I think I might be against any form of single sex education

[pasturesnew]

It seems weird to me that round here both state & private school provision, esp. at secondary school level, is separated along gender lines.

You can't separate schools along racial lines, for example, so why is separation on gender lines OK? Is it because in practice both boys and girls appear to do better academically in single sex schools? If girls did worse in girls-only schools I assume these would be illegal by now.

Even where separation is allowed on religious lines in principle (at least in state provision, I think) places have to be available to children who are not of that religion although in practice I appreciate such "spare places" may not be available.

Similar segregation in the workplace would be illegal.

I see a lot of debate and discussion on mumsnet about the religious criteria for various schools but have not seen much debate on gender.

As families are smaller these days and may also be headed by single parents with less extended family involvement, it is less likely that children will have the experience of growing up with both mothers and fathers, grandparents, uncles, aunts, brothers and sisters, male and female cousins etc. So it is possible that children attending single sex schools may not have many opportunities to develop relationships with members of the opposite sex outside school.

I think that various social research has shown that it is good for people's adult relationships to have more experience with the opposite sex. I know that recruitment of male primary school teachers is desirable, for example.

I am not sure it is good for children's social education for them to be segregated in this way even if the academic results might be better.

I wonder if in the future this practice may seem completely weird and old-fashioned and eventually be made illegal.

What do other people think?

[OldLadyKnowsNothing]

pasturesnew, you might find this book interesting.

[OldLadyKnowsNothing]

Oh, btw, there are some jobs which are exclusively for one sex or another, legally - the employer has to demonstrate that it is essential all the workers are of one sex or the other, for example Women's Aid workers are all women, and their job ads quote the relevant legislation.

[hocuspontas]

Dd2's mixed comp are experimenting this year with the top two English sets (year 10) in single sex classes. Dd2 says it's made no difference to her so far but a friend's ds says it's great with no girls! It will be interesting to see if it makes no difference over all. (i.e. most get their target grades predicted last year).

I'm slightly about it because they are obviously doing it to improve the students scores but why not ALL the sets? Surely the middle and lower sets deserve the same chances? They probably need it more if anything.

Dd1 and dd3 are at a single sex comp and I was educated at a girls grammar and we're pretty normal! Most children are educated in a mixed environment up until the age of 11 - and most colleges/unis are mixed. It's only that hormonal bit in the middle where they normally separate. It's ok in my book.

[pasturesnew]

Thanks OldLadyWhoAppearsToKnowLoads, that link was helpful, I see it has some other book suggestions underneath it too.

Interesting hocuspontas to hear that some mixed comps are trying singles sex classes, wonder how widespread this experiment will be.

There are more combinations of mixed and single sex education than I realised before starting this thread! Good to hear people's experiences of the different ways it can work.

[Builde]

My education was mixed up until 18. Living in a rural area meant that all schools in the county were mixed. (Not enough children to be able to provide any options on schooling!)

However, at 18 I decided to study engineering and I chose a girls' college at Cambridge. This was because the mixed colleges were so gender imbalanced with their engineering intake; generally 9 male students and one female student.

So, though I would have been happy to go to a mixed college if there had been equal numbers of boys and girls doing engineering, I didn't want to be the only girl in a group of 10 male students.

As lectures were University wide, we were mixed for most of our work, but I did enjoy having supervisions with just other girls.

An old colleague claimed that I was a passionate supporter of single sex education but I felt that having done engineering and then subsequently worked with men only, I had more than done my bit for mixing. In fact, you could say that post-18 I've had a single sex education; just with the opposite gender.

I would choose a mixed education for my children but I think that I will let them choose their own secondary education.

My bigger mission would be to get more girls into science and engineering professions. I can't help think that construction would benefit from more women...it might be more organised, less confrontational and have a bit more teamwork. (Or am I stereotyping terribly).

[ABetaDad]

Agree with Georgimama that the diamond structure is perhaps the best of all worlds.

I went to a single sex boys school after 12 and DW went to a single sex girls Convent school after 12 so we know single sex well.

We both agree that boys need mixed education but are not so sure about girls. The diamond allows socialisation in things like choir and so on in the 12 - 16 years but learning in the classroom works better single sex at that age. Full mixing occurs at 6th form.