to buy stuff full of debts that couldn't be repaid. See, I'm thick but I think that isn't so clever. So maybe I'm not that thick. And they tell me my country is doing well but I can't get Wayne into the village school no more. And they tell me it will take years to sell stuff to Europe. But they have told me lots of things that I think some it is made up but I don't know what bits. So I don't believe no one like"

"I read that leaflet on the EU. It's very impressive. There is Council and a Commision and Parliament and that moves around to make sure French people are happy. Some of these people meet in secret. My clever friend round the corner, who I find increasingly patronising, even told me than the elected people from each county can't even suggest new rules. She said this is great!"

My granny round the corner, she says she voted last time for countries to sell stuff. She said she agree to this shite. I like my granny. Everyone says old people are old fashioned. But she talks sense my granny as she has been here a while and loves Wayne and thinks it's best for him if we get out this EU thing.

I think I might just have a nice cup of tea and have a think now.

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GraceGrape · 09/07/2016 07:42

The fact is that many people (probably on both sides) were extraordinarily ill-informed. It was a complex issue in many ways. However, there is a difference between being ill -informed and voting to keep things as they are and being ill-informed and voting for something that will dramatically change your country and the lives of everyone in it.

It is also extremely irresponsible of the government to ask the public to vote on something they must have known people didn't understand about. I know quite a lot about the EU ( through a related degree) and have said for years that the public on the UK generally have a very poor understanding of how it actually works. This is without doubt due to a lot of very poor and biased media reporting over the years.

Of course there will be people who informed themselves and voted accordingly. But there will be a sizeable number that didn't, or weren't able to. That, coupled with the fact that nobody made clear what a leave vote actually means, is going to make negotiating a future relationship with Europe very challenging.

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