competitive parents - what exactly does this mean?

[lorna111]

Just that really - it's probably a silly question but if a school is known for its competitive parents, what does this mean? It sounds awful and not my thing at all but I'm curious how what the parents are doing exactly to be competitive. Tutors for their kids every weekend? Ridiculously over the top homework done by dad?
Thanks!!

[sashh]

I can give you an example of competitive grandmothers.

I took a single 'O' Level early, my grandmother was very pleased/proud. So she told her sister, who declared it couldn't be a 'propper' 'O' Level because her grand daughter hadn't taken it.

[Lizziewarmington]

I know one teacher who took all the bands off the books, got rid of sets/groups for maths and only talked to the children about their own progress- and all because of pushy parents. The class made more not less progress !

[TheVictorian]

I think the various competitiveness parenting styles are quite intriguing.

[Kenlee]

Well all I can say is my daughter is from Asia and she got into the Maths team too...

O and btw I have experienced the competitive parents...

I am so glad my daughter is boarding in the UK. Yes there are blips but she says the good parts outweigh the blips...If she was in Hong Kong...there may only be blips combined into bigger blips..

My take on this is come to Hong Kong and see what real competitive parenting is about...Its at a new level..It may also be a new art form. Im really am surprised they havent open a tutor center to teach the kids how to go to the toilet. They have early learning for babies up to 6mths...showing flash cards and listening to classical music...Speaking in English, PuTongHua and Spanish. Taking a few tutorials on a few subjects thats just weak. I was talking to my friend who's daughter is going to the US to board next year. Her daughter does school and 5 hrs tutorial after school...not including the special skill sets such as dance, music and art.

My daughter comes back for Easter and we get a note telling us not to let her revise and enjoy Easter...Which she is doing....All the mums are horrified at her slackness....well she doea play the piano for a laugh...but not seriously...

[Martorana]

I still think that the chances of both "top" teams being all boys if there isn't an issue with the teaching or selection is pretty remote. And a head being bullied by one parent int this way is also ridiculous.

[Xpatmama88]

Shooting, I think being fair, the school picked the most able one to begin with but a few mums were not too happy that it's all boys team, what can I say?

Yes, we'd been to various Int'l Sch in Far East, incl, Japan, HK, and Singapore. I think normally all schools select for these tournaments are based on merit and ultra fairness, it should be great experience for anyone involved.

I think the Headteacher (European In'l Sch) had given in and sent one more team and did not expected the outcome, and the upset that caused. It's all down to one over competitive parent.

[Xpatmama88]

The reason I mention this incident is more because of the competitive and unreasonable mum that I experienced. Her point was her DD should be placed in the 1st team instead of my DS( since he is a year younger), then her Dd would not come last. I was thinking what the...., it was not me that make the call!
Good thing is my DS is now in boarding school in UK, and I don't get to see any parents much and do not have to put up with any nonsense, and it's good to be a neglecting mum.

[Shootingatpigeons]

expatmama As a former expat I am reading your posts and feeling increasingly . I don't know where you were an expat but I was an international school parent in Asia and I do not agree. You do not get anything like the same level of competitiveness in (truly international opposed to Chinese or Singaporean ) International Schools there as you do here. When my DD was sitting entrance exams for the London day schools all the other parents and especially the teachers were slightly bemused and mildly disapproving of the extra preparation and practise papers she was doing, and compared to what goes on here it was really very minimal. The teams who went to compete in the various international inter school competitions and tournaments, be it maths, sport or music were always selected and conducted in a spirit of scrupulous fairness and above all fun. And the parents at other International schools competing seemed to approach it in the same spirit. It bordered on the twee and hippy but my girls look back on those years of their education as the happiest, because the pupils came first, and everyone, teachers and parents were focused on each and every one of them feeling valued and achieving their potential. I can't imagine what you describe ever happening in any of the international schools there. They did do well in the Maths tournaments but then that was because of one particularly talented boy. He wasn't Asian but he was quite severely autistic.

[hench]

I imagine the third team from most schools would also have come last Martorana, that's just the way these things work, very few schools would be able to provide more than 2 teams worth of pupils of the appropiate calibre. And wihout further information on sex distribution in other years there's nothing in the story to suggest a problem with the way maths is taught either imo. At my dc's school the top 10 or a dozen children get a general achievement award at the end of each year (I've never especially liked it, but it's the way they do things). The same children tend to win year on year with only very minor fluctuations. In dc1s year it was always very nearly all boys that won, in dc2s year always all girls. Nothing to do with how they were taught - just statistical fluctuations in sex-ability profiles of the intakes.

[Martorana]

Oh come on- the boys team came 10th- the girl's team 100th and it's just coincidence? Yeah, right.

