Anyone else survived a 3rd/4th degree tear and still feel sad and angry over the whole thing?

[sksk]

Just wondering, I still get upset and angry over it. I still have some small issues. I am not incontinent apart form wind occasionally, some faecal urgency and the wiping issue. It is almost 17 months since I had my baby, my first. Does anyone else still harbour anger and feel upset? I'm feeling a bit sorry for myself! Hoping to get all the nasty feelings out before 2015!

[5madthings]

There is support thread, it was called the ragged bits?! Or something thread. Will see if I can.find it and link.


Of course you can still start your own :)

[middleagedbread]

I didn't know what a 3rd and 4th degree tear was (and have given birth twice) so I googled. I am so horrified for all of you who have posted your experiences . How can this happen in a modern hospital? I sympathise with Rowan wanting to start an mn support group. These injuries are life-changing and the effects long lasting. I am so sorry .

[blowinahoolie]

I am actually beginning to wonder if I'm just shit at pushing out babies, because when I speak to friends, they've just had a 1st degree tear, or a 'graze'.

[blowinahoolie]

I had a 3a tear with my first DC. It was horrible, I feel I didn't get the guidance from the midwife at the pushing stage, to minimise the tear. I went to theatre and like others on this thread, I missed out on several hours of spending bonding time with my baby. However, DH was there with him, so it wasn't a complete wash out.

I had a 2nd degree tear giving birth to my second DC. I did ask if an ELCS would have been a better idea, but the medical staff said that it may not happen again. Thankfully it wasn't another 3a tear!

[seaoflove]

I had a 3b tear and healed without complications, btw.

[seaoflove]

I'm so sorry you've suffered so badly fromage. I too have awful memories of being painfully examined by a miserable registrar, lying in theatre feeling like I should be happy but actually feeling like shit. I too had postnatal depression and anxiety and probably an element of PTSD as well.

FWIW, once I could actually entertain the idea of getting pregnant again, I insisted on ELCS and will be having one in May. Although the consultant completely dismissed my concerns over tearing again, of incontinence, etc. I didn't have to fight at all. He says I can have one for mental health reasons. I wasn't bothered how it was justified, tbh.

Hope that's of some comfort to you.

[FromagePlease]

I had a relaxed water birth with unexplained 3a tear. No one could tell me why but assured me it was "really rare"

The time I spent in surgery afterwards is honestly the absolute worst time in my life, it haunts me: the indignity, lack of control, pain, shock, brutal treatment from some of the staff.

And then I over healed, which was again "really rare" so I had to have a bridge of extra skin removed surgically. This was after 6 months of continual chasing and horrible appointments with dismissive people.

Now I have a small bridge of skin which has regrown and it's painful in the area. I can't be bothered to face a doctor about it, so I've not told anyone but my DH, I now have a phobia of any medical professional.

I am very angry. Angry at the lack of information, at the humiliation, and the PTSD that I suffered, and the PND.

I'm also scared about having another baby. And I know that I'll possibly tear again, and that they won't want me to have a c-section, that no one will care. (can anyone advise - was it a battle to get a C-section after this type of injury?)

Finding this thread has been a revelation, that other people feel the same way. I hope that my post might help someone else.

[FromagePlease]

Why are you deleting my post? I hope the thread can stay.

Sorry if I have offended anyone. I really didn't mean to.

[RowanMumsnet]

Hello FromagePlease

We’re so sorry to hear that you’re feeling like this.

We’re very sorry to say we don’t allow posts like this on Mumsnet, so we’re going to delete it now.

Please contact the Samaritans, by emailing [email protected] or calling 08457 90 90 90. You can also see the resources in our Mental Health webguide here.

Very best wishes from all at MNHQ.

[FromagePlease]

Thank you. I am pretty much fine now, just worried about it happening again. Writing it all out was good.

Maybe we should start a support-group - "3 and 4th degree tears and angry"

It's just so unfair isn't it - not that life is fair but if it were possible I'd have a good old feet stamp about the hand that I've been dealt

[5madthings]

Echoing sycamore please find someone in rl to talk to fromage perhaps one of the birth charities that deal with birth trauma etc? Are you being seen/treated by a gp for pnd/depression?

And you don't have to have another baby if you don't want to.

Please look after yourself fromage xxxx

[sycamore54321]

FromagePlease, I have not experienced the injuries you suffered but I am so very sorry to hear how awfully you have been treated. Your post makes me worry for you, I know how difficult it can be to find help and support but please keep looking. You shouldn't have to, it should be there for you but please keep on asking until you find the support and healing you need. Suicidal thoughts are very dangerous so please please get help.

[FromagePlease]

Sorry, long but cathartic

[leaw100]

I feel such a huge sense of relief that I have found this thread. I suffered a 3rd degree tear 20months ago and I am still very much coming to terms with it. My DD was born within 7 hours and I had a relatively calm birth in the pool. I never found out why I tore but I think it was due to me pushing too hard and her being on the larger side. I will never forget the shock and pain I felt afterwards. I was taken into theatre, told whilst lying there that I could be incontinent and then left on a ward (my husband was asked to leave as in the middle of the night) unable to move, unaware of how to feed and emotionally drained. That first night I spent on my own will haunt me forever.
I have since had scar tissue removed (my tear had over healed itself) and have only just started having sex again, nearly 2 years on. I have met the most amazing nurse in my village surgery who has examined me on many occasions, telling me I'm fine. I would encourage anyone who has been through this to talk to someone.
I have felt extremely angry and so upset that I will never feel able to have a natural birth again. I also beat myself up regularly about not being able to spend those first precious hours with my DD. I know she will never know but it is something that I will never forget. Thank you for allowing me to share my thoughts. It's been a long time. X

[middlings]

Shit, that was long! Sorry

But it was incredibly cathartic. It's the first time I've written it down.

[middlings]

I had a 3a tear with DD1 who, it turned out was a compound presentation. She was delivered (despite my requests to the contrary) by a very nice first year student who did nothing to prevent it happening. The roar out of me as I tore must have been heard by half of London.

I delivered her on gas and air, ended up in theatre on a spinal. I delivered at 1am and made it to the ward at 4.30. The one good thing that happened was that the qualified midwife who was present did not leave my side until she was latching well - a factor that I'm convinced set us up successfully for EBF.

But...I was left on the ward with her naked other than a blanket on me. I was still in the gown I'd been to theatre in with a pad wedged between my legs and I was there until 9 in the morning when an HCA helped me. The ward failed to make the requisite physio or consultant follow up appts and I had to chase them myself when a friend who had the same injury a week earlier told me she'd had hers.

Also, DD1 was the result of a fourth cycle of IVF. She was much wanted and I was a wreck for the three weeks after she was born. I told my mother on day three that if someone came and took her I wouldn't mind and God forgive me, I meant it. I think the only thing that got me through those days was the fact that mother had always been very honest about the fact that she hadn't instantly loved us - so I put it all down to just being a new mum at the time. Dd2 (natural conception) was born 16 months later and I had a small tear that was barely 2nd degree. She didn't sleep for the first six months, and clearly I had two tinies, so didn't think about much else.

She's now 15 months and DD1 is 2.5 and it's only in the last few weeks that I've started to think about it and man, am I angry. I'm fucking furious. Dd1 and I bonded beautifully but I'll never get those three weeks back. I'll never forget the look on DH's face as I sobbed that I would try to learn to love her. I'll never forget the pain of having to crawl up the stairs at the end of day 10 and not being able to stand for long enough to change her nappy because I'd been for a stroll in the park.

No-one, not a midwife, a GP, or a consultant ever talked to me about it. They all hid from it and minimised it.
I'm incredibly lucky - I have a bit of faecal urgency but no other problems and my pelvic floor is good other than that (and if I'm honest, I've never been great in the number two area!).

But yes, I'm angry.

[Tea1Sugar]

I had a 3a tear with dd1 4.5 years ago. I then had a wonderful elcs 9 months ago with dd2. That was the mental cure for me- going back into theatre but this time for the best reason.