[Xpatmama88]

I don't think the school stereotype any gender bias, the year before they had a girl in the top team for the maths tournament. They also came top 10. I think intake of Int'l school various year on year, many also do not have English as their first language.
My DS team had an American, and a Swedish, both boys are exceptionally clever. The other boy team made up of German, Indian, and Dutch, they came middle ranking, so still good. And the girls team were 2 American and an Korean. Most of other int'l Sch 1st team came within top 40, and 2nd team normally further behind. It's a two days tournament many different type and style of questions, and lots of maths related quiz. So I don't think is fair to say the girls are not taught well, they are in the same class. I think it is more about how they apply the knowledge during tournament rather than just calculation. Standard is very high, the schools from Far East did especially well.
I think in Int'l school setting there are different type of competitive parents.

[summerends]

Actually maths competitions are also about risk taking, mental speed for calculations and competitiveness not just about maths ability. The girls might have been just as able to answer the questions but not practised the other skills needed or not have the mindset.

[richmal]

Xpatmama88, I do not think that you hold the view that "girls can't do maths". I meant that two teams of boys being picked was reinforcing this message to the girls in the school. The problem is why the girls are not achieving at that school. Was it just a glitch for that year?

I'm sure your son is doing very well in maths - for a boy

[Martorana]

Oh, don't start me on that one, LongPieceofString.................

[LongPieceofString]

I think I am getting pushier the older my DC get. I blame it on living in a stupid bollocks grammar school area. So the DC are competing with each other for high school places and when DS tells me his test results for something I find I am wanting to know what everyone else in the class got too, to work out how he compares.
I think he is 'borderline' and I am terrified of letting him down by not pushing him for 11+. I am also terrified of pushing him! Just wish he could go to a school where he could be awesome in some subjects (he is) and average in others (he is). But the grammar school system knackers that all up :(

[Martorana]

XPat- you said that the boy's team came in the top 10 and the girls came last out of 100- if they are in the same set then there has to be something wrong with they way they are being taught. Unless you subscribe to very outdated stereotypes..........
And it is by no means competitive or pushy or any of those epithets to say "why isn't my girl doing as well as the boys and what is the school doing about it?"

[Xpatmama88]

Richmal, I don't think 'girl can't do maths', those girls are very good too for their age group, but the boys chosen were stronger in the subject, it's a big school, have about 140 students in each year group. My DS was preparing for Common entrances for both Winchester and Westminster, he is excellent in maths. Also it depends on the day of the tournament and the type of questions asked. Many schools only sent 2 teams with one teacher.

[Taz1212]

I agree with Retropear as well. I think there are differences between being a pushy parent, a competitive parent and a helicopter parent. I'm a pushy parent but I'm not a competitive parent at all. I really don't care how any of the other children in DS' class are doing, I just care that DS is working to the best of his abilities.

I have high expectations in certain areas but not others. For example, he's turning into quite a sporty child but not a talented one, and I'm just glad he's finding some sports to enjoy. I don't care how well he does at them. On the other hand, I have high expectations about his academics because I know how capable he is. He can be very lazy and prone to taking shortcuts which frequently don't work out!

I'm the product of pushy parents and although I moaned about them at the time, in hindsight I'm incredibly grateful that they pushed me in the way that they did. DH grew up with very laid back parents and he wishes they had pushed him in school!

[richmal]

I think the mothers should have been asking why the top attainment for the girls was so far behind that of the boys. Not because the girls team did badly, but because in year 8 and below the top attaining students were all boys.

Having two top teams of boys does reinforce the stereotype of "girls can't do maths". If it was done on results it was fair, but I think some questions should be asked as to why they are not getting high achieving girls.

Perhaps rather than spending their resources on extra lessons for the already high achieving boys, they should have provided extra tuition on addressing the problems of the mismatch.

[Martorana]

Something wrong with the teaching if the gender disparity was so huge. I would have had questions to put to the Head......

[soundevenfruity]

My understanding was that they put together a team made up with girls whose mothers complained. They might've not been the keenest or the best maths students. They might've not had any interest in taking part until their mothers intervened.

[anitasmall]

Soveryupset and S4Worries, so very true.

There are countries where on schools' websites are names and achievements of children (music competition/sport awards). It is another mindset to be proud of, happy for your child's friends' achievements.

There are many topics discussing the ranking of the British education system. To learn to congratulate our friend's child will be the first step to improve it.

[Xpatmama88]

I think it is not gender bias, the girls chosen were able girls too, may not be as good as some boys, they were in the same top set? I think the girls' mums believed they were able too and were annoyed that they were not chosen. It's the head of maths made the final list based on the final testing. And the Headteacher was pressurised to send one more girl team to show the school was not gender bias.

[Soveryupset]

I thought the same - very odd gender bias...

[richmal]

So in that school, the 6 top maths pupils in grade 8 were all boys and all the girls in grade 8 were not as good at maths as one boy from the year below?

Has the headmaster looked into the problems of gender bias in maths attainment in his school?