[babynelly2010]

My situation is a bit different in a sense that is more progressive. In my first birth I had what the called 2nd degree tear borderline going to the theater type injury. They kept me in birth centre with MW stitching, big mistake!
Second birth only small tear but result is prolapsing, I blame first stitching job that soon after came apart. I also had ripped labia that I found for my self after first birth as my lousy MW forgot to inform me about it and write in my notes.
I saw consultant and on my way to recovery through surgery. Talk to someone and get help, you need repair either it is surgical or not, let someone help. I found this a difficult situation to talk about but there are doctors that understand. I wish all the best :)

[MrsN1984]

I'm currently going through the hell that is requesting an ELCS. My issues are the current issues/urgency/embarrassment that comes with IBS.
I'm terrified of having a tear that further complicates things.
Been brushed off once already being told that a 'natural' birth is far safer &
that the risk of tearing is so small.
I can't believe the horrors you've all been through - thank you for sharing though as I feel a bit more confident about fighting my case x

[Blondiemama]

Thank you so much for posting this OP. I had 3b tear 8 months ago now and everyday I'm still angry and still suffering the consequences.
Like Vert said really well, this is something which certainly the majority of my GPs don't know how to deal with and it's not spoken about and treated with the attention that it needs.
I think I feel more angry because I asked for a c-section (fr health reasons) and was brushed off and pooh poohed and actually if I'd had one I wouldn't have half the problems and feel as violated and disgusting as I do now.

[thomasstockmann]

I very much relate to what VertdeTerre says. I think there is a general lack of awareness of serious obstetric injuries and because of that some people (including some healthcare professionals) keep talking as if our birth experiences were average and that all mothers go through this. All mothers experience some form of trauma. But depending on the level of trauma and recovery/rehabilitation (I keep saying this to surgeons- I am going through rehabilitation, not recovery) the emotional impact will be very different.
Psychologically, I know from family and friends' experiences that ANY birth can be traumatic. Physically however there is in my view a difference between not being referred to urogyneacology and colorectal departments and being referred there and spending the first year of your baby's life in and out of hospital.
At around three months postpartum (and after uncovering the horror of my injuries) I felt very angry. I felt I had been assaulted and that my body had been mutilated. My anger also seemed to focus on celebrities coming out of hospital, posing for photos and miraculously walking well. ALL women on maternity wards either walk like cowboys (vaginal birth) or slouching forward and moving very slowly (c-section).
As well as talking (a lot), I felt a strong need to do something positive. So I spent some time writing to websites and organisations to try to make them talk about obstetric injuries. It's probably not changed things a great deal but I felt I had to do something.
Not sure why I'm writing all this. I suppose I hope you will feel validated in your experiences and emotions. I do feel for you and hope some resolution will come.

[DoesntLeftoverTurkeySoupDragOn]

I don't harbour anger, nor did I feel upset. I didn't even feel any sadness at missing the first 2 hours of DS1s life - I was pretty shell shocked anyway so there was better bonding time later and he spent that time with his father. I don't feel any differently about him/his birth than I do about DS2 or DD.

He is 16 now and all that is completely irrelevant :)

[Innocuoususername]

Also, as I always say on threads about this, I think it's a shame this is not talked about more. It is a horrible shock to many women that their bodies can be damaged in this way. I think a lot of the feelings of shame, disgust etc could be reduced if it was discussed more. I have been known to overshare in the pursuit of this cause

[Innocuoususername]

I have similar issues to you OP after a 3c tear with DC1. I still feel sad that I missed those early hours, that feeding was harder than it needed to be (effects of blood transfusion) and that it took 5 months to recover.

But I can't get that time back, and there's no sense dwelling on that. I have rehashed what could have been done differently, and come to the conclusion that I did my best under the circumstances, as did my medical team. I feel lucky in a way that I have recovered bar some small issues, and that DC1 was delivered without any harm to him. I was fortunate to have good follow up care from my hospital though, and it does make me angry that care for birth injuries is so patchy.

I have since had DC2 by ELCS, and I found that birth incredibly healing. It was beautiful and calm, everything that my first labour was not! Not necessarily suggesting another baby is the solution though I only felt ready to start trying at about 18mo, the thought horrified me before that